Welcome to Tesla Motors Club
Discuss Tesla's Model S, Model 3, Model X, Model Y, Cybertruck, Roadster and More.
Register

Market politics

This site may earn commission on affiliate links.
Status
Not open for further replies.
How would Tesla be impacted if ww3 breaks out over this Syria debacle and Russia gets involved with US? I am sitting on some other stocks and contemplating of cashing out and even taking a few losses to get ready to buy back in on Tesla in case it gets impacted with geopolitical activities. I wouldn't think Tesla would get affected as much by that type of scenario, but curious to hear thoughts on this as it seems something is brewing over war...

There are never guarantees when talking about war or predicting the stock market, especially on a day by day basis. As with anything there are contingent factors (the recent MX crash or assassination of the Arch Duke Ferdinand setting off a cascade of events leading to WWI) or structural factors (like the rigidity of Bismarck's alliance system), or better, a hybrid like that system without Bismarck around to manage it.

Some contingent factors include the Trump effect, the Putin effect, and whether some structural changes, including technology are helpful or hurtful. BFO!

The current hotspots include Iran, Korea, Syria, ISIS/Daesh, climate change, and cyberwar, because in a way the Russian influence on our system is profound and not over. I don't know of anyone except perhaps John Bolton (who has been on the job, formally, for only three days) wants war of any kind. Unfortunately a shooting world war three is thinkable but not deadly for everyone unless nuclear weapons are used. Also unfortunate is that no one can predict that nuclear weapons won't be used, or won't be used by accident. There are many cases when an initial nuclear exchange was stopped by a patriot on the Russian side—don't remember that scenario—or by a known drunk, Yel'tsin. His military mistakenly advised him a US nuclear attack was imminent even though the weather satellite test in Norway—which they had been alerted about weeks in advance and then near to the event!!—was the real cause of the alarm.

So in other world lines WWIII has already happened, not ours, yet.

I know the NRA won't like this, but some weapons should always be kept out of human hands. That is why it has been suggested as a stop gap measure, the President's nuclear football should be activated only after killing the guy with the key mounted internally near the heart of the bearer with a sword or scalpel carried with him at all times. Mind you, the president must be the one who performs the execution.

Let me give a homely example. Perhaps a 17 year-old should not be permitted to buy an assault rifle, let alone give a single man the power to wage nuclear war. Anyone who would want that job should be declared insane ipso facto because an urge to such power makes them ineligible to hold the office. But I digress.

The Trump Effect

The ghost of Nixon who invented the mad-man theory of the presidency may be alive today, we don't know. [See details above.] His presidency caused our military to take the extraordinary step of collaboration to remove him from office or at least control any unwanted military action. There was a rumor that Tillerson, McMaster, Mattis and Kelly had pledged all to resign should any one be fired by Trump. That hasn't happened. Mattis is the only one standing and Kelly has been neutered or will be replaced (by Mulvaney?), any time. Our military is schooled to refuse unlawful orders. No wonder in its infinite wisdom Congress changed our motto from e pluribus unum (which might be useful now) to "In God We Trust."

Cooling Trump, Advantage China

This thread is divided on whether Trump's tweets and bluster are to be taken seriously or that their worst sound is really only a negotiating first step. I was frightened by his approach to Korea but have admitted, see above, he may have stimulated President Xi to more overtly take advantage of America's decision to abdicate world leadership. That President has schooled Kim, thus smoothing the way toward reconciliation between North and South, is consistent with Moon's campaign. The U.S. can join in, or not; I think this crisis is over or soon will be.

President Xi has also masterfully taken charge of Trump's tariff tantrum and steered it, hopefully, into the normal diplomatic channels. Structurally, as far as China is concerned, there are ways to both flatter Trump, as do his supporters here, and yet achieve mutually acceptable results.

The Putin Effect and the Middle East, Advantage Russia

[Gotto go, the dinner bell is ringing. More later, unless you're already asleep.]


Notes:

Assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand of Austria - Wikipedia

How has Bismarck escaped most of the blame for the first world war?
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: neroden
I'm not worried about Syria...

The US shouldn't be worried of anyone :
bi_graphics_millitary-budget-compare-chart-2.png
 
Anyone car to guess the cost of...... say one Aircraft carrier battle group? (about 30 billion give or take)
https://www.quora.com/How-much-does-a-carrier-strike-group-cost

How many battle groups do we have? (10 with 1 more on the way)

I can hear the Bolton's of the world saying "we need to be able to protect our vital national interest's" When the entire world is your Vital National interest this is what you end up with.
 
  • Like
Reactions: replicant
That may partially reflect how inefficiently we spend our military budget.

I don't know but

How much stronger is the US military compared with the next strongest power?

China has less than 500 Type 99 tanks, that have just been developed, and are not even close to being as good as the Abrams. US have 8,700 Abrams.

The US have 10 aircraft carriers. The good kind. Everyone else has 10. Combined. And they are mostly small ships that can launch helicopters.

There are 8,400 attack helicopters in the world. The U.S. has 6,400 of them

US own all the satellites that guide GPS systems. We have all the advanced stealth technology. The latest sensors? U.S. The latest information systems? U.S. An Abrams tank can see a target, the tank commander can instantly send that target to every tank in his company.
 
I don't know but

How much stronger is the US military compared with the next strongest power?

China has less than 500 Type 99 tanks, that have just been developed, and are not even close to being as good as the Abrams. US have 8,700 Abrams.

The US have 10 aircraft carriers. The good kind. Everyone else has 10. Combined. And they are mostly small ships that can launch helicopters.

There are 8,400 attack helicopters in the world. The U.S. has 6,400 of them

US own all the satellites that guide GPS systems. We have all the advanced stealth technology. The latest sensors? U.S. The latest information systems? U.S. An Abrams tank can see a target, the tank commander can instantly send that target to every tank in his company.
So we as a country have to decide...do we need more? If having an underwhelming advantage is good wouldn't having even more be better?

Or perhaps we can't really afford to have 10/20 times more than anyone else.
 
US own all the satellites that guide GPS systems.
While technically correct, this statement ignores the three other mostly operational GNSS systems. Most recent GPS receivers can actually work off at least Galilleo. GLONASS (Russian system) is fully operational, the others should be finished by 2020 (but work to some extent already).
 
  • Like
Reactions: Intl Professor
Sorry for another long post about matters which no one else seems to be interested in. If it's any consolation, think about how many students did not have a boring button.

Any comments should be properly posted on the Market Politics thread but investors, including myself, have overreacted to the threat of nuclear war. That over-reaction and two recent political events are sure to stir macro volatility in the markets come Monday.

War Threat

As I said on the MP thread, the North Korean problem is on track to resolution thanks to President Xi, some would say, also, President Trump. So don’t worry about that for at least a month.

Regarding Syria we have other good signs, but no clarity on resolution in the direction of peace. First, I should apologize for being wrong about the concern I expressed on the MP thread about Trump’s tweet (the missiles are coming). The wisdom of tweeter diplomacy is debatable. However, informally it was absolutely necessary to warn the Russians of continuing our policy of not directly engaging Russia militarily anywhere. My dislike of Trump overran simple strategic logic in military engagements.

For two good signs about next steps, see Nikki Haley’s speech at the UN Security Council today. Her use, and focus on the UN, was a brilliant denunciation of Russian perfidy, though her “lock and loaded” threat to Asad must have been a necessary nod to hawks both outside and within the administration. (Conflict within is reported to have been furious.) The other good sign is the positive effect of collusion between our government and the Russians. See here:

Limited US action against Syria suggests conflict unlikely to escalate

The approach of Defense Secretary Mattis seems to have prevailed over the more hawkish views of National Security Advisor Bolton. But US restraint suggests a further collusion than speculation about the 2016 campaign. Both sides’ military advisors have a mutual interest in restraining the more impulsive moves by their respective presidents.

That collusion is probably not direct, but it is a natural tendency of the militaries of both sides to avoid war by professionals who should know more about it than others. (Nonetheless, history is strewn with examples where military strategies have gone wrong—e.g., the Maginot Line thinking in France’s case, and the long-run idiocy of Hitler’s Operation Barbarossa.) There is a history of positive collaboration among strategic thinkers. One striking illustration is U.S. sharing of fail-safe technology. After a crash near Atlanta where five out off six safety devices on our nuclear weapons failed, the Kennedy Administration shared improved technology with the Soviet Union. Another great example is the way the US and the Soviet Union beat back any challenges to their version of the of the Non-Proliferation Treaty. Our allies and any others at the ENDC talks in Geneva never had a chance but to agree.

There is slim but similar restraint by Russia’s military on Putin in reports a lot of fighting against our allies in Syria’s Civil War is by mercenary armies paid by Putin’s buddy-oligarch, “The Chef.” That "buffer" provides some security against direct conflict and there was no retaliation by the Russians when our military bombed the **sugar** out of the mercenaries when they attacked our troops recently.

Michael Cohen Case

Scheduled Monday is a hearing concerning the validity of warrants for sudden search and seizure versus less stringent search (Cohen’s concern) and Mr. Trump’s argument about attorney/client privilege. Friday we learned the Department of Justice warrant revealed the Stormy Daniels’ matter is not privileged because of Trump’s declaration on Air Force One that he knew nothing about it and had no idea what Cohen was doing. If he’s not involved in this, no discussion, no privilege. The Justice warrant has many redactions, according to reports, but nothing clear about why there might be concern justifying such an extreme measure. There is another hint of what might have been included in secret to the magistrate issuing the warrants. Evidence of lying about a visit to Prague.

For a short take, Mueller can prove Cohen made secret trip to Prague before the election: report

The report is based on a McClatchy article which is lengthy but a good summary. Aside from the political bombshell, at the end is some juicy innuendo. Cohen’s wife is from Ukraine which could provide an innocent connection or there could be something else.

By the bye, as an “extinguished” Sovietologist I can certify “family relations” was an old phrase, even after Stalin, for suspicious and corrupt relations with and among citizens and government organizations. Think “Iron Triangles” and our defense spending.

Sources: Mueller has evidence Cohen was in Prague in 2016, confirming part of dossier

Fire away, but not here!

Edit by author: Extinguish the "Fire away...!" above. This piece was moved by mod to this more appropriate thread. Please fire at will here.
 
Last edited:
Military industrial complex. If only we had a leader who warned us a more than a half century ago.

I like Ike too, but he let go the CIA and MI-6 plan overthrowing the democratic elected, secular government of Iran by re-installing the Shah as leader of the country rather than remain a figure-head monarch. In 1979 the CIA predicted the precise day students would take over our embassy in Tehran if the Shah were to enter the US as he did, ostensibly for medical treatment available only here. One of the Rockefeller hospitals flew a Canadian doctor to NYC for removal of the deposed monarch's gall bladder.

However, unlike Carter, Ike was not a creature of David Rockefeller's Trilateral Commission. Iron triangles are only the exposed ribs of the power structure in this country. A complete description is more complicated. There are hairs within spores and epicycles upon epicycles.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.