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Melbourne HPWC installation
- Thread starter Tasdoc
- Start date
Shock-On-T
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You will get 2.4kW charging rates from a power point.
The range/hr depends on your rate of consumption.
So that same 2.4kW might equate to 8km/hr for an X, 10km/hr for an S, 15km/hr for a 3.
You will also lose 5-10km range per day just with the car's systems (vampire drain).
You will be OK without an HPWC, but you won't be able to charge fast if you suddenly need more.
Also, you'll have to plug in more often, because with such slow charging it would be risky to let the car go below 50%.
The range/hr depends on your rate of consumption.
So that same 2.4kW might equate to 8km/hr for an X, 10km/hr for an S, 15km/hr for a 3.
You will also lose 5-10km range per day just with the car's systems (vampire drain).
You will be OK without an HPWC, but you won't be able to charge fast if you suddenly need more.
Also, you'll have to plug in more often, because with such slow charging it would be risky to let the car go below 50%.
I just had your electricians out today to install my wall charger in a single phase circuit. They set the max amps to 25 and not 32. When I asked why, they said Jetcharge does not set it to 32 to ensure it does not cause power issues when other things are running in the house. Is this true? They also went on to tell me the reason they take photos of the install is so if I change the settings Jetcharge does not have a warranty issue. Essentially telling me don't change the setting.
Keen to get your thoughts?
Not an electrical expert but I ran into the same issues with my install.
I understand that Aus/NZ wiring rules for “Continuous Loads” requires that the load be 80% of the breaker capacity. So if the breaker on that circuit is 32A then 25A is the 80% max continuous load.
I would be surprised if anything else was on the same circuit.
My 2c.
EcoCloudIT
Active Member
We ran a separate circuit on a 40amp cable/circuit breaker and cars obviously max out at 32amps (80%)....all is good for 40+ years.
EcoCloudIT
Active Member
oops, I meant all has been good for the past 4+ years.
I really need to stop posting from my phone without my glasses
Not an electrical expert either. I would have thought any load restriction would be relative to the circuit capacity (wiring) and not just the breaker though. Odd that they do not install a circuit that can handle the HWPC running at its full 32amps. Perhaps they are dubious about the rest of the household wiring?
Agreed, however other things running in the house on different circuits will load up the common mains connection. I can attest to this being a weak point that can overload and burn out, way before any of the circuits overload..
I don't think this is the case, or at least if it was it's not any more. My sparky installed a 32A RCBO (RCBOs are required for all new circuits now) and 32A wiring. He said the RCBO allows some wiggle room.
I've had no issues with it at all, get 32A charging every time. Although I gotta say, the cable from the HPWC to the car gets pretty warm.
EcoCloudIT
Active Member
Thanks for the feedback. They setup a new 32 amp circuit exclusively for it. My suspicion is they could not be bothered reopening the box and setting correctly. Of course I hope to be stood corrected. Maybe there is a rule to max out at 80% in Australia?
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Unfortunately I doubt it & I reckon your 25A setting was intentionally set by Jetcharge. The units ship in the 6A setting [1] which nobody is going to use. Once mounted and connected it needs to be switched to Test Mode [0] to check the install. If they had not bothered to reopen the box to re-position the switch back, you would not have a functioning unit as it would remain in test mode.
Be interesting to hear back from Jetcharge on this. If I was going to pay them top dollar for an install and only ever end up with 25A solution, I would definitely want to know this beforehand. HPWC becomes medium power MPWC if you do it via Jetcharge perhaps?
Yeah if this was not made clear up front, I'd be pretty mad with them. If the worst comes to the worst you can set it to 32A and get a different sparky to certify it maybe?
I was talking about the HPWC → Car cable, not the cable from the SWB to the HPWC. Mind you, it was a warm day when I felt it, so it might have just been the result of a hot garage.
EcoCloudIT
Active Member
Anyhow, with a 40amp cable and a 40amp circuit breaker I have the cars able to use 32amps inside without any issue....done this for the past 4+ years on the Model S. Recently sold the S and now have a 3 and X (both HPWCs have load balancing) so all is good in terms of they auto lower and increae the AMPs to a max of 32 combined.
Electrical Engineer here, and what jetcharge say is possibly BS. But here are 2 reasons it may have some truth....
Circuit breaker current ratings are sized to protect the cable in the installation. Not the load, and not the person. The HPWC and the car have their own protections against overload and the RCD part of the RCBO protects the person. If you have a 4mm^2 cable installed in a wiring enclosure (conduit) then they will need to reduce your current to 25A, However when I asked my installer to do it, I got him to install 6mm2 cable so I was comfortably able to run 32A and the install was overall slightly more efficient (no power loss on the cable). If they cheaped out and installed a smaller cable, then yes you are stuck at that lower current, but I'd be questioning why they did that when you asked for a 32A install.
The main thing that is likely at play here is Maximum demand. It is also the most likely reason they took photos. Maximum demand is the allocation you are given from your power authority. If you have 3 phase, in most jurisdictions, you are allocated 32A total. If there are multiple houses in excess of 32A it may cause damage to the utility company equipment and the installer is held liable. The catch is, if you have 3phase installed but a single phase charger, you are still limited to 32A per phase which means they would have to restrict you to 25A. I looked into it when I got my charger installed and getting a larger allocation is excessively expensive, so if that is the limitation then Jet charge did the right thing by you.
If your whole house is single phase, AND your utility company allows you to have a typical single phase MD of ~70-100A, and they didn't cheap out with 4mm or smaller cable, then I'm happy to call BS on that claim.
Circuit breaker current ratings are sized to protect the cable in the installation. Not the load, and not the person. The HPWC and the car have their own protections against overload and the RCD part of the RCBO protects the person. If you have a 4mm^2 cable installed in a wiring enclosure (conduit) then they will need to reduce your current to 25A, However when I asked my installer to do it, I got him to install 6mm2 cable so I was comfortably able to run 32A and the install was overall slightly more efficient (no power loss on the cable). If they cheaped out and installed a smaller cable, then yes you are stuck at that lower current, but I'd be questioning why they did that when you asked for a 32A install.
The main thing that is likely at play here is Maximum demand. It is also the most likely reason they took photos. Maximum demand is the allocation you are given from your power authority. If you have 3 phase, in most jurisdictions, you are allocated 32A total. If there are multiple houses in excess of 32A it may cause damage to the utility company equipment and the installer is held liable. The catch is, if you have 3phase installed but a single phase charger, you are still limited to 32A per phase which means they would have to restrict you to 25A. I looked into it when I got my charger installed and getting a larger allocation is excessively expensive, so if that is the limitation then Jet charge did the right thing by you.
If your whole house is single phase, AND your utility company allows you to have a typical single phase MD of ~70-100A, and they didn't cheap out with 4mm or smaller cable, then I'm happy to call BS on that claim.
My sparky used 4mm^2 cable for my 32A single phase. I did ask for the 6mm, but he said 4 is fine and rated at 32A. I guess I will get a little more power loss than if he had used the 6, but I would hope that the RCBO is protecting things and it's safe.
I spoke to Jetcharge and they apologised for the fact the electrician did not indicate he was going to install a 25amp install before commencing. I told them if I had known this I would have asked what is required (additional cost etc) to get the full 25amp install as I am the one living with the install for years to come.
I've included their response below where they discuss why it was done as it is and how they are rectifying it which I obviously want...
Jetcharge said...
"EV charger draws a lot of power and we recommend setting the charger at 25A for a single phase house to avoid overloading the switchboard. This gives around 35km an hour range and 32A charger gives around 50km an hour.
We recommend to leave the charger at 25A and see how it goes for a few weeks. If you think you are not happy with 25A then we will organise another visit to change the charger to 32A. If you would like to change the charger to 32A then we will need to upgrade your main switch to a current limiting device. We won't charge anything to change the setting for the charger but there will be a cost of $165 incl GST to replace the main switch with a current limiting device."
They are coming out Monday to replace. Looking forward to getting the full charging rate I was expecting. If 32 amps are ever an issue I can just reduce in the car if necessary.
