Range Loss Over Time, What Can Be Expected, Efficiency, How to Maintain Battery Health

[Love2Run]

I’ve seen a few posts similar. Figured I’d share mine. July 18 built P3D with just over 12k miles and has been in my possession since end of March (was a showroom demo).

Check out my graph, seems like a pretty steady decline started around 4500 miles (sitting at 290 now). Unless this range loss slows down, my max range will be less than 250 before I hit 36k miles. Factor in Dual motor, 20” wheels, cold weather and a realistic range will be closer to 150. I really hope something changes.

 

[roblab]

I don't believe it will lose half its range in the first few months, although you're past the first few months. Battery range experiences losses over TIME, not over mileage. You will lose range losses of about ten percent first year (or 6%, depending) and then about one percent a year after that. That's normal.

What I see is that electrics lose range mostly due to the newbie driver suddenly becoming less careful with foot pressure, maybe taking more rapid starts (Hey, I had to gun it away from a light just because there was a cop beside me today), and then, as you say, it's gotten a LOT colder all of a sudden. That and driving in the rain (Oregon), I can see that it's likely you've already lost ten percent, although you only show 7% or so. And the rain losses will go away when you move to California! Or when the rain stops in Oregon.

I have learned that my range will drop as I start driving on I-80 at 80 mph, in the cold, in the rain, hot rodding around slow vehicles (at 110 mph), and just plain having fun. BUT IF I WANT, I can slow down, feather the pedal, back off, and still get over 300 miles range on the 3. More like 310. I expect that your range losses are mainly a function of colder weather and rainy driving, and driving a little more lead footed. Your battery is doing fine.

 

[ggies07]

My one year old Model 3 was bought with a range of 260 miles. After a 100% charge, the display would show a remaining range of 260 miles when the car was new.

Now, after a 100% charge, it only shows 245 miles. Has my battery degraded already? Or has it learned my driving habits and converts kWh to miles differently than before?

FWIW, I have same car, purchased in Jan.... I am also at about 245 mi at 100%. Here's the estimated range at 100% over the lifetime of the car (minus the first two weeks, before I started collecting the data):
View attachment 482457
The first drop at 4.8k miles was both at the 6 month ownership mark and when I updated from 2019.20.4.2 to 2019.24.4, not saying that had anything to do with it, but some internet theories are that Tesla is changing the BMS software somehow.

Same here and good to know others are seeing the same thing. Bought my MR 3 a year ago, have 25k miles on it now. Had 255 100% charge brand new. That was steady, but it seems like with the latest software update for the 5% more power, it now only gets 244 at 100%......could it be Tesla did something to add buffer to the overall battery due to the power increase?

 

[DaBagBoy]

I am curios to know your charging strategy. Do you keep your car plugged in and charge it to 90%? do you charge it every day? Also when you try to run it to lets say 10% SOC, does it look like it is going to exceed the 280 rated miles or not? 20k miles in one year is a good amount of miles, do you supercharge a lot? I am asking these as a new owner to figure out how my charging strategy should be.

I charge about every other day to 80%. Usually at a ChargePoint charger near my office. Almost never a Supercharger. I rarely try to run to a low SOC but it does not get the "rated range" of 310 or 280 miles (mostly due to highway 75mph speeds, a bit due to cold weather). I live in Michigan and drove it all last winter but didn't notice a decline in rated range until this past summer.

 

[omgwtfbyobbq]

Same car, 5/18 build. 10% degradation for me.

Babied the car as well.
Both our cars fall under the date range for the service bulletin related to missing connections in the battery resulting in missing battery capacity.
My VIN didn’t fall under the listed VINs so I’m not getting anywhere with Service.

I’m convinced something is not right as I’ve always had significantly less displayed range than advertised. Don’t have any data logging apps unfortunately.

I keep getting told that the displayed range is dependant on driving habits and weather. This does not align with what Tesla’s own website says. Tesla website says that it is based on battery status (voltage/current) information and the EPA rated efficiency constant.

It also does not follow weather trends or driving styles at all. The displayed range is consistent regardless of either of those factors. Unaffected by the drastic changes in Canadian weather. And unaffected by significant changes in my lifetime efficiency number.

The only way Tesla will be able to identify the issue is by owners showing them the issue and then it getting investigated based on logged data. I assume this is likely how they would have figured out the issue with missed connections in the first place. The problem may be covering an additional battery assembly line than they initially thought during that period.

If there is a way for a few of us with similar conditions could group our information together to bring it to Tesla’s attention, that may help resolve the problem.

10% missing on a new car is unacceptable.

Ugh, that's a little bootsy. Have you asked them to show you how much energy the battery has via the diagnostic menu? Any tech should be able to do that at a service center. Correlating that with SOC should provide good feedback about how much capacity has dropped.

 

[dmurphy]

So, a funny thing happened today...

My wife's been driving the Model 3 for the last month and a half instead of me, which means a more steady commute, a pre-heat before the commute in the morning, etc. And between that, and the weather getting colder, we're "only" charging to anywhere from 274-277 miles @ 90%. (Still have the car at 90% set-it-and-forget-it.)

Anywho -- this morning, she took Tessie to do some shopping in Pennsylvania. Couple hundred miles today - so we charged up to 100% before she left this morning, and then back to the usual 90% when she got home.

And guess what? We're right back at 279 miles @ 90%. Exactly the same as when I bought the car 8 months ago.

So I'm really, truly convinced that there's zero advantage to trying to "manage" my charging. Just set it and forget it..... stretch the car's legs once in a while, and the BMS will catch up.

All good!

 

[sa012]

So, a funny thing happened today...

My wife's been driving the Model 3 for the last month and a half instead of me, which means a more steady commute, a pre-heat before the commute in the morning, etc. And between that, and the weather getting colder, we're "only" charging to anywhere from 274-277 miles @ 90%. (Still have the car at 90% set-it-and-forget-it.)

Anywho -- this morning, she took Tessie to do some shopping in Pennsylvania. Couple hundred miles today - so we charged up to 100% before she left this morning, and then back to the usual 90% when she got home.

And guess what? We're right back at 279 miles @ 90%. Exactly the same as when I bought the car 8 months ago.

So I'm really, truly convinced that there's zero advantage to trying to "manage" my charging. Just set it and forget it..... stretch the car's legs once in a while, and the BMS will catch up.

All good!

Wow...thats great!!! Hopefully that will set some people's mind at ease...

 

[dmurphy]

Wow...thats great!!! Hopefully that will set some people's mind at ease...

I'm sure there are a few batteries out there that have some legitimate issues.... but for the overwhelming majority, anything more than "set it and forget it" charging is just wasting time. The battery management system does its best to keep the data as accurate as possible, but it does "drift" a bit here and there. It's got no real bearing on actual battery output - the car will still go as far as it would with out without that display.

So make life simple - plug the car in, let it charge, drive it and enjoy it. Anything else is just "in the noise". Sure, maybe after 300,000 miles, someone who studitiously monitored their battery and babied it for 20 years might squeeze a couple miles more range out of it. But for me, that's 20 years away and I'm sure as heck not going to worry about it.

 

[dmurphy]

Forgot to post this yesterday - wanted to share it now .. all healthy, even in the cool weather.

 

[MERCENARY_TAO]

SR+ owners to me!



I charge to 90% every day and my rated range has dropped to 203 miles of its rated 250. At no degradation I should be at 225 miles@90% or 213 after 5% degradation.



My battery has degraded nearly 10% if I go by the rated 250 and over 5% if I go by the old 240! And this is after 5 months and just under 7k miles! Am I an outlier or is this similar to you all?



I thought it was due to how cold it is outside (30-40 in the morning when charging then driving to work, 50-60 when driving home)



But we had a freak 3 days where it was 70 all day and night and my range never budged, what’s going on?

I drove the sucker hard too the last couple of days getting home with less than 25% battery, so I’m pretty sure it’s gone through a few cycles (normal day I go from 90 to 55 average).

 

[coconutboy84]

It’s not degradation

 

[MERCENARY_TAO]

It’s not degradation

Fine, if I call it range loss will you actually answer my question or give me actual info?

 

[diamond.g]

It’s not degradation

Part of me wonders if Tesla should switch to a GOM like the rest of the industry.

 

[hugh_jassol]

SR+ owners to me!

I charge to 90% every day and my rated range has dropped to 203 miles of its rated 250. At no degradation I should be at 225 miles@90% or 213 after 5% degradation.

My battery has degraded nearly 10% if I go by the rated 250 and over 5% if I go by the old 240! And this is after 5 months and just under 7k miles! Am I an outlier or is this similar to you all?

I thought it was due to how cold it is outside (30-40 in the morning when charging then driving to work, 50-60 when driving home)

But we had a freak 3 days where it was 70 all day and night and my range never budged, what’s going on?

I drove the sucker hard too the last couple of days getting home with less than 25% battery, so I’m pretty sure it’s gone through a few cycles (normal day I go from 90 to 55 average).

The range display is simply the Wh currently in your battery divided by Wh/mi for your car as rated by the EPA. It is not adjusted for temperature, how you have driven in the past, phase of the moon, your current mood, etc. This is also clearly stated on Teslas support site.

The tricky part is that there is no direct way to measure the capacity (Wh) of a Li-ion battery nor is there any way to directly measure how much degradation there has been. the Battery Management System uses algorithms to try to infer the capacity of the battery, but it is not perfect. So over time, this estimate can drift off of what's actually in the pack. It doesn't change how much energy is there, it's just thinking there is less than there really is. The only way to know for sure would be to charge to 100% and drive at exactly the rated Wh/mi EPA rating of your car and see how far you've driven when the car shuts down and refuses to move.

It's a little bit like if you tried to estimate how many people were on a bus by weighing the bus. You can use your knowledge of the weight of the empty bus from the bus manufacturer and go by the "average human" weight... or try to get smarter by looking at the demographics of the neighborhood the bus serves to adjust your "average human" to be more/less women/men/children/older/younger/etc. But the only way you know for sure is to empty the bus and count them.

There has been some speculation that Tesla as been tweaking the BMS algorithms and so a bunch of us see that as less range in the display, but that does not mean there is less energy in the battery. Or rather, that most of the "loss" is not actual loss - there will always be some loss as batteries do degrade over time and use no matter what you do.

 

[hokiefan]

Usually only drive around town so never get below 40%, charge to 80-90% at home. Had to take a road trip and did a 100% charge yesterday and only got 273 Miles at 100%. Very concerning. Made it to destination with 23% remaining and did a charge to 100% to get back. Same 273 @ 100%. Couldn't make it back because weather was colder, had to do a 10 minute supercharge on the way. Car only has 15k miles . This is a AWD LR purchased Sept 18.

Should I call Tesla?

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

Usually only drive around town so never get below 40%, charge to 80-90% at home. Had to take a road trip and did a 100% charge yesterday and only got 273 Miles at 100%. Very concerning. Made it to destination with 23% remaining and did a charge to 100% to get back. Same 273 @ 100%. Couldn't make it back because weather was colder, had to do a 10 minute supercharge on the way. Car only has 15k miles . This is a AWD LR purchased Sept 18.

Should I call Tesla?View attachment 487324

I would call them when you get to around 220-230. That is pretty close to the warranty threshold of 217. Otherwise enjoy the car and hope it can do the trips you need it to! A quick Supercharge is not the end of the world though I understand it would be super annoying and really bad if you can’t make it between Superchargers!

If something is seriously wrong it will fail sooner rather than later.

Looks like you are near the bottom of the bell curve for available energy based on the plots posted here from @KenC, but such is life!

I do wonder about cars with born-on dates in August/Sept 2018, but I guess that could be “anecdata.”

 

[duanra]

I would call.

 

[VT_EE]

Usually only drive around town so never get below 40%, charge to 80-90% at home. Had to take a road trip and did a 100% charge yesterday and only got 273 Miles at 100%. Very concerning. Made it to destination with 23% remaining and did a charge to 100% to get back. Same 273 @ 100%. Couldn't make it back because weather was colder, had to do a 10 minute supercharge on the way. Car only has 15k miles . This is a AWD LR purchased Sept 18.

Should I call Tesla?View attachment 487324

A call wouldn’t hurt, but I suspect it’s the same software-induced issue a lot of people seem to have.

 

[diamond.g]

Usually only drive around town so never get below 40%, charge to 80-90% at home. Had to take a road trip and did a 100% charge yesterday and only got 273 Miles at 100%. Very concerning. Made it to destination with 23% remaining and did a charge to 100% to get back. Same 273 @ 100%. Couldn't make it back because weather was colder, had to do a 10 minute supercharge on the way. Car only has 15k miles . This is a AWD LR purchased Sept 18.

Should I call Tesla?View attachment 487324

For the road trip what was your average Wh/mi?

 

[hokiefan]

For the road trip what was your average Wh/mi?

Thanks everyone for the suggestions. For the trip up it was 251wh, the trip back was 307. Very interesting result after recharging at home last night, my est 100% range has gone up to 281, which is 12 miles greater than my low point. I charged to 80% last night.

I realize these numbers are only the "rated" range but like someone else pointed out, knowing how much charge is left is very important on a road trip. I'm not going to drive around with 5% or less showing even if I think the BMS is inaccurate. I'd also prefer not to have to unneeded stops. Coming home I stopped because my energy graph was predicting 5% remaining at the end of the trip. To me that is too close and I was already well below the est curve.