Interesting article ... or am I late to the party AGAIN? 
Tesla Beating Detroit? That's Just Nonsense - Forbes
Tesla Beating Detroit? That's Just Nonsense - Forbes
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Lutz can be an idiot sometimes and this article is, in typical Lutzian style, overly dramatic. However, he makes a valid point. Namely that Tesla has lots of orders for cars but until they've delivered cars to many people and been profitable for several years there really is no case to be made for them being "better" than GM.
I think the point that Mr. Lutz is trying to make with this club-of-an-article is that 10,000 preorders are great, but that's not 10,000 sales and even 10,000 sales is bubkis compared to what GM sells worldwide in a month.
I think the point that Mr. Lutz is trying to make with this club-of-an-article is that 10,000 preorders are great, but that's not 10,000 sales and even 10,000 sales is bubkis compared to what GM sells worldwide in a month.
My interpretation...
Adam: Tesla is embarrassing -- "Beating" -- the established automakers in technological innovation and open-minded thinking.
Bob: Tesla is still an experiment until they have delivered (a) market-significant volume and (b) year-over-year profitability.
Merge their perspectives and the result is accurate, IMO.
Adam: Tesla is embarrassing -- "Beating" -- the established automakers in technological innovation and open-minded thinking.
Bob: Tesla is still an experiment until they have delivered (a) market-significant volume and (b) year-over-year profitability.
Merge their perspectives and the result is accurate, IMO.
I am with Adam. This is just nay sayer 101. First they said you can't even build an electric car. Then when Elon makes one, they say that's just a concept. Fine, Elon says I'll make a sedan too. Then they say yeah but you can't make a bunch of it. .... And round and round we go. Until one day Bob realizes he's just an old grumpy dude with no vision or ambition to improve anything and got caught sleepin' at the wheel... pun intended.
Grumpy. In denial. Political. Needless.
He has a point that Tesla has a tiny market share right now. The question is, will it stay that way? Tesla is introducing a disruptive technology...
He has a point that Tesla has a tiny market share right now. The question is, will it stay that way? Tesla is introducing a disruptive technology...
Citizen-T
Active Member
Lutz and Elon like each other very much, a lot of journalists like to try to make more of a competitive relationship between them than I think there really is from seeing them together. I think it just sells better. That said, Lutz calls them like he sees them, just because he is friendly with you doesn't mean he won't tell you how it is.
If you haven't seen them interact before: Charlie Rose - Robert A. Lutz & Elon Musk
If you haven't seen them interact before: Charlie Rose - Robert A. Lutz & Elon Musk
He is afraid because I gues he is not exactlystupid.
When you know you are way better than the opponent you play nice and deliver a mountain of compliments.
When you know the opponent is in much better position you are inclined to make it small this way or other.
Value lies in the future. Always. Thats what a share price mean. GM is a dinosaur going the dinosaur way. Tesla is a new species, a mamal about to conquer the world.
When Tesla is selling a milion units a year, GM will only be selling 10k trucks. Lutz knows this.
Citizen-T
Active Member
I think you underestimate Lutz. I'm sure he has no intention of dying with the dinosaurs. Unfortunately, he is only a consultant at GM these days, so he has little power to save them. I wouldn't be surprised to see him join Tesla at some point in the future. As a shareholder, I'd welcome it; he really is a great car guy...and would keep everyone there grounded.
PeterSZ
Electrified petrolhead
From 'discarded' this sentence starts being false and it shows that the writers/critics do not understand that for the larger part Model S buyers really see where automobility should go in the future. They do not realise that most Model S owners will be active ambassadors for Tesla, the Model S and electric mobility. Sure 10,000 cars sold is nothing for GM (or BMW), but that is making the wrong comparison. For a new carcompany bringing a new concept to the market and who's customers have not been able to drive this car or even see it, IT IS very promising to have 10,000 paid reservations. Has GM ever had that for a new model?? Hell no. And last but not least, Lutz is probably one of the biggest Petrolheads in history, so what would you expect to hear from him? The noise coming from all the existing carmakers are all so predictable it is really getting very very boring. It's a miracle that they still exist, with such an ultraconservatism. We'll see who was right and who was wrong, in a decade or so. I'm buying TSLA stock.
GM could beat Tesla if they wanted to. They have the capital, the engineers, the factories, and the world-wide distribution network. The poor quality of GM cars and the ICE technology they use are choices that GM top executives make. Quality control methods are well understood. You spend money on quality control and you get more reliable cars. Or you cut corners and maximize profits. ICE cars are more profitable. GM maximizes profits in order to pay the top decision makers obscene bonuses plus salaries. They push gas guzzlers because they are more profitable. And they don't have to worry about being competitive because the government bails them out when they fail, in spite of (or perhaps because of) cutting costs on quality and building poor-quality gas-guzzlers.
Put the top GM execs in prison and replace them with environmentalists and in short order Tesla will have insurmountable competition.
It's all about choices. Elon Musk chooses to build quality, sustainable cars. The crooks who run GM choose to build expensive garbage and rob the company to stuff their own pockets.
Tesla has demonstrated a new technology. They have constructed a factory capable of enough production to have profit potential. They have a reasonable chance of becoming one of the big boys in auto manufacturing in a decade or two. They are a start-up company with real potential. Their threat to GM and the other old-school companies is prospective, not yet realized. I'm holding my shares for the long term. I expect great things from Tesla.
Put the top GM execs in prison and replace them with environmentalists and in short order Tesla will have insurmountable competition.
It's all about choices. Elon Musk chooses to build quality, sustainable cars. The crooks who run GM choose to build expensive garbage and rob the company to stuff their own pockets.
Tesla has demonstrated a new technology. They have constructed a factory capable of enough production to have profit potential. They have a reasonable chance of becoming one of the big boys in auto manufacturing in a decade or two. They are a start-up company with real potential. Their threat to GM and the other old-school companies is prospective, not yet realized. I'm holding my shares for the long term. I expect great things from Tesla.
bonnie
I play a nice person on twitter.
Wild idea. I like it. I'm just not sure he could fully let go of 'but that's the way it's always been done' thinking. But I like it.
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