MASTER THREAD: 2021 Model 3 - Charge data, battery discussion etc

[MyCabbages]

I've had my 2021 Model 3 SR+ for almost two months. Installed TeslaMate soon after taking delivery, so I have lots of data. I saw the sticky post about using the car's energy screen to calculate battery capacity and decided to track my battery. Here's what I started today:

View attachment 665994

Does that look right so far? How often should I record data? Once or twice a year?

I looked for the Model 3 SR+ battery specs and saw both 50 and 55 kWh. Which is right?

I believe either for late 2020 models or starting in 2021 they went from 50 -> 55kWh.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

I've had my 2021 Model 3 SR+ for almost two months. Installed TeslaMate soon after taking delivery, so I have lots of data. I saw the sticky post about using the car's energy screen to calculate battery capacity and decided to track my battery. Here's what I started today:

View attachment 665994

Does that look right so far? How often should I record data? Once or twice a year?

I looked for the Model 3 SR+ battery specs and saw both 50 and 55 kWh. Which is right?

Looks right. How often you record is up to you but monthly seems better.

The “full pack when new” is 55.4kWh (“design value”) for the 2021 Model 3 SR+ but vehicles are only coming with 53.5kWh (or so) available when new. 53.5kWh is what is needed to display 263 rated miles, the max.

In 2020 and older the pack was 52.5kWh to display full range (both 240 miles and 250 miles were the same energy content, with different constants). (52.4kWh FPWN)

The disagree above is because the statement is not correct. Cells increased perhaps 5.7% capacity, but so far only ~2% is realized on SR+.

 

[conv90]

Strange 50km history
The Energy screen on 50 km is acting weird.
Obviously we all know that the "new" kilometers are at the right (added )side of the graph.
At the left we are in the situation of 50 km ago.
Driving (and adding kilometers of drive) usually the left side disappears and new data are at right side and all the data is shifting leftside.
Here, (at the left) I have continuosly change of data even if I made at least 20-25 km after the first picture , but the strange hipes are still there.
Also notice it starts always at 0Wh/km

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

Strange 50km history
The Energy screen on 50 km is acting weird.
Obviously we all know that the "new" kilometers are at the right (added )side of the graph.
At the left we are in the situation of 50 km ago.
Driving (and adding kilometers of drive) usually the left side disappears and new data are at right side and all the data is shifting leftside.
Here, (at the left) I have continuosly change of data even if I made at least 20-25 km after the first picture , but the strange hipes are still there.
Also notice it starts always at 0Wh/km
View attachment 666027
View attachment 666028View attachment 666029View attachment 666030

No idea... This screen is mostly useless and the math for capacity still works out, so I don’t care too much what the graph says...

 

[AAKEE]

we had a guy checking in on a swedish forum, with a LR’21 with the 82.1kWh batt.
According to him its a E3LD in the pappers and WLTP 614 km
He did use the energy screen calc and came up to only 77.8kwh.(63% SOC) He used all three distances(10/25/50km) and made an average, but all was rather close). Quite low valuefor the 82.1-batt, if it isnt capped.
Or maybe Tesla has started to exclude the buffer from these screens also.

I think the car only has done 700km, 450miles so the battery might not have woken up yet and the BMS might need more depending on how the charging scedule is…?

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

He did use the energy screen calc and came up to only 77.8kwh.(63% SOC) He used all three distances(10/25/50km) and made an average, but all was rather close). Quite low valuefor the 82.1-batt, if it isnt capped.

Yeah pretty low. Although for 614 WLTP vs 580 we only expect about 79.4kWh if 75kWh corresponded go 580 (we don’t know that exactly).

I agree that sounds capped. It might get a little closer to the “expected” 79kWh if it is fully charged and balanced I guess.

Or maybe Tesla has started to exclude the buffer from these screens also.

Haven’t seen any evidence of that from any recent screen captures, though (as usual, the buffer is entirely excluded at 0% SoC, and 100% included at 100% SoC - with linear interpolation between those points). And the value would kind of be too high if the buffer were being excluded.

 

[bvolders]

Mine LR will be delivered this Friday. I'll let you know

In the meantime I received a registration document which clearly states E3LD. Beware it is written in Dutch

 

[AAKEE]

Yeah pretty low. Although for 614 WLTP vs 580 we only expect about 79.4kWh if 75kWh corresponded go 580 (we don’t know that exactly).

I agree that sounds capped. It might get a little closer to the “expected” 79kWh if it is fully charged and balanced I guess.



Haven’t seen any evidence of that from any recent screen captures, though (as usual, the buffer is entirely excluded at 0% SoC, and 100% included at 100% SoC - with linear interpolation between those points). And the value would kind of be too high if the buffer were being excluded.

I think these cars have the CoC WLTP at 640km and Tesla by some reason understate it to 614. The logic guess is that the delta is the buffer below zero ?

 

[TimothyHW3]

In the meantime I received a registration document which clearly states E3LD. Beware it is written in Dutch

We had a few wrong numbers from dutch customers in the past, so unfortunatey you will only know when you get the car.

"I think these cars have the CoC WLTP at 640km and Tesla by some reason understate it to 614. "

At the moment the total km range displayed in the car is not "unlocked" so maybe it is just an advertisement thing until they can boost the EPA in the US as well. Plus if they can "increase" the range on the website again to 640km that will be a nice boost for the Q3 and Q4 sales.

"He did use the energy screen calc and came up to only 77.8kwh.(63% SOC)"

You can't use that screen as it is capped to about 79kWh. The only way to check is with SMT.

 

[TimothyHW3]

I believe either for late 2020 models or starting in 2021 they went from 50 -> 55kWh.

It was 52.5kWh before now it is closer to 55kWh, for the Panasonic batteries. LFP also roughly the same, but they have 10% buffer instead of 4% like on Panasonic.

 

[AAKEE]

"He did use the energy screen calc and came up to only 77.8kwh.(63% SOC)"

You can't use that screen as it is capped to about 79kWh. The only way to check is with SMT.

Is the screen capped on the '21 Model 3LR ?

My M3P '21 is not capped at 79, at least. I havent checked since my Nominal Full Pack climbed high, but I think I have seen energy screen number at about 81kWh.

 

[Ofarlig]

We had a few wrong numbers from dutch customers in the past, so unfortunatey you will only know when you get the car.

"I think these cars have the CoC WLTP at 640km and Tesla by some reason understate it to 614. "

At the moment the total km range displayed in the car is not "unlocked" so maybe it is just an advertisement thing until they can boost the EPA in the US as well. Plus if they can "increase" the range on the website again to 640km that will be a nice boost for the Q3 and Q4 sales.

"He did use the energy screen calc and came up to only 77.8kwh.(63% SOC)"

You can't use that screen as it is capped to about 79kWh. The only way to check is with SMT.

I mean if they have registered it as a E3LD I would be very surprised if that isn’t what he gets because it shouldn’t be road legal at that point. So unless they have changed what E3LD is it should be the 2170L battery shouldn’t it?

 

[AAKEE]

I mean if they have registered it as a E3LD I would be very surprised if that isn’t what he gets because it shouldn’t be road legal at that point. So unless they have changed what E3LD is it should be the 2170L battery shouldn’t it?

I think Timothy refers to the WLTP. The 640 km might be another fault from the German traffic department or what it was called.

 

[Ofarlig]

I think Timothy refers to the WLTP. The 640 km might be another fault from the German traffic department or what it was called.

Yeah but the quoted post said E3LD in the documentation so I am just saying he should be able to expect to get the 2170L battery. Tesla can ofc still do whatever in regards to what that means for range or wether it is software locked or so on.

 

[TimothyHW3]

gets because it shouldn’t be road legal at that point.

You can scroll up in this thread and see a dutch guy with wrong papers E3D vs E5D (not sure if he got the LG or the Panasonic or the other way around, but the papers didn't match the delivered battery).

Is the screen capped on the '21 Model 3LR ?

Yes, it seems it is at 79kWh. Doesn't increase the range after that. Your P is capped by your constant, which is unrealistically high.

 

[Ofarlig]

You can scroll up in this thread and see a dutch guy with wrong papers E3D vs E5D (not sure if he got the LG or the Panasonic or the other way around, but the papers didn't match the delivered battery).

Well then I am pretty sure that car wouldn’t be conforming to the registration and thus wouldn’t be road legal, it would be considered to be modified. Pretty sure no agency or inspector would ever check but I would def refuse delivery or return the car at that point and have grounds to do so.

 

[TimothyHW3]

Pretty sure no agency or inspector would ever check

Exactly this... And most of them wouldn't even know where to look or what to look for.

 

[AAKEE]

Its now confirmed that that specific M3 2021 LR has the WLTP640km in the vehicle registration pappers, together with the E3LD variant. Alos confirmed that it was sold as a 614km WLTP on the Tesla homesite. Tesla do underreport the WLTP, and the delta seems to fit in the size of the buffer... ?

Also, those 78kWh on the energy screen look quite small...I dont know anything about the possible cap on the energy screen...

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

Its now confirmed that that specific M3 2021 LR has the WLTP640km in the vehicle registration pappers, together with the E3LD variant. Alos confirmed that it was sold as a 614km WLTP on the Tesla homesite. Tesla do underreport the WLTP, and the delta seems to fit in the size of the buffer... ?

Maybe. But also 82.1kWh/75kWh is about the same ratio as 640km/580km. (It would have to be 82.8kWh to be perfect, but maybe there have been other tweaks to the software (or hardware?) to improve efficiency in the meantime...so maybe something like 81-82kWh would be good enough. (I'm also not sure whether 75kWh is the EXACT value that corresponded to the 580km result.)) In any case 82.1kWh or 82.8kWh or even 81kWh doesn't apparently square with available energy seen on these vehicles to date (not really even close, so far).

I'd estimate in about a maximum of 3-6 months we'll know, haha.

History is:
77.8kWh -> 560km (2018, and 2019 (sort of))
75kWh -> 580km (paired with about 7% efficiency improvement over about 1 year, from early 2019 ) (2021)
? -> 614km. (If we assumed similar efficiency to 75kWh/2021, would need 79.4kWh)
? -> 640km. (If we assumed similar efficiency to 75kWh/2021, would need 82.8kWh)

 

[AAKEE]

Maybe. But also 82.1kWh/75kWh is about the same ratio as 640km/580km. (It would have to be 82.8kWh to be perfect, but maybe there have been other tweaks to the software (or hardware?) to improve efficiency in the meantime...so maybe something like 81-82kWh would be good enough.

Yes, all that is clear for me since long.

The thing, that we have known but dunno why is that the actual WLTP in the papers is 640km( yes, we understand that part) but Tesla only advertises WLTP 614km on these cars on their homepage.
As the buffer is about 4.5%, it quite close to the delta. If you take 4.1% off the 640, you get 614km.
So why do Tesla say 614 but the actual WLTP per the WLTP test is 640km ?