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MCU2 Upgrade

Discussion in 'Model S' started by MurrayJimW, Sep 4, 2018.

  1. ahkahn

    ahkahn Member

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    Except billable labor hours and parts....

    That said, there is currently no incentive as their service centers are already overloaded, so adding more business to already saturated business doesn't make sense.
     
  2. dgatwood

    dgatwood Member

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    The answer lies in the first part of your post. An MCU is a complex part, and the cost of building a new manufacturing run of a computer using legacy (low-availability) parts is high—much higher than building it back when the SoC was still in volume production. It is almost guaranteed to be cheaper in the long run to design the new version to be a drop-in replacement, so that when you run out of your limited stock of parts, you don’t have to do a low-volume manufacturing run to cover your warranty obligations.

    I honestly don’t believe that switching MCUs will require any changes beyond using a different base image when flashing the MCU. But because you’re copying the data from the old MCU, a replacement would require Tesla’s software to handle migrating the old-format data to the new format, the lack of which would explain minor bugs like a missing VIN.
     
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  3. ucmndd

    ucmndd Active Member

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    There will never be an incentive, as they’d much rather simply sell you a new car.
     
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  4. Chaserr

    Chaserr Active Member

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    Even if that's 100% accurate and none of us want to buy the upgrade and instead get a new car every time upgrades exist, it still seems like there's a few hundred thousand used car buyers that would all eventually like to pay Tesla a few grand. That's a decent incentive, leaving money on the table when they're hurting for profit isn't smart and making your CEO publicly lie about things you do/don't sell is just stupid.
     
  5. mattack4000

    mattack4000 Active Member

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    Name another manufacture that would even give you an update after you drive it off the lot..
     
  6. ucmndd

    ucmndd Active Member

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    It’s not though. A few hundred bucks of profit per retrofit is not worth it if even a small fraction of potential clients end up buying a new car instead.

    It’s got nothing to do with demand. I’m sure many people would happily pay for it. But like I said, the incentive for Tesla simply doesn’t exist in the broader context. It’s expensive, high touch, disincentivizes new car sales, and overburdens already overburdened service infrastructure.
     
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  7. Chaserr

    Chaserr Active Member

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    It disincentivises trust in Tesla when the company and the CEO call each other liars regularly. This hurts real sales, as opposed to just refusing to make money on upgrades and hoping one of them buys a new car from that top-down truth-challenged company instead. This issue is reducing demand but it has nothing to do with people choosing to pay a few tens of thousands rather than a few hundred like you say. It's all about the company's local representatives proving that the CEO isn't trustworthy over and over.
     
  8. Lex

    Lex Member

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    There are 2 main thoughts for me...

    1. My MCU1 can just no longer keep up. A big feature of the car for me was the Browser but it's not working reliably anymore (works for ~20 minutes every ~10th reboot). Streaming audio stutters at times. Voice control works randomly.

    2. As a tech enthusiast, upgrading "car stereo" is something that's always been an option in previous cars, and as a computer enthusiast, upgrading a PC system is just something that I assume will be made available. I want to upgrade the carputer.

    So, #1, I'm not getting what I bought, but #2, I'm willing to pay for an upgrade. But, still left in the lurch without any upgrade or any news or info... that is the most frustrating part. As early adopters, we used to get thanked for putting out necks out on the line but now it seems we're getting ignored. Multiple software updates have been released (latest 2019.32.1 today) and my browser is still frozen "W(hite)SOD" most of the time.
     
  9. brkaus

    brkaus Well-Known Member

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    First of all, I doubt it will ever happen. Just because - I doubt it will ever happen.

    But I don't understand why the 5ghz WiFi antenna keeps coming up. Simply set the board to run WiFi in 2.4ghz mode. Done.
     
  10. Chaserr

    Chaserr Active Member

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    The CEO thinks it's already happening. I think it will become a commonplace upgrade once they have an MCU2 that isn't defective from the factory. The yellowing arbitration thread had some info from Tesla's lawyers indicating they have a newer revision they're working on and they wouldn't want to sell upgrades that will need to be fixed right away so it makes sense that they'd disallow upgrading until after factory MCU2 parts are no longer defective.

    5 GHz antenna is even less an issue than a software setting - if it's software enabled still, it won't matter because without the antenna it simply won't show 5GHz access points.
     
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  11. drklain

    drklain Member

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    Disagree. You are confusing the Screen with the Computer. No one questions that the screen can be (and has been) replaced with newer screens. The issue is replacing the MCU1 computer with an MCU2 computer. That has NOT been done because they drive things differently. To numerous to mention, but the most obvious is the fact the MCU2 computer drives the dashboard display as well, in an MCU1 car, a different computer drives the dashboard display (which is why we need to do the "push upper buttons and hold" to reset the dash display.

    Other than Elon's tweets, we have never seen confirmation that the MCU1 computer is up upgradable to MCU2 and this is further confused by discussions of upgrading the AP computer from AP2 to AP2.5 or AP3 or AP3+ at some point for people who bought FSD option. Again, the AP computer is NOT the same thing as the MCU computer.
     
  12. Chaserr

    Chaserr Active Member

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    MCU2 has a completely different display resolution. It's 1920 x 1080 on both model 3 and MCU2 S/X. You have to replace screen & Computer simultaneously. MCU1 has a different screen and resolution of 1920x1200. They are physically different and not compatible.
     
    • Disagree x 1
  13. SucreTease

    SucreTease Teslarian

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    Anyone who writes this kind of software writes it to handing both resolutions. The software queries the display for its resolution and sets up the display handler to use that.
     
  14. Chaserr

    Chaserr Active Member

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    Of course it handles both, there is only one firmware for all cars. I was addressing your assumption that the screen replacement and the MCU replacement were different. An MCU2 replacement is a screen replacement as well, and you didn't know that.
     
  15. SucreTease

    SucreTease Teslarian

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    You are confused. It wasn't my question.

    There is no technical reason why Tesla cannot make available an MCU upgrade by replacing the CPU board with an MCU2-equivalent daughter-board that uses the original MCU1 screen (and original IC1), meaning that they would not have to replace the screens. To say, "You have to replace screen & Computer simultaneously" is not accurate.
     
  16. brkaus

    brkaus Well-Known Member

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    Again, I don't think it will ever happen...

    I also don't see a technical reason that Instrument cluster "IC1" could not listen to MCU2. Sure, they simplified IC2 by making it a display and added a display port and the smarts in MCU2. But IC1 listened to the ethernet bus for info to display. MCU2 still has the ethernet port and could continue to put info on the bus.
     
  17. Chaserr

    Chaserr Active Member

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    I'm not confused. You brought it up for no reason. Whatever the reason was, I hope I helped you understand something new because the only possible reason I could imagine you bringing it up at all was because you didn't know already. And now you do. You're trying to keep the mistake relevant by suggesting that Tesla create a new MCU3 that is a sort of hybrid of MCU1 and MCU2 but to my knowledge nothing like what you're suggesting has ever been seen and you're the first to make that suggestion. Can you link to where you read about or saw the new hybrid you're talking about?
     
  18. SucreTease

    SucreTease Teslarian

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    My original response to you was to correct a erroneous claim that you made. I am not claiming that such an "MCU3" "hybrid", as you call it, exists; rather I am only stating that such an approach is technologically possible. The fact that you have not seen one is not evidence that such a part is not being developed, nor is its absence evidence that your erroneous claim is true. There are a lot of people on these forums who make statements that purport to be factual statements, but are, instead, mere opinion.
     
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  19. tyson

    tyson Member

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    @wk057 or @verygreen could probably confirm if they wanted to but my understanding from digging in and chatting with others is that it would be plug and play right now if you swap both MCU and IC. With MINOR software tweaks it would be plug and play for just an MCU swap too. No need for a hybrid part.... the IC communicates with the MCU over the ethernet bus which still exists in the same way on MCU2 as it does on MCU1, it's needed for other things like communicating with the gateway and the autopilot computer. As far as the new bluetooth and WiFi features go well those just wouldn't work. So no 5Ghz WiFi or bluetooth phone as key...

    The reason this doesn't happen is just like others have said. Service is already inundated and can't take any additional load. I'm pretty sure they are still trying to get enough mobile techs ready to do all the APE 3 retrofits.

    So... could they... yes
    Should they? yes
    Will they? probably not
     
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  20. verygreen

    verygreen Curious member

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    new IC2 does not need ethernet, it is jsut a dummy screen and the same 4 wire cable is repurposed as lvds screen signal carrier instead. This is why you need to replace the IC in addition to MCU
     
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