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Massachusetts EV Fuel Cost Savings

Discussion in 'New England' started by North75, Jun 15, 2018.

  1. North75

    North75 Member

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    I ran across this chart in an article today:

    https://www.energy.gov/eere/vehicles/articles/fotw-1033-june-11-2018-washington-state-has-greatest-fuel-cost-savings?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=newsletter_axiosgenerate&stream=top

    Kind of depressing that Massachusetts has the second lowest average savings for EV drivers over gas after Hawaii.
    This is obviously because of the expensive electricity here.

    I'm picking up my model 3 today and I have to admit that the cost of energy wasn't really a concern for me, but it would be nice if Massachusetts did more to make EV's more economical which would encourage more adoption. I know we have the MOR-EV program which is great, but in my case that basically covers the cost of installing a charger in my garage.

    It would be nice if the state mandated that the power companies offer discounted nighttime EV charging rates.
    We have Eversource where I live. I know they offer a TOU plan which offers lower rates for all of your electricity usage at night, but my wife works from home so we still have usage during the day. The daytime rates are high enough that I estimate I wouldn't save any money.
    What I really want is a way to separately meter the car charger and get EV rates for that and keep basic service rates for the rest of the house. If they could offer this without the need for paying the fixed fees for 2 services it would be nice.

    I realize that going solar would probably be prudent in this case, but I unfortunately have some poorly placed large trees in my neighbors yard and a roof shape that is not very optimized for large rectangular panels. I've gotten some solar quotes but the ones I've received so far wouldn't cover half of my annual usage (before adding an EV) so they haven't seemed worth it. I keep hoping that as the solar industry grows either the panels will get more efficient so I can get more power from the space I have, or they start offering different panel shapes that will allow people with odd roof shapes to cover them more effectively.
     
  2. EdA

    EdA Model S P-2540

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    Ground mounted solar an option?
    Even if you covered half your usage pre-EV you'd be reducing your energy rate appreciably.
    My system covered about 70% of my pre-EV usage, never dreamed we'd get a second EV but we did.
     
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  3. Driver Dave

    Driver Dave Member

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    National Grid stinks. They make it so you pretty much have to be an industrial customer that only runs at night to make any sense.

    For the consumer - no cheap night time electricity for you!
     
  4. masam

    masam Member

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  5. David29

    David29 Supporting Member

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    Sorry to have to tell you, but Eversource cancelled their residential TOU rate in their last rate changes, in January 2018. I had it for a bit over one year, for my EV charging (only), and it saved me about 10% compared to regular residential rates. Between the rate increase in January and losing the TOU, the cost of running an EV climbed considerably this year fir Eversource customers!
     
  6. North75

    North75 Member

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    Hmm.. That stinks. I didn't think their TOU would have saved me much but not good for people that wanted it. I'm surprised that they are not required to offer some kind of plan.
    I wrote an email to my local state rep about this issue, but got no acknowledgement that I even sent anything which was kind of disappointing. I wonder if there is somebody else in state government that would be worth contacting.
     
  7. EdA

    EdA Model S P-2540

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    Call the department of public utilities (DPU). They have been pretty responsive to an issue I'm having trying to get my Powerwall's hooked up.
     
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  8. David29

    David29 Supporting Member

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    I wrote the DPU a long letter on the TOU decision, and all I got back a month or so later was a form letter telling me to contact Eversource. I also copied the AG's office, because they are supposed to represent consumers in rate cases. All I got from them was a form letter telling me to contact the DPU!

    In the "old days," government agencies would answer letters. Now, with everyone used to the email/tweet/text communication style, everyone has apparently lost the inclination or ability to actually answer a written letter!
     
  9. EdA

    EdA Model S P-2540

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    I called them and they have called me back multiple times and emailed me.
    The email was a request to send them a letter ironically during the "solicitation
    of comments" period.
     
  10. yousexy

    yousexy Member

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    The solution, for now, is to install a large enough solar panel system. At least, that's what I did. With 1 S85D in the house, my net metering so far is still negative.

    Mass has the highest electricity and natural gas cost in the nation.
     
  11. tga

    tga Supporting Member

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    What are you guys paying per kWh in MA? A couple of years ago I was paying Hudson Light & Power $0.14/kWh, but that was a muni, so there rates were (somewhat) lower.
     
  12. EdA

    EdA Model S P-2540

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  13. masam

    masam Member

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    Same here - $0.22/kWh and I think it’s down to $0.20/kWh now that it’s summer
     
  14. yousexy

    yousexy Member

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    You are right. Hawaii is an exception. Everything in HI is so damn expensive, 1-gallon milk is like 13 bucks.

    Here is DPU's CESS web site

    Energy Switch Massachusetts | The Massachusetts Department Of Public Utilities' Shopping for Electric Supply website

    For the record, the Mass DPU has publicly maintained their support for TOU. The DPU believes the TOU is the future of solar energy. For the selfish reason, I just want net metering since my solar panel is more than sufficient for my electricity needs. TOU will encourage things like battery storage like power wall which cost an arm and a leg. :)
     
  15. ModelNforNerd

    ModelNforNerd Active Member

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    New global leader of EV uptake emerges – in Massachusetts



    New bill running through the legislature, in the last paragraph of "What would this bill do?" in the article:


    "Another important provision of this legislation would require utilities to offer rates that reward electric vehicle drivers for charging their vehicles at night, when electricity use is low. These “time of use” rates can lead to big savings not only for electric vehicle drivers, but for all ratepayers."




    It would be nice if NGrid and EverSource saw the light on their own, and offered up TOU rates, but I suppose mandating it will have the same net effect.
     
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  16. RyanDe

    RyanDe Member

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    I'm in MA (Wilmington) and pay $0.063/kWh. If I do the on/off peak that drops to $0.02/kWh during off peak but it's so cheap I haven't made that switch yet. Our electric bill is always over $100, I can't imagine paying over 4x that.
     
  17. North75

    North75 Member

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    I'm at $0.213/ kWh at the moment on Eversource. It was slightly higher in the winter. Our delivery charge is $0.11 of the total.
    I don't understand how you can pay less than that for delivery and generation in this area? or is that price generation only?

    I kind of get the economics behind why generation charges might be higher in this area, but I don't understand why the delivery charges are so much more than other parts of the country.

    I agree that Solar is the way to go. I should get some new system estimates and see if it looks any better with newer more efficient panels. (my roof shape kind of sucks and has limited space for full size panels)
     
  18. North75

    North75 Member

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    #18 North75, Jun 21, 2018
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2018
    Any word on the actual status of this bill? I will send emails to my rep and senator requesting their support.
    Edit - I just read the article. Senate passed the bill already, so the question is will they take this up, or is there something similar in the house?
     
  19. RyanDe

    RyanDe Member

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    You're right, I was assuming the delivery was the same but it's not. If I count't that we pay $0.1834 which would be about $0.14 if we did on/off peak.
     
  20. yousexy

    yousexy Member

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    The omnibus bill will face a very steep climb in House. The house probably will not pick it up in the summer. It's at HOU Committee on Environment, Natural Resources and Agriculture for committee work.

    This bill is difficult to pass HOU because it bundled too many things (4 different bills altogether if I remember correctly) all in 1 bill. HOU hate a bill like this, SEN loves it.
     
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