M3P to MX 16-18?

[Infinus]

Tempted to trade in my 21 M3P in for something that can fit the whole family. A 7 seat MY was on my mind but the lack of rear AC vents in 3rd row pretty much rules that out. I'm trying not to get into spending too much over where I already am. This was supposed to be my occasional drive to work and keep it in the garage car but quickly being the use it for everything car and the minivan sits in the garage only used when we have 6 passengers.

I've been eying a 16 90D or a 18 75D that are in the 65-72k range. What am I looking at "losing" by stepping back to an older model year x? Is the newer 18 with the smaller pack the better bet? Some things floating in my head:

MCU1 or MCU2
No sentry on 2016
No 1 pedal driving on non raven?
Door reliability?
Limited supercharging speed? When is this a factor.
Range 250 vs 315 on M3P
Anything to look out for? (yellowing screen?)

 

[ngng]

Tempted to trade in my 21 M3P in for something that can fit the whole family. A 7 seat MY was on my mind but the lack of rear AC vents in 3rd row pretty much rules that out. I'm trying not to get into spending too much over where I already am. This was supposed to be my occasional drive to work and keep it in the garage car but quickly being the use it for everything car and the minivan sits in the garage only used when we have 6 passengers.

I've been eying a 16 90D or a 18 75D that are in the 65-72k range. What am I looking at "losing" by stepping back to an older model year x? Is the newer 18 with the smaller pack the better bet? Some things floating in my head:

MCU1 or MCU2
No sentry on 2016
No 1 pedal driving on non raven?
Door reliability?
Limited supercharging speed? When is this a factor.
Range 250 vs 315 on M3P
Anything to look out for? (yellowing screen?)

My thoughts:
- MCU can be upgraded and will address the screen yellowing
- Sentry isn't very useful
- Doors are slow, and have issues opening after they've been sitting in direct sunlight and the sensors have overheated (supposedly there is a service bulletin for this)
- No 1 pedal driving, but not really a big deal IMO. You'll never have stuck calipers from lack of use.
- SC is slower, but I've never thought it was an issue on road trips.
- X is much less efficient than the 3. I would look for a 100D over a 90D, and would not even consider a 75D unless you are only doing local driving and plug in at home all the time
- You won't see 250 range on a used car with degradation
- AP1 will give you, IMO, the most useful AP system and will always be radar based
- Make sure you have a warranty, Tesla or otherwise

 

[Bigriver]

I've been eying a 16 90D or a 18 75D that are in the 65-72k range. What am I looking at "losing" by stepping back to an older model year x? Is the newer 18 with the smaller pack the better bet? Some things floating in my head:

MCU1 or MCU2
No sentry on 2016
No 1 pedal driving on non raven?
Door reliability?
Limited supercharging speed? When is this a factor.
Range 250 vs 315 on M3P
Anything to look out for? (yellowing screen?)

I have a 2018 AWD M3 and a 2017 100D MX. not your exact comparison basis, but a few thoughts on what it feels to go from a 3 to a pre-Raven X.

I wouldn’t even think about an older X for a split second if these cars were stuck with MCU1. It would literally take 5 minutes for navigation to reroute, on top of myriads of other issues. So if you find one still on MCU1, budget for the MCU2 upgrade.

Sentry mode, even with the MCU2 upgrade, doesn’t have all the same features. Like, you won’t have the remote camera from the app option.

You are correct, 1 pedal driving did not retrofit back to the pre-Ravens. But regen is good, and using the brake is just the last few mph. I really don’t notice the difference.

My falcon wing doors have had 100% reliability. My auto presenting drivers door has had a couple of issues in the first year. None after that.

Peak supercharging speed is less on the legacy X, and I believe 75D and 90D may have even slower speeds than my 100D. For me it’s not a big deal - extends a typical stop by about 5-10 min when I’m charging to 60% or 70% to get to the next SC. I do feel the time difference if I’m needing to go to 90% or above.

The degraded range on either of the possibilities you mentioned is going to put you down in the low 200’s rated miles. And of course actual miles are usually less, sometimes much less. I do have to say, though, that my Model X now sometimes gets actual miles that equal the rated miles on long trips during the summer. Best I can hope for on my model 3 is about 90% (same roads, similar conditions). So I don’t notice any range difference between my current 275 rated miles on the MX vs my current 295 rated miles on the M3.

Yellowing screen was fixed for me with Tesla’s UV treatment and it hasn’t come back. Also, if on satellite view, it isn’t very noticeable anyway.

Other random thoughts:

• As far as I know, all versions of the MX can have a shudder when doing a hard acceleration (like when merging into a highway.) That has been fixed twice for me, and the last time, about 10k-15k miles ago, is still good so far.
• The MX feels infinitely clunkier than the M3, and does not have as modern of a feel inside. The layout of the console and cupholders is much worse on the MX. I go through spurts of being bothered by the dinosaur feeling. But ultimately I do prefer the 2 screens, I find physical air vents helpful, and if I had to pick only one Tesla to keep it would be the MX.
• When shopping for older MX’s, be aware that a lot of features used to be alacarte, and what got bundled as the Premium Upgrade Package changed over time. If there is something important to you, verify the car has it. For example, my car has the PUP but does not have the winter package nor the premium stereo. Not all MX’s have the auto-presenting front door.

 

[ngng]

Peak supercharging speed is less on the legacy X, and I believe 75D and 90D may have even slower speeds than my 100D.

Yeah, for sure slower because the max capacity is lower. So, just looking at a "quick" charge from 10-80% is going to yield less total energy.

Not all MX’s have the auto-presenting front door.

I did not know that. Crazy! Not that they work well...lol

 

[Infinus]

My thoughts:
- MCU can be upgraded and will address the screen yellowing
- Sentry isn't very useful
- Doors are slow, and have issues opening after they've been sitting in direct sunlight and the sensors have overheated (supposedly there is a service bulletin for this)
- No 1 pedal driving, but not really a big deal IMO. You'll never have stuck calipers from lack of use.
- SC is slower, but I've never thought it was an issue on road trips.
- X is much less efficient than the 3. I would look for a 100D over a 90D, and would not even consider a 75D unless you are only doing local driving and plug in at home all the time
- You won't see 250 range on a used car with degradation
- AP1 will give you, IMO, the most useful AP system and will always be radar based
- Make sure you have a warranty, Tesla or otherwise

Thank you for the feedback!

I am doing only local driving and plug in at home daily. Roadtrips would probably still be relegated to the gas car. The dashcam feature has been useful several times moreso than sentry mode.

I have a 2018 AWD M3 and a 2017 100D MX. not your exact comparison basis, but a few thoughts on what it feels to go from a 3 to a pre-Raven X.

I wouldn’t even think about an older X for a split second if these cars were stuck with MCU1. It would literally take 5 minutes for navigation to reroute, on top of myriads of other issues. So if you find one still on MCU1, budget for the MCU2 upgrade.

Sentry mode, even with the MCU2 upgrade, doesn’t have all the same features. Like, you won’t have the remote camera from the app option.

You are correct, 1 pedal driving did not retrofit back to the pre-Ravens. But regen is good, and using the brake is just the last few mph. I really don’t notice the difference.

My falcon wing doors have had 100% reliability. My auto presenting drivers door has had a couple of issues in the first year. None after that.

Peak supercharging speed is less on the legacy X, and I believe 75D and 90D may have even slower speeds than my 100D. For me it’s not a big deal - extends a typical stop by about 5-10 min when I’m charging to 60% or 70% to get to the next SC. I do feel the time difference if I’m needing to go to 90% or above.

The degraded range on either of the possibilities you mentioned is going to put you down in the low 200’s rated miles. And of course actual miles are usually less, sometimes much less. I do have to say, though, that my Model X now sometimes gets actual miles that equal the rated miles on long trips during the summer. Best I can hope for on my model 3 is about 90% (same roads, similar conditions). So I don’t notice any range difference between my current 275 rated miles on the MX vs my current 295 rated miles on the M3.

Yellowing screen was fixed for me with Tesla’s UV treatment and it hasn’t come back. Also, if on satellite view, it isn’t very noticeable anyway.

Other random thoughts:

• As far as I know, all versions of the MX can have a shudder when doing a hard acceleration (like when merging into a highway.) That has been fixed twice for me, and the last time, about 10k-15k miles ago, is still good so far.
• The MX feels infinitely clunkier than the M3, and does not have as modern of a feel inside. The layout of the console and cupholders is much worse on the MX. I go through spurts of being bothered by the dinosaur feeling. But ultimately I do prefer the 2 screens, I find physical air vents helpful, and if I had to pick only one Tesla to keep it would be the MX.
• When shopping for older MX’s, be aware that a lot of features used to be alacarte, and what got bundled as the Premium Upgrade Package changed over time. If there is something important to you, verify the car has it. For example, my car has the PUP but does not have the winter package nor the premium stereo. Not all MX’s have the auto-presenting front door.

Thank you that was helpful!

The remote camera I don't care for as much especially since there is no audio. Mostly for the security cam/dash cam footage. Where does the USB live in the x?

I've read about the shudder, what causes that?

 

[gangzoom]

Our 2017 75D X is coming up to 5 years old now. Its had the MCU2 retrofit, and here in Europe the CCS charger/adaptor work done.

The MCU2 update has been great, both screens were replaced (no yellowing border), and all functions work except for remote sentry cam viewing.

Door realibity has been fine, infact the first time I tried to get into a Y I just stood there wondering what on earth was wrong with the Y as the doors just wasn't opening .

Even our non raven X will pretty much come to a stop without pressing the brake pedal - slows to about 1-2mph.

The 'shudder' issues have been solved for a few years now. Tesla will/should have updated the front motor mounts on all cars.

At 70mph efficiency is about 3 miles per kWh, which is clearly less than the 3, but for a car the size of the X it's quite amazing......The size/utility of the X is something the 3(even Y) struggles to match.

Personally I love massive windscreen of our X, and this summer we are going on a road trip with 6 people in the car whilst still taking a decent amount of luggage.

We could actually swap our X for a Y with zero cost. Yes the Y has a newer infotainment computer and more range, but after 60k+ miles in our X the only car I would replace it with is another X.

 

[ngng]

The 'shudder' issues have been solved for a few years now. Tesla will/should have updated the front motor mounts on all cars.

Shudder has NOT been solved.

 

[gangzoom]

Shudder has NOT been solved.

It HAS on our car, after motor mount replacements.

 

[ngng]

It HAS on our car, after motor mount replacements.

They updated the clevis mount, but it does not solve the root cause which is an inherent design flaw with the X. The refreshed Xs are also experiencing shudder.

 

[gangzoom]

They updated the clevis mount, but it does not solve the root cause which is an inherent design flaw with the X. The refreshed Xs are also experiencing shudder.

As I've said we have NO SHUDDER on our car at WOT after the mounts were changed.

I cannot comment on your car, all I can report is the experience I have.

 

[jboy210]

2018 x75 is good value. After March 15 or so they had MCU2. Also, they could be configured with Enhanced Auto Pilot which does most of what people need from Autopilot day to day (lane change on indicator, ramps between freeways, etc.)

 

[EbS-P]

I think most relevant points have been covered. MCU 1 won’t do FSD beta yet (will it ever?) I’m concerned about maintenance. Nearest service center is 150 miles away.

How big is the family and how far and for how many days are you packing for those trips? We have had our 2016 MtX for 2 months now and love it. The deal was too go to pass up. It’s not a minivan full stop. Doesn’t turn as sharp or hold nearly enough. We have a 6 seat X and a family of 7. Works most of the time right now as #7 is just 7 weeks old.

I’ve never driven a 3 or Y but I get the desire to upsize. The X isn’t large like a minivan or suburban. It’s unique and there real isn’t anything to compare it to. That’s the reason to get it. Not 3rd row AC IMO. It’s not a people mover. It’s a mid sized luxury SUV with more emphasis on the luxury part than the UV part.

Just my thoughts

 

[Infinus]

I think most relevant points have been covered. MCU 1 won’t do FSD beta yet (will it ever?) I’m concerned about maintenance. Nearest service center is 150 miles away.

How big is the family and how far and for how many days are you packing for those trips? We have had our 2016 MtX for 2 months now and love it. The deal was too go to pass up. It’s not a minivan full stop. Doesn’t turn as sharp or hold nearly enough. We have a 6 seat X and a family of 7. Works most of the time right now as #7 is just 7 weeks old.

I’ve never driven a 3 or Y but I get the desire to upsize. The X isn’t large like a minivan or suburban. It’s unique and there real isn’t anything to compare it to. That’s the reason to get it. Not 3rd row AC IMO. It’s not a people mover. It’s a mid sized luxury SUV with more emphasis on the luxury part than the UV part.

Just my thoughts

Currently family is 6 with 3 still in car seats so the only time we don’t take the 3 is when we go somewhere as the whole family. 1-2x a week.

Eventually plan is to also have the in laws with us and then we will be 8 but if I trade the x that will get us most places and then get a large 8 passenger suv that can tow a trailer for camping and use that for when we need to lug all of us or super long trips with lots of luggage. The model 3 works 90% of time time for now but it would be nice to fit the whole family minus in-laws in the more economical car especially if we end up moving to a new area where our commute will be a bit longer.

 

[EbS-P]

Currently family is 6 with 3 still in car seats so the only time we don’t take the 3 is when we go somewhere as the whole family. 1-2x a week.

Eventually plan is to also have the in laws with us and then we will be 8 but if I trade the x that will get us most places and then get a large 8 passenger suv that can tow a trailer for camping and use that for when we need to lug all of us or super long trips with lots of luggage. The model 3 works 90% of time time for now but it would be nice to fit the whole family minus in-laws in the more economical car especially if we end up moving to a new area where our commute will be a bit longer.

We have the 6 seater. With The only place we cat fit a rear facing seat is right the passenger side. And my wife is 5’1” so the front seat is pretty far forward. I’m 6” and definitely would be more comfortable if I could slide my seat back further but the third row is really tight so everyone has to compromise. We can get a booster in the 3rd row but nothing more. I watched all the YouTube vids on model X and car seats. They definitely were optimistic. I’m going to quote myself here. I don’t see the X as being an economical choice. Tires cost me 1500$ and if I’m lucky will get 20k miles on. Front axles need replaced at 25k miles. The fix is probably a 2k$ plus suspension kit.

It’s a terrible time to buy a car M3p value is up but the X is up even more. There will be true 7-8 seater BEVs out in the future. If I needed to had upgrade today ford transit 350 with the eco boost V6 (a used Nissan nv 3500 would work to) and keep my electric sedan. Toyotas hybrid sequoia is enticing who knows when you could actually get one. The Sienna hybrid is too but it won’t tow a anything more that a pop up trailer and then it better not be the biggest ones.

There is not an electric car for large 6+ families that will cover 100% of your needs. 90% of the time is as good as it gets. Just my thoughts.

I have had 2017 P100d for 2 months now. Private party sale where we knew the previous owner. The first thing I did was look at the tires yep need replacements ASAP 24k miles don’t know if they were the original tires. And then see if has the shudder. Yep it does. It will need addressed. I found a tire shop that would align it and sell me tires. 1500$ out the door. Get your home charging now. I got the wall connector with 20A 240v. It is fine and will charge a 10-12 miles per hour. It can be plugged in for 10 hours a day.

I bang my head in to the falcon doors every week getting littl kids in and out. They are cool. As the guy in the parking told me as I was rubbing the bump i just got and he witnessed. It’s not a minivan. It’s not an SUV. It’s a Model X. What other vehicle can it really compare to?

Get it for what it is, a used luxury BEV. Things will need fixed software updates will happen for better or worse.

Evan

 

[Infinus]

We have the 6 seater. With The only place we cat fit a rear facing seat is right the passenger side. And my wife is 5’1” so the front seat is pretty far forward. I’m 6” and definitely would be more comfortable if I could slide my seat back further but the third row is really tight so everyone has to compromise. We can get a booster in the 3rd row but nothing more. I watched all the YouTube vids on model X and car seats. They definitely were optimistic. I’m going to quote myself here. I don’t see the X as being an economical choice. Tires cost me 1500$ and if I’m lucky will get 20k miles on. Front axles need replaced at 25k miles. The fix is probably a 2k$ plus suspension kit.

It’s a terrible time to buy a car M3p value is up but the X is up even more. There will be true 7-8 seater BEVs out in the future. If I needed to had upgrade today ford transit 350 with the eco boost V6 (a used Nissan nv 3500 would work to) and keep my electric sedan. Toyotas hybrid sequoia is enticing who knows when you could actually get one. The Sienna hybrid is too but it won’t tow a anything more that a pop up trailer and then it better not be the biggest ones.

There is not an electric car for large 6+ families that will cover 100% of your needs. 90% of the time is as good as it gets. Just my thoughts.

I’m passed the rear facing stage on all of them but still have a couple more years till the second oldest one gets out of his booster seat. At this point it is all about compromises for that 10% scenario because even suburbans and the like are not large enough for 8 plus luggage. I mean a suburban is 225 inches what would really be ideal is an SUV version in something the size of a Ram 2500 crew cab long bed at 261 inches now make it an EV under 100k and I’d be in heaven . I just can’t bring myself to do a transit van.

I’m a gearhead and I’ve had about 27 different vehicles in the 21 years. I love everything with wheels! Lifted, slammed, electric or with a carburetor I love it all. I usually don’t like to wait for tomorrow for the next best thing I usually buy now and buy that next thing when it comes out. Thanks for your input it’s appreciated

 

[EbS-P]

I’m passed the rear facing stage on all of them but still have a couple more years till the second oldest one gets out of his booster seat. At this point it is all about compromises for that 10% scenario because even suburbans and the like are not large enough for 8 plus luggage. I mean a suburban is 225 inches what would really be ideal is an SUV version in something the size of a Ram 2500 crew cab long bed at 261 inches now make it an EV under 100k and I’d be in heaven . I just can’t bring myself to do a transit van.

I’m a gearhead and I’ve had about 27 different vehicles in the 21 years. I love everything with wheels! Lifted, slammed, electric or with a carburetor I love it all. I usually don’t like to wait for tomorrow for the next best thing I usually buy now and buy that next thing when it comes out. Thanks for your input it’s appreciated

Ford Transit Trail closer to U.S. launch with trademark application?

Ford is making leisurely chess moves when it comes to bringing the Transit Trail to the U.S. The automaker's European branch launched the rugged van in June

www.autoblog.com

Ford may be trying to win some people over. Quigley 4x4 Nissan NV used to the top of my list. Not sure now.