Model 3 SR+ LFP Battery Range, Degradation, etc Discussion

[Baluchi]

Damn, Baluchi, you’re a driver! I got my car about 3 weeks before you did and I just now got to 2000 miles on it! If you’re going to drive a lot though, this car is a good choice to spend all that time in…

Yeah, I have a long commute, which is the only way I was able to justify buying such an expensive car for myself. My wife and I have been laser focused on saving money so we can retire early, so forking out $40,000 for a new car was out of character for us.

 

[pipp]

Hi all; I picked up my 2021 SR+ LFP in September. I was consistently at 253 for the life of the car (with all level 2 home charging and two supercharging sessions mixed in). On November 11-14, I went on a a road trip from Southern California to Northern California with about six supercharges throughout. The weather was also significantly colder there.

During the trip, I noticed the max range drop off a steep cliff to 250, as reflected in my battery report below (note that I think it may have missed a supercharge or two from the trip). But since coming back home, it looks like it’s leveled out at 250. Is this normal? Has anyone else experienced anything like this?

Your situation seems a little bit like mine, so I am daring to throw a tidbit of opinion out here. I had a drop-off as well, that was exacerbated/confused due to a software bug in the 2021.36.5.5 release (or maybe it was the 2.3 Tesla app that caused the problem). You probably don’t have that bug, but if you did, one sign of it would be your charging has dropped a single amp lower than usual like from 12 to 11 or from 32 to 31. The bug is easily sidestepped by avoiding changing the amps back to their original amount via the phone app — use the car screen app instead.

But my car also had a little bit of a growing pain problem, which might have been because, like your car, it was primarily charged on level 1 and 2 for the first few weeks of its life and then it suddenly got exposed to a significant amount of supercharges. It was like the battery management system had to kind of recalibrate its numbers for assessing the translation of charge percentage to projected range for the car. But once I got past the bug and the car had a few days to re-calibrate, my range climbed back up to a consistent 252.

 

[nevdash]

Your situation seems a little bit like mine, so I am daring to throw a tidbit of opinion out here. I had a drop-off as well, that was exacerbated/confused due to a software bug in the 2021.36.5.5 release (or maybe it was the 2.3 Tesla app that caused the problem). You probably don’t have that bug, but if you did, one sign of it would be your charging has dropped a single amp lower than usual like from 12 to 11 or from 32 to 31. The bug is easily sidestepped by avoiding changing the amps back to their original amount via the phone app — use the car screen app instead.

But my car also had a little bit of a growing pain problem, which might have been because, like your car, it was primarily charged on level 1 and 2 for the first few weeks of its life and then it suddenly got exposed to a significant amount of supercharges. It was like the battery management system had to kind of recalibrate its numbers for assessing the translation of charge percentage to projected range for the car. But once I got past the bug and the car had a few days to re-calibrate, my range climbed back up to a consistent 252.

Interesting. I don’t think I’ve checked the amperage setting in the car; I’ve just relied on the app showing 32A. I’ll look out for that.

How long did it take yours to re-calibrate back up to 252? Did you change your charging habits at all to help it re-calibrate? I use about 25-30% on a an average day, so my routine has been to drive two days down to 40-50% SOC and then charge back up to 100%. Could following that same routine exacerbate the problem?

 

[pipp]

If the app shows 32 amps then you probably don’t have that issue. I was down to range 245 until I started kicking the amps up from 11 to 12 on the phone app. Then jjandorin suggested to make the change on the car app instead, and after I used the car app the change was permanent and I didn’t have to kick the amps back up from 11 to 12 every day when I started charging.

But kicking the amps up from 11 to 12 only brought the range up to 250, I believe. Over the next couple of days the battery management system seemed to be re-calibrating and the range rose up to 252, where it has been steady for the last 8 or 9 days.

 

[BMWM3Man]

Sounds like your Sentry mode doesn't know it's home. I had a similar thing happen at work, where the car didn't know I was there unless I drove through a certain spot in the parking lot. So I just added a favorite that included the other side of the parking lot, and set Sentry to not activate at favorited locations. That solved it for me.

Yeah took us a couple days but no Sentry mode at home in the garage...DUH!

 

[BMWM3Man]

Hi all; I picked up my 2021 SR+ LFP in September. I was consistently at 253 for the life of the car (with all level 2 home charging and two supercharging sessions mixed in). On November 11-14, I went on a a road trip from Southern California to Northern California with about six supercharges throughout. The weather was also significantly colder there.

During the trip, I noticed the max range drop off a steep cliff to 250, as reflected in my battery report below (note that I think it may have missed a supercharge or two from the trip). But since coming back home, it looks like it’s leveled out at 250. Is this normal? Has anyone else experienced anything like this?

If 253 to 250 is "off a step cliff" we are all screwed. LOL. I can't worry about 3 miles...now if that happens every time you take a road trip and use super chargers well I'd want to hear about that.

 

[FARKLE!]

5,000 mile update for my 2021 SR+ LFP (5,519 miles actually). As of today, the Tessie app shows a battery capacity of 54.5 kWh (down 0.2% from my original 23 Oct 2021 post of 54.6 kWh), and a max range of 252 miles (down 0.4% from my original post of 253 miles).

So at 5,500 miles I've had very little degradation, which I don't even really think is degredation. If you look at the graph, battery capacity and range start to drop at the same time the weather here started getting cold. My car is now being exposed to 35-45 degree F temps, which I think is the primary reason for the drops in capacity and range. I expect these drops to continue as the weather gets colder, and then I hope to get at least some of that back when when temps rise again next spring.

According to the car's screen, I'm now averaging 208 Wh/mi over the life of the car. I'm guessing the car isn't using the battery buffer in its calculation--but I don't really know for sure. But assuming the Model 3 has a 4.5% buffer (according to multiple threads), that would make my 208 Wh/mi actually 217 Wh/mi (208 * 1.045 = 217; please correct me if I'm screwing up the math). Assuming I could tap into the listed 54.5 kWh battery at 217 Wh/mi efficiency, that gives me a range of 251.2 miles.

My charging is almost entirely Level 2 from a Grizzl-E on a 40 amp circuit in my garage, delivery 32 amps to the car. I charger every night, but I mix it up to try and let the battery sleep at various states-of-charge. So some nights I'll charge to 70%, some to 80%, some to 90%, and at least a couple times per week I go to 100%. I've used Superchargers a few times, but mostly just to check out the stations in my area.

Tessie says I've charged 66 times in the 57 days I've owned the car. The LFP battery is supposedly good for 5,000 cycles before it degrades to 80%, I've used 1.3% of those cycles since I bought the car on 23 Sep 2021. At this rate, the car should last a total of 12 years before the battery falls to 80% capacity (202 mile range).

EDIT to add one more metric. Tessie says I've spent $124.88 on electricity for the life of the car, while the same driving in my old Ford Focus would've cost $500.02 in gasoline. So my fuel costs have been 25% compared to keeping my old car.

I'll try to post another update at 10,000 miles, which should happen during the coldest part of the year, so I expect to see more dropping numbers.

Nice! Only $124.88 for driving 5,500 miles? What’s your cost per KWh? My SR+ LFP is right at 2,000 miles, yet charging costs are probably somewhere between double and triple what yours is (less than half the miles!). I’m in SoCal so we do have some of the highest electricity rates in the country…if not THE highest.

 

[BMWM3Man]

Nice! Only $124.88 for driving 5,500 miles? What’s your cost per KWh? My SR+ LFP is right at 2,000 miles, yet charging costs are probably somewhere between double and triple what yours is (less than half the miles!). I’m in SoCal so we do have some of the highest electricity rates in the country…if not THE highest.

I guess it is all about a state's electric rates but that sounded a little expensive to me. We only charge at home and did about 2100 miles for approx. $30. 5 cents a KW

 

[nevdash]

If 253 to 250 is "off a step cliff" we are all screwed. LOL. I can't worry about 3 miles...now if that happens every time you take a road trip and use super chargers well I'd want to hear about that.

Haha, I don’t mean to sound paranoid. You alluded to my concern, though. I’m not so worried about losing 3 miles of range after 5k miles, but more about the prospect of quickly losing 3 miles of range every time I take a road trip.

 

[Baluchi]

Nice! Only $124.88 for driving 5,500 miles? What’s your cost per KWh? My SR+ LFP is right at 2,000 miles, yet charging costs are probably somewhere between double and triple what yours is (less than half the miles!). I’m in SoCal so we do have some of the highest electricity rates in the country…if not THE highest.

My average electricity cost is $0.009925 per kWh. It's actually a little higher for six summer months (over 10 cents) and a little lower for winter months (about 8 cents). Or maybe I've got that backwards.

 

[FARKLE!]

My average electricity cost is $0.009925 per kWh. It's actually a little higher for six summer months (over 10 cents) and a little lower for winter months (about 8 cents). Or maybe I've got that backwards.

Do you mean $0.09925, so about $.10 cents per kWh? I’m at .18 or .19 cents per kWh hour here. Only in California…

 

[Baluchi]

Do you mean $0.09925, so about $.10 cents per kWh? I’m at .18 or .19 cents per kWh hour here. Only in California…

Yeah, sorry that's what I meant.

 

[vegasron76]

When I picked up my SR+ on 9/4 it was displaying 253-255 after a full charge. Lately it has been dropping to where it is 245 now after a full charge. Sounds silly to talk about SoCal temperatures causing a drop in range, but I’m still holding out a little bit of hope that I don’t have a lemon set of batteries…

I have a 2020 with less than 13000 miles.My range has gone from 250,230,218.I do not think this is normal because my traveling habits are the same This has all happen within the last 6 months.

 

[pipp]

I have a 2020 with less than 13000 miles.My range has gone from 250,230,218.I do not think this is normal because my traveling habits are the same This has all happen within the last 6 months.

Wow that’s a lot of range loss. 32/250 = around 13% range loss. That’s right in the middle of how bad it has to be (30% range loss, I think) before they replace the battery for you. Do you ever get any error messages when you are charging?

 

[pipp]

But vegasron76 — I’m just realizing way after the fact — you don’t have lfp batteries in your 2020 do you?

 

[Baluchi]

But vegasron76 — I’m just realizing way after the fact — you don’t have lfp batteries in your 2020 do you?

Right, that's the kind of issue we're hoping we avoid with our LFPs.

 

[hlin07]

Right, that's the kind of issue we're hoping we avoid with our LFPs.

Don't worry too much about LFP. studies after studies have shown LFP batteries degrade slower compared to NCA. Even if it does degrade at the same rate as NCA, we still have more daily drivable miles compared to NCA SR+. The only two downsides are lower efficiency, it is heavier, and cold weather driving range.

 

[amit_gunner]

Hey guys, anyone seen new LFP winter test from Bjorn? Would like to see what you guys think.

 

[Ther0ck]

Winter test in 1c ? That's barely winter !

I want -10c testing.

 

[amit_gunner]

Winter test in 1c ? That's barely winter !

I want -10c testing.

True true. Lol.