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Mercedes Benz B-Class Electric Drive

Discussion in 'Electric Vehicles' started by Adm, Jun 29, 2012.

  1. Adm

    Adm Active Member

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    German car magazine Automobilwoche reports that Daimler has placed an order to build the powertrain for a MB B-Class E-Cell, but also mentions a feasibility study.

    Maybe the German native speakers can take a peek at the article: Automobilwoche
     
  2. WhiteKnight

    WhiteKnight _____ P85 #549 _____ Sig Red / Sig White

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    It was reported that Tesla is supplying the powertrains for the B-Class. This is the powertrain contract that will exceed all other contracts combined.
     
  3. vfx

    vfx Well-Known Member

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  4. VolkerP

    VolkerP EU Model S P-37

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    The press statement mentions emission regulations and tax credits "mainly in the USA" as a reason to postpone a range-extended B-Class in favor of a pure electric one. In my opinion this sounds as another "compliance car", like the new Toyota RAV4 EV, to comply with regulations in the worlds seventh largest car market: California. So no, this is not the beginning of Daimler going EV with a mainstream car in a mainstream market in serious numbers. For Tesla, it still is a warm rain of money.
     
  5. dpeilow

    dpeilow Moderator

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    A compliance EV - even from Tesla - in California is a backwards step compared to a globally-available PHEV version of the car.
     
  6. WhiteKnight

    WhiteKnight _____ P85 #549 _____ Sig Red / Sig White

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    I think I heard on the Tesla conference call that the Benz EV would not be a compliance car but would in fact be price competitive with its ICE counterparts.
     
  7. VolkerP

    VolkerP EU Model S P-37

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    You seem to touch on the outrageous price aspect of "compliance cars" that is aimed to schreck off customers? If that's not the case on this car, great. Next thing we all want to see is planned number of production/sales and buy or lease only options.
     
  8. grisnjam

    grisnjam P6316

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    Mercedes to market Tesla-powered 2014 B-Class EV in U.S.

    It seems this rumor is firming up:

    Mercedes to market Tesla-powered 2014 B-Class EV in U.S.

    The full Tesla powertrain will be used in a B-class Mercedes Benz EV due in the US in 2014. Heres hoping for more then another 'compliance' car like the Honda Fit EV, Ford Focus EV, Toyota Rav4 EV ect, ect.
     
  9. widodh

    widodh Model S R231 EU

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    [troll mode]
    Will it do 3-phase charging? ;)
    [/troll mode]

    I saw the B-Class E-Call at the Geneva Motor Show of this year and I liked it. Normally I'm not a real fan of Mercedes, but this one looked nice, just like the new A-class.

    There is still a danger here for Tesla. Mercedes and other big car companies have a huge fanbase, those people might be waiting for their brand to release an EV before buying one.
     
  10. AnOutsider

    AnOutsider S532 # XS27

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    I wonder if they'll tweak the chassis to allow for a flat floor like the Model S, or just go with the stock chassis and stuff batteries somewhere? Is there any risk of Toyota or Daimler just reverse engineering whatever Tesla does and going it alone? Not that I think Daimler would (owning so much stake, and they seem to be doing this just to meet guidelines), but still...
     
  11. grisnjam

    grisnjam P6316

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    They have over 250 patents on the Model S alone, this is the benefit of doing what the big automakers would not. They can just pay Tesla later ;)
     
  12. WhiteKnight

    WhiteKnight _____ P85 #549 _____ Sig Red / Sig White

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    #12 WhiteKnight, Jul 5, 2012
    Last edited: Jul 5, 2012
    According to Wikipedia:

    Sounds like there is 20 cm of space in between the "sandwich" which would be a great place to put the Tesla "skateboard."

    Also read that the B-Class will be competitive in "cost of ownership" to its ICE counterparts, so this could be very compelling and not a compliance car.
     
  13. TEG

    TEG TMC Moderator

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    It price/performance/range work out nicely, I might switch from LEAF to B-class rather than wait for Tesla GEN-III.
    RAV4-EV performance, although OK, is not up to Tesla sports car standards. I wonder if B-class will accelerate briskly or be just run-of-the-mill due to issues such as small-pack-output-limits or desire to get low insurance ratings.

    LEAF was good for price vs practicality, but I am hoping for better performance and styling with my next EV.
    A little more range would be nice too, but I can't afford to pay for 200+ mile range right now.
     
  14. Lloyd

    Lloyd Active Member

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    Any word on timing or availability?
     
  15. doug

    doug Administrator / Head Moderator

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    As has been said, they're pretty much already set up with a flat floor. I am curious about the packaging, though.

    Here's the diagram for the plug-in hybrid version.
    Mercedes-Concept-B-Class-E-Cell-Plus-e05-800.jpg

    The fuel-cell version:
    27452725-623x415.jpg


    So I wonder what changed over the last year?
    Despite Tesla Tie, Daimler Moving EV Work In-House - AutoObserver
     
  16. dpeilow

    dpeilow Moderator

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    Shame Mercedes have moved away from the sandwich floor in the new A-Class.
     
  17. WhiteKnight

    WhiteKnight _____ P85 #549 _____ Sig Red / Sig White

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    #17 WhiteKnight, Jul 5, 2012
    Last edited: Jul 5, 2012
    Here is the main section of the Q1 Tesla Earnings Call where they discuss the Mercedes deal:

    When I re-read this in light of what we now know about the Mercedes B-Class it sounds like:
    • the B-class battery pack will share some commonality with the Model S battery pack - enough to help to some extent with economies of scale - maybe it's a smaller size "skateboard"
    • the contract is bigger than all the others combined which would mean the volume is bigger than all the others combined (especially since unit costs appear to be less)
    • the contract has the potential at some point to be 10x bigger than all their other contracts combined (measured in the billions of dollars and tens of thousands of units) - this clearly would be a significantly high volume vehicle if that were to take place
    This was the statement in their Q1 Earnings Shareholder Letter:

    So Tesla says the B-Class will have a cost of ownership on par with its ICE version. So sticker price will be higher but when you factor in the cost of gasoline it will be about equal.

    Sounds like it will be pretty sweet and might outsell the Model S once it is introduced.
     
  18. TEG

    TEG TMC Moderator

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    Tesla showed off a small motor unit for the front wheels of the AWD Model X concept. I wonder if they would use this on the front wheels of the B-class? A smaller, lower priced car might not justify the full ("monster") Model S motor package.

    But with that said, I hope they make it as powerful as they can get away with.
     
  19. WhiteKnight

    WhiteKnight _____ P85 #549 _____ Sig Red / Sig White

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  20. doug

    doug Administrator / Head Moderator

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    Depending on the details, I think it might actually compete with the Model S. A functional wagon with a Mercedes interior that's not as huge as the Model S. One assumes they'd have at least a 40 kWh battery pack.

    Here's a comparison of the dimensions:






















    B-Class Model S
    Wheelbase 109.4 in
    2,779 mm
    116.5 in
    2,959 mm
    Length 168.2 in
    4,272 mm
    195.9 in
    4,976 mm
    Width 70.0 in
    1,778 mm
    77.3 in
    1,963 mm
    Height 63.1 in
    1,603 mm
    56.5 in
    1,435 mm
     

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