Winter driving advice, winter tire choices, etc.

[silenteski]

I thought I had read the manual pretty well, but I actually had no idea the side mirrors were heated. Guess I’ll have to read it again to find out what else I’ve missed!

Nice post, great ideas! My only concern with the wiper positioning idea would be snow and ice buildup where the wipers normally rest, preventing them from returning to that position on their own. But I suppose you could just clear that manually when you’re done driving.

 

[Lobstahz]

all good ideas.

this would be my first Tesla-equipped-winter, so i'm not sure I understand the idea behind "turn on chill mode and low regen, along with the super nanny-ish traction control setting." can you please elaborate?

Sure! In reduced traction situations the limits of tire grip are much lower and easier to exceed resulting in some manor of the car behaving differently than a dry road. You generally want to avoid anything that will push past those limits of grip, which could be exceeded with hard acceleration, hard braking, or large steering input (turning).

The Model 3 is a super responsive car to throttle, which is one of my favorite things about that car, and generally awesome, but not so great when traction is limited and you're in a precarious situation. For example if you're coming around a corner in the snow/winter and you start to slide the #1 thing that has been drilled into drivers heads since drivers-ed days is to take your foot off the accelerator, but don't brake as that would be asking the already slipping tires to attempt to do more, just coast. Same idea of when its raining and you start to hydroplane, just take your foot off the accelerator and you regain grip. The catch with 1-pedal driving is that if you fully lift off you'll go into full regen braking which is NOT what you want in a situation like that, as it could make things worse. So that's why I suggest low-regen for "snow mode". And I go with chill-mode to keep the pedal consistently "soft" so I don't overdo it on the acceleration side either.

The nanny-ish TC is more to dull it down further for those situations. I noticed a number of times when I'd get a bit too aggressive with the throttle that the backend would step out by a small amount, like less than 2-3" amount. Really not that much. But it was a bit alarming at first. The TC sorts itself out pretty quickly and all is well, I'd just prefer an optional setting that I can pick for those conditions that would keep that from happening in the first place.

 

[KenC]

Last winter, I made a seat setting called, "Snow Day", that has low regen, chill mode, my seat's a little straighter, etc.

For that matter, I also have one called "Squeaks" that pushes my seat all the way forward and up, so I can reach the windshield with my spudger and try to figure out where the squeaks are between the windshield and dash.

 

[cch1]

Tesla made some nice changes for the first winter the Model 3 went through, I'm hoping they'll be doing the same for the second. So with the second winter for many Model 3 owners fast approaching I compiled a few things from last season that I think would be very beneficial, and seemingly quick/easy, updates to make to the Model 3 even better this winter. I attempted to email this to "[email protected]" but was informed by the bounce-back that they no longer monitor that email address. Does anyone know the new email address for generic support to use for this?

Winter Improvements
* Winter Wiper Mode - Replicate dedicated wiper defrost by having the wipers rest right where the internal defroster hits the windshield, very similar to the existing wiper maintenance mode. For use when parked, or when driving.

** When parked in snow, freezing rain, etc and preheated the cabin heat in defroster mode will melt the snow and ice on the wiper blades making it easier clean off/scrape your car before driving.
** When driving the heat will again help melt the ice and snow. The angle of the blades and the wind from driving will help to clear the blades of snow and slush. As they currently operate the wipers are tucked away when not in use or actively wiping the windshield which is fine for dry and rain, but sub-optimal for winter driving. I had issue last winter my wipers freezing up, which looks like it could be improved via a software update.
​

* Winter Single Pedal Driving - Utilize battery warming, like what is done to precondition for super charging, to make a more consistent driving experience (ie single pedal driving) between the warmer seasons and winter. Expend some extra battery energy, and effectively range, to be able to have a more consistent driving experience. Last winter it was always a bit different everyday I'd drive which was annoying if not a bit alarming at times when you lift off expecting regen braking but instead you get zero regen and keep coasting along at the same rate of speed towards something.

* "Snow Mode" Traction Control Setting - More conservative traction control to keep the back from stepping out. Also is effectively a shortcut to turn on chill mode and low regen, along with the super nanny-ish traction control setting. This setting is targeted to make driving in slippery conditions easier and less stressful.

* Enable side mirror defroster separate from the rear window defroster. Self explanatory, sometimes you need one without the other.


"Snow Mode" Disclaimer - Before people tell me to learn to drive or get better tires, I grew up driving in Maine, have done my fair share of track events and run Blizzaks all winter. So please spare us all those comments and remember it's an _option_ don't use it if you don't want it.

These are, without exception, all improvements I would endorse. My first winter with the M3 I found myself puckering up once or twice from aggressive regen on a very steep slope. I also found it challenging to climb some hills without going to chill mode. Winter wheels and tires helped, but these suggestions would also help.

 

[GoodOmens]

Unless range is really needed I found a wash between the range lost due to a cold battery and the power required to re-heat and charge a battery (vs just plugging in when you get home with an already pre-conditioned battery).

Just my two cents.

 

[scaots]

When temp is around or below freezing, do not expect to gain any charge from a regular 110V 15A outlet. It is just enough power to warm the battery enough to allow for charging, but does not add any significant range.

My battery is I set it to 60% with charge time at 5am. I got up and noticed it was 57%. I decided to charge back up to 60% and an hour later, it was back down to 59%. It got in the 30s last night but the car is in the garage. I thought the car draws power from the house when plugged in. Is this normal? And this morning again, it’s back down to 57% after a few hours

Not sure of your charger setup, but...
When temp is around or below freezing, do not expect to gain any charge from a regular 110V 15A outlet. It is just enough power to warm the battery enough to allow for charging, but does not add any significant range. ​

 

[scaots]

My battery is I set it to 60% with charge time at 5am. I got up and noticed it was 57%. I decided to charge back up to 60% and an hour later, it was back down to 59%. It got in the 30s last night but the car is in the garage. I thought the car draws power from the house when plugged in. Is this normal? And this morning again, it’s back down to 57% after a few hours

Oops, think I understand now. Yes it's normal. When it stops charging and the battery cools, it will report less range available. Cold battery can't provide as much power. If it warms up it can show more power again. On a cool morning that is getting warm, I can get to work and end up with an extra 10mi of range an hour later.

 

[rb-loudoun]

I have an X P90D. To handle the cold weather charging, I usually charge to 80% over night, which is enough for my daily needs, even in winter. Then when I wake up, I set the charge to 90% to warm the battery up before I leave for work. We have mild winters here, so it works for me. I'd love to be able to make the changes between 80% and 90% automatic.

The big thing I notice is that when going straight, the road always feels perfect. I'm sure this is because the traction control is adapting so quickly, I can't feel anything. At least once a winter, I end up sliding into an intersection because the road was much icier than I thought. Thus far I've been lucky and never hit anything. So my biggest advice to anyone driving a Tesla in winter is that the road is always much worse than you think and to drive accordingly.

 

[Murattukaalai]

It's my first winter here in colorado and a first with my p3d. I was looking to get some advice from locals or others who've been in similar winter conditions.

I put on michelin alpin pa4 n-specs on the 20" performance wheels and am already thinking of exchanging them for hakka r3's after reading that the alpins don't perform too great on snow covered roads. I don't know how bad the roads get in CO hence my concern, and also that I'll likely by driving up to the slopes to ski every weekend if not every other day. Can anyone comment on the conditions here ( I-70, roads to eldora, arapahoe, etc.) and whether the alpin's are good enough to hold up to them?

I'd thought of getting the 20" chains from tesla but it's hard for me to justify 300$ chains..

Hakka R3's or better, I have Hakka 9 studded on LR RWD, living in CO as well.

 

[Ski Guide]

I’m in a similar situation next door in Utah with my new AWD 3. I don’t know that I have any answers for you but here’s my general thoughts:
- You will want a true winter tire. I’m not up on all the latest ones but my go-to in the past has been the Bridgestone Blizzak.

- If possible the general advice is to downsize to the smallest wheel diameter that will fit on the car and also get a more narrow width. This will give you a deeper sidewall to go into snow/ice without damaging your wheel and also put more weight on a smaller contact patch so the car is more stable on slick surfaces. Not sure how small you can go on the P3 though.

- There’s two schools of thought on the chains. One is that you’ll want to carry them as it’s always a good idea to have them just in case and in many conditions they are required by law. The other thinking is that if the road is that bad then it will probably be closed to begin with. So really I feel that chains are just for the times when you get caught in a storm and you’re already out.

I would definitely get true winter tires and carry chains if you are going to ski areas. I’m actually debating right now if I want to invest in the wheels/tires/chains for my car or if I will just always use other vehicles or shuttles when going skiing.

Be careful on the Blizzaks. They were always my go-to as well for non-studded snows. I tried to buy a set for my “3” but Tire Rack would not sell them to me. They pointed out that the load rating was too low for the weight of the car.

 

[NIKOLA696]

It's my first winter here in colorado and a first with my p3d. I was looking to get some advice from locals or others who've been in similar winter conditions.

I put on michelin alpin pa4 n-specs on the 20" performance wheels and am already thinking of exchanging them for hakka r3's after reading that the alpins don't perform too great on snow covered roads. I don't know how bad the roads get in CO hence my concern, and also that I'll likely by driving up to the slopes to ski every weekend if not every other day. Can anyone comment on the conditions here ( I-70, roads to eldora, arapahoe, etc.) and whether the alpin's are good enough to hold up to them?

I'd thought of getting the 20" chains from tesla but it's hard for me to justify 300$ chains..

I live in Golden and drive the hill every day for work in a M3P with stock tires. This will be my second winter. Can't speak about the alpin tires but you should be good. I don't think you need chains.

 

[boildkitty]

Thanks for this! You answered a lot of my questions. On the East Coast (between the bays). Usually not a bad winter, but enough for me to wonder about some of these things.

Thanks!

 

[Tessaract]

I don't have a picture handy, but there is one on page 132 of the manual.

I have not heard of not being able to plug in the charging port.

The problem actually prevents unpluging the charger plug. Apparently this has been a problem most frequently in Eastern Canada, where winter often has temps above freezing during day, and below freezing at night. If you get water into the charge port (if you're charging outside in snowy weather, for example), it pools at the bottom in the charger plug lock, and when charging stops and temps drop, the water freezes, freezing the lock in locked position, which then prevents the charging plug from retracting. A SW update reduced this problem by unlocking the charge port immediately when charging stops if temp is below freezing. Tesla also has a service bulletin on this, so if you ever experience this problem, there is also a lock mechanism HW update/improvement which will eliminate this problem.

 

[Daniel in SD]

* "Snow Mode" Traction Control Setting - More conservative traction control to keep the back from stepping out. Also is effectively a shortcut to turn on chill mode and low regen, along with the super nanny-ish traction control setting. This setting is targeted to make driving in slippery conditions easier and less stressful.

This issue isn't really the traction control. The issue is that there is zero torque applied to the front wheels until slippage is detected in the rear. I agree there should be a snow mode for the AWD system.

 

[AmandaC]

• Wipers - Should they be set to Manual when there is a threat of ice/snow? Heavy frost?
• Mirrors - Auto-Fold off based on the same conditions? I wonder whether this should just be temperature interlocked to begin with.
• Windows - Any issues with frozen window/door seals not allowing entry?
• Frunk - Is it still usable at all in snowy/icy conditions due to potential frozen seals, weight of snow/ice, etc?

Thank you for your thoughts on this.

If you treat the seals it helps a lot. The biggest sticking point is along the bottom of the window since moisture accumulates there. An old credit card slid down far enough worked like a charm.

I definitely turned off auto wipers and auto fold mirrors so they wouldn’t get damaged.

 

[RJS85]

Since there are probably a lot of people heading into their first winter with a Model 3 I thought I'd start a tip thread.

I have a LR RWD which I got July '18. I've driven it through one Minnesota winter. Here's a few things from my experience.

• Preheat. In cold weather it helps to turn on climate control while you are getting ready in the morning. This allows the car to use wall power rather than battery power to heat up the interior. It also warms the battery pack some.
• Reduced Regen. When the car has sat overnight in any temps below about 60F you'll notice some regen limitation. This is shown by the dots in the upper left on the power bar. The colder it is the more dots you will have and less regenerative braking. As the battery warms up you'll get back some or all of the dots. In sub zero weather you'll probably not be able to get all of them back. Be prepared as it is sometime a bit of a shock when you let up on the pedal and the car does not slow down as expected.
• Winter Tires. You'll find many threads on winter tires and which are good. In short, winter tires are no more or less necessary then on any other car. If you don't usually need winter tires then you may not on the Model 3. If you do get them, you'll have much better stopping and turning ability in cold/icy conditions. AWD will help you get going, but only the tires will help with stopping and turning. Last winter I used the stock 18" aero tires and had no more or less problems then previous cars. I can say the car is very smart about recovering from any slips. This year I plan on getting winter tires for the added safety.
• Chill mode and low regen. Tesla recommends you put the car in chill mode and low regen for slippery conditions. I did try that last year and quickly went back to normal settings. For one, in cold weather you already have reduced regen so setting it to low did nothing much. As for chill mode, I find I can easily modulate my acceleration for the conditions and don't really need the car restricting me. If you are having trouble, you may want to give those a try for yourself.
• Handling. The car is very good at handling wheel slip. It will accelerate without spinning the wheels. (there is a mode to allow slip if you need it to get unstuck) It is also quite good at recovering from back end slide outs. I found the RWD has a tendency to slide out a bit when starting an acceleration on ice. The first time it does it you think you are going to spin out, but it pulls itself back to straight almost before you can react. I have not driven the an AWD so I'll let someone else post how that handles.
• Reduced Range. Depending on the temperature you will have some range reduction. I would say most of the winter it was in the order of 20-30%. We had a couple days around -30F and range reduction was closer to 50% at that extreme cold. One of the biggest hits to your range is the cabin heat. If possible preheat while you are still plugged in. If you really need the range, use the seat heaters rather than the cabin heat. They require less power. The other factors are cold batteries and reduced regen. Some people have found that timing your nightly charging so that it finishes right before you leave in the morning will allow you to start with a warmer battery pack and give you more of your normal range back. People tend to dwell on reduced winter range as a drawback to BEV, but ICE cars also have reduced range in the winter.
• Defrost. The front window defrost has two settings. On the first press the icon turn blue and it directs cabin temperature air to the front window. On the second press the icon turns red and it directs full heat to the front window. I wish there was something in between. During snow storms the first setting is not enough to keep the window clean and the second setting is like having a hair dryer pointed at your face. Turning up the cabin temp does help the first setting.
• Instant heat. One of the very nice things about electric heat is that you don't have to wait for an engine to warm up before you get nice warm air coming from the vents.
• Sticking Charger Plug. In damp freezing conditions it is possible for the charging plug to get stuck and not release from the car. Tesla did put out an update last winter to help with that. If it does happen to you there is a release pull inside the trunk directly behind the charging port.
• Frozen door handles. I only had this happen once. I washed the car on a warmer day and did not dry the handles well enough. It took some determined pushing to get them to open. If you do have a situation where the handles are wet and you know you'll have freezing temp overnight, make sure you dry the handles off.

If you have any more tips, please add them to the thread.

 

[fgwinn]

If your door handles are frozen there is a good chance that the windows will be frozen in the up position and not retract when the door is opened. That happened to me last Winter and when I closed the door, the chrome trim (near the mirror) kinked a little. Fortunately it was the passenger side and I don't see the ding every time I get into the car.

 

[jamnmon66]

More options are almost always better. I'm pretty confident (aggressive?) in the winter and I wish I could turn down the traction control to have a bit more fun. But it'd be nice to have these options when I'm in a more mellow mood and I think a lot of people would prefer it full time.

KenC's idea is a great one to get some of what you're looking for easily.

 

[Colorado M3]

Colorado laws require chains when driving in winter conditions. Particularly I-70 to ski resorts. Get the chains, otherwise you may be subject to fines or not be allowed to travel.

 

[Colorado M3]

Colorado laws require chains when driving in winter conditions. Particularly I-70 to ski resorts. Get the chains, otherwise you may be subject to fines or not be allowed to travel.