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Message to Trump

Discussion in 'TSLA Investor Discussions' started by Ameliorate, Nov 10, 2016.

  1. Ameliorate

    Ameliorate Member

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    idea credit @SunCatcher
    Short-Term TSLA Price Movements - 2016


    I believe if there were an avenue to get a message to Donald Trump, the combined talent of this forum which does possess many informed and highly intelligent people could persuade him to go green, whilst still being in denial of climate change. I do not think it worth the effort to sway him on climate change and it could lose his interest in the remaining context of the letter.

    Things that might matter to trump:

    Comparing jobs created by solar vs coal.
    Cost analysis between using renewable and nonrenewable resources. Has technology matured enough that it costs less to generate electricity via renewables? (not including environment damage, health implications, climate change etc that's all fantasy in his world)

    How electric cars could positively impact the American economy
    -National power usage increase
    - More solar/storage to account for EV's
    -New factories (Ideally from multiple companies not just Tesla)
    - Huge for construction workers
    -New highly skilled jobs, engineers etc

    Products that can be exported
    Increase GDP


    His ego
    -If he is very successful with the economy and not environmentally friendly he stands to lose global and local respect.
    -If he is successful and green tech is a large portion of a growing America, he just might be revered as a great president after all. You don't have to believe the implications of Climate change to support green tech and watch it evolve into an extremely prosperous business.
    ~Wouldn't it be great if solely by pursuing profits and job growth that trump accidentally manages to meet or come close to Paris accord greenhouse gas reductions?

    -Does he really want to lose to China on green technologies?

    TLDR What can he do to grow the green tech industry and why should he.

    I don't know if Tesla should be a main discussion in the argument or if it should be left out entirely and just comment on the opportunities in solar/storage/EV's


    Is this worth pursuing? Am I correct under the assumption that green tech has finally surpassed fossil fuels? I want to do my little part to save our planet and help out our favorite company.
    I know there are many more eloquent than myself, if anyone wants to take a stab at it or a new format. Start adding deciding factors to the list/populating some of the questions with answers. Just maybe we can make a difference.
     
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  2. larmor

    larmor Active Member

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    Simpler version (just my 0.02): Energy independence can be achieved by solar. Will require large labor force and combined with US technical advances can compete or surpass foreign panel production in efficiency, reliability, and quality. Jobs created will be less harmful to the workers, previously in coal mining.
     
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  3. sundaymorning

    sundaymorning Active Member

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    I think the oil industry will be massively exposed if Trump attempts to fight clean energy head on. I believe the spotlight on this issue will essentially build a much needed public outcry against the corrupt establishment of oil and its massive subsidies. IMO the best thing to do is wait for Elon's tweet and follow his lead. From there, spread the good word to as many friends, neighbors, co-workers, FB, social media as possible. This is a big time issue and we need a big time leader like Elon to stand behind, without the voice of a powerful businessman/leader, Trump won't listen. Don't let me stop you from your good work though, I'm grateful there are members like yourself who would take the initiative. IMO If I were you, I'd save my time and energy so that it could be directed exponentially when the timing is right.
     
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  4. ev-enthusiast

    ev-enthusiast Active Member

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    Thanks for creating this thread @Ameliorate.
    Wanted to create a similar thread an found this one, amazing.

    I agree we have to take our chance to present some of the ideas shared in this forum with Trump as soon as possible. The sooner the better as there might be a lot of others that might want to present their ideas as well.

    In order to get some conversation started I would suggest to keep first message simple, just like:
    'You are looking for winners, look at what Tesla achieved during the recent years, get on board and sell the Tesla story as a true American success story'.

    I would suggest to add a list of names supporting the open letter to Trump/the new government.
    Additional names of supporters could be found via Twitter/Facebook and so on.

    As I am not a native English speaker, I hope that someone else with better language skills is getting involved in this idea.
     
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  5. SUMD

    SUMD Member

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    One of the primary reasons of me having recently given Tesla so much of my hard earned money for our hopefully soon to be delivered model X is the fact that the vast majority of the car is manufactured in the US.

    While at my local SC a couple of weeks ago, around 7:30ish AM, I peeked into the garage area and was struck by the number of technicians working on cars. I saw huge batteries, computers, even one of the earliest roadsters built!

    I took pride in knowing I had spent so much hard-earned cash on an American company, building a truly revolutionary American product, that has created so many US-based, blue-collar level jobs (that actually offers its employees great benefits!).

    If you think of Tesla's socioeconomic potential, not just with cars, but with batteries & roofs, there's some MAJOR job creation to be had by America's rapidly shrinking middle / blue collar class.

    Obviously it is fantasy (at this point) to imagine Tesla and Elon will course correct our economy and global warming, but from what I've observed, I was given much hope with regards to the job creation angle.

    When I think of the out-of-work coal miners for example, I take pause as I reflect on how these folks (and others like them), aren't skilled to do anything beyond what they had been doing in their respective, now obsolete industries. Then one logically wonders how to- for the lack of a better word- "repurpose" a huge block of America's middle class.

    Well, here arises the Tesla angle. Imagine how many folks can be put to work in towns and cities all over the US (and the world), working as installers, operators, repairmen/women, of Tesla products.
     
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  6. redruMKO

    redruMKO Member

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    Trump is obviously bad for climate related Tesla business.
    But he picks and chooses what to focus on.
    He might actually help in terms of AP legislation. " America has the best self driving car (for now), let's not waste this advantage!"
     
  7. AudubonB

    AudubonB Mild-mannered Moderator Lord Vetinari*

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    MODERATOR NOTE:

    As all should be very much aware, forum rules regarding Off-Topic posts and ranting,
    snarkiness, and other inappropriate comments have been relaxed during Election Week in the Investor Sector.

    That said, this interesting thread is new and of potential good value, and thereby is NOT going to be allowed such latitude. As such, I've cleaned it up already and will not be permitting any posts that are EITHER best presented elsewhere...or not at all. And I'm not going to take the effort to move them - they simply will be deleted, as already has happened. If that poster believes his or her post was otherwise meritorious - re-post it in its appropriate location.

    That is all.


     
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  8. SunCatcher

    SunCatcher Member

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    #8 SunCatcher, Nov 11, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 11, 2016
    Thanks for taking the ball and running with it. What else can we do, but to keep trying, right? If ever there was a case of needing to make lemonade from what we have been given, this is it. This is the opportunity of our time; to make or break, what is in our view, the most fantastic company of the century.

    I am afraid that Trump will not listen, because if he does, it will be seen as talking to the enemy (from the point of view of those who put him there). However, he has also shown that HE is the boss, and will not be told what to do or think (by those who helped him get to where he is now). Consider this; Donald Trump getting elected is just the first of many, many surprises ahead. Let's just hope that we get as many (or more) good surprises as bad.

    Mod edit: barely acceptable, and that only because I'm in a good mood. Keep TO TOPIC, all. Thank you.
     
  9. SunCatcher

    SunCatcher Member

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    I'm confused. Please explain, or demonstrate, what keeping to topic in this case would look like to you.

    Thank you.
     
  10. AudubonB

    AudubonB Mild-mannered Moderator Lord Vetinari*

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    This thread is about HOW TO CRAFT, and WHAT TO INCLUDE IN, a letter to the P-E. It is NOT about him.
     
  11. Driver Dave

    Driver Dave Member

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    I think the only way to understand the obvious "yes, this is how the future will work" of electric cars is to own one.

    So the best thing to do is: take up a collection, buy a Model S, and send it to him.

    With a note that says "Welcome to the future. Please make it happen."
     
  12. cpa

    cpa Active Member

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    I think our capitalistic society does not wish to take risks of unknown certainty. We want to keep on doing the same things over and over again, with the only improvements coming from small innovative steps from time-to-time. Much of the country from east of the Sierra Nevada to the Appalachian Mountains have been stuck with dying industries for any number of reasons--many of the reasons are from substantial increases in labor costs, improved technology, cheaper resources elsewhere on the planet, recycling, environmental awareness and industry consolidation.

    Mr. Trump cannot change most of these. He cannot take us back 50 or more years when we had logging, mining and other extractive industries humming along. He cannot force the auto manufacturers and others to repatriate jobs. He cannot force conglomerates like Wal-Mart or other box stores to return shopping to Main Street USA, where mom-and-pop stores lined the boulevard.

    Too many locations across this country were one-trick ponies. Once the logging dried up, or once the mine closed or once the manufacturing plant relocated or closed the jobs vanished. Mr. Trump cannot bring them back. Congress cannot bring them back.

    Instead, we have to look to the future. The future is most likely in alternative sources of energy and technology. He needs to direct his efforts to reeducating the public from intensive labor-driven jobs to more cerebral and light-manufacturing jobs that directly affect the way the world is heading. Just because great-great grandfather started working in the mine in 1893 does not mean that his 22-year old great-great grandson has to do the same thing. A few people get it. Regrettably, too many do not.
     
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  13. Ameliorate

    Ameliorate Member

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    @larmor While I greatly appreciate the safety for workers concerns, is this something you feel Trump can relate to or is concerned about?
    The angle I was taking was that this idea as a whole could be a really easy sell if targeted towards his interests. Make him think it's his own brilliant idea as to how he's going to make america great.

    I agree. If that were to develop, yes he would have a fight on his hands. I don't know if his anti climate bias is stronger than his will to create jobs and build the economy. His to be role of president is still to follow the will of the people, and the majority are concerned with climate change. U.S. Concern About Global Warming at Eight-Year High One way or the other I hope we prevail.
    The timing of such an effort could be significant though. Might as well prepare some ammunition, when we deploy it is another question. Peter Thiel just might be our avenue to relay the message to Trump!

    My time is cheap =) , don't know if I'll be able to afford the M3 reservation but we'll give it a year see where I stand. If I can't continue to pour money into TSLA to support the cause, maybe...I can do this! Whichever method you contribute, I certainly appreciate.

    While I was quite relieved to know trump owns a roadster, hearing Elon's comments on trump was a bit discerning. Tesla is most certainly an American success story, maybe one trump can get behind. Although if included in an open letter, you might have to also convince the general public. This has not been an easy task if you look to the stock price as any indicator and hundreds of FUD articles.

    Exactly, I think Elon has positioned himself very well for a trump presidency in this regard. If he could just temper his emotions towards climate and have a long chat about the business potential of Tesla and all the pride in Local business prospects...they could see eye to eye.

    Elon's goal was never to change the world by himself, but to inspire others to join in. Competition has been encouraged for the last ten years and has not stepped up to the plate in any significant way (In the US). If these billion dollar car companies bring their operations home, is there still good reason to build factories that manufacture components for ICE's? I hope they fear Tesla enough to consider this the right time to start building battery factories in the US, further validating Tesla and lobby for incentives to help them transition. Kinda OT.

    Yes they can be retrained. Sadly in my trade, true carpenters are becoming a rarity. There is a LOT to know if you want to have an understanding across all aspects of construction, much of which is outdated on a daily basis. So they specialize and take on one (of hundreds) , maybe two applications and that's Easy. To install solar roofing as your sole job would be a very simple task, which could probably be explained in a 10 page handbook and a 1 day course on safety/fall arrest. These would be very middle class jobs, paying 2-4X minimum wage. I would expect this to be fulfilled by contractors, who would teach a few employees the system and eventually hire more employees to work under them while being overseen by the contractor.

    Yes, not pushing for a 700% increase in solar among other green incentives like Hilary, while promoting American business could be a net neutral for Tesla. @AudubonB is very right to express concern of a trade war with China as this could skew the balance.

    @SunCatcher I think it was the lemon aid comment :)



    After replying to all these, how can we narrow our focus and what should it be on? Solar has been hit the hardest, it's also currently going to be Tesla's smallest initiative(?) behind EV and battery. What do we want from Trump? is it Solar+Battery instead of Coal?
    I'm leaning towards Tesla Motors being completely fine under Trump (trade wars being an exception)
     
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  14. Ameliorate

    Ameliorate Member

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    I like this a lot, making new jobs in a dying industry sucks and is hardly worth the effort. Forget renewable energy, how about renewable jobs ;) or jobs with a shelf life over 10 years.
     
  15. sundaymorning

    sundaymorning Active Member

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    Good luck and God speed. We need more people like yourself to take charge, the herd will eventually follow.
     
  16. toto_48313

    toto_48313 CAN P #5

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  17. GoTslaGo

    GoTslaGo Learning Member

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    Dear President-Elect Trump,

    I am heartened by your desire to build up our national defense as well as reinvesting in American infrastructure. I would submit that the newly merged company of SolarCity/Tesla will provide you with both.

    I am sure you probably remember an unfortunate blackout in 2003, which you may have experienced first hand:

    The 2003 Northeast Blackout--Five Years Later

    In that instance the offending culprits knocking out the grid for 50 million Americans were some tree branches. This bespeaks of the immense vulnerability of our nation's power supply and infrastructure. Imagine a not so innocent player or players who would wish to do the same thing for a much more nefarious intent. The article sites 11 deaths from the power outage caused by tree branches, imagine how many more if a group of people did this on purpose.

    Part of the solution would be this newly merged company. It will provide the ability to have solar power to homes and companies, with the ability to store the power in clean/sleek batteries which you can mount on any wall in a home or garage. This makes each home or building a veritable miniature power station, creating power from the sun. All the homes are connected via our existing grid, and the subsequent redundant power supply would make large scale blackouts a thing of the past.

    No terrorist would be able to target a single power line or power plant to cripple our nation. Each family, citizen and household would essentially be a part of a huge power generating network, keeping our nation safe and secure.

    You now have a tremendous opportunity to encourage this sea-change in the direction of this country. You have the bully pulpit now to inspire and encourage all Americans to be part of a strong grid of individual power generators, working together to ensure the security and infrastructure of our country, and way of life.

    Thank you,

    GTG
     
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  18. Ameliorate

    Ameliorate Member

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    From a climate change perspective, not fine.
    From a Tesla perspective.... every day they deny EV's, they do themselves (and humanity) a great disservice. Tesla will take as much market share as it can produce vehicles. You've gotta wonder what the incumbents breaking point will be.

    ??????? Trump insider: New administration won't attack renewable energy
    "“Everything with renewables continues; the credits will remain in place,” he said(trump insider)." bolding written by me
    We'll see if the Auto Alliance can put up a fight against ZEV credits.
    Still digesting this article Automakers Ask Trump To Ease Emissions Rules, EV Mandates - Get Ready For A War

    "During his campaign Trump also promised bring back coal jobs. That could be a tougher task. Even the Trump insider admitted that the candidate might have “oversold what he can do” concerning coal jobs. The closure of coal-fired power plants and the decline in domestically consumed coal has more to do with low natural gas prices than it does with the Environmental Protection Agency, he said.

    In fact, if Trump follows through with his pledge to spur $1 trillion in private sector infrastructure spending with $140 billion in tax credits that could further erode coal’s place in the nation’s generation mix by removing regulatory hurdles to the fracking of natural gas from tight shale formations. That, in turn, could lead to more pipeline infrastructure and more natural gas-fired power plants, especially if climate change regulations, such as the EPA’s Clean Power Plan, are challenged, which appears to be likely."


    I fully expected p-elect Trump to be a little more grounded from "campaign Trump". But this? I'm just confused, am I starting to like the guy? Tesla doesn't need billions thrown at it, just a fair shot.


    "The Trump Plan will lower the business tax rate from 35 percent to 15 percent, and eliminate the corporate alternative minimum tax."
    source - Tax Plan
    Trying to figure at what point this would be more beneficial than ZEV credits.
    I'm too exhausted to learn enough about ZEV credits at the moment
    Upside, nobody can claim Tesla gets unfair advantage/only profitable because of tax credits if lost.
    If ZEV credits remain, and taxes are reduced, Tesla stands to have an incredible future ahead of it.



    Support twitter accounts
    @MaryNicholsCA
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    Saving this link for later :rolleyes: Elected Officials | USAGov
     
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  19. AudubonB

    AudubonB Mild-mannered Moderator Lord Vetinari*

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    Mod Note:

    (not specifically directed toward any recent post; rather, this note is going to ALL active Investor threads).

    LAST day of tolerance toward posts that otherwise would have been, and are, unacceptable. One week of election-related wailing and gnashing of teeth and blaming it on others and overall unproductive posts is enough.
     
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  20. wycolo

    wycolo Active Member

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    > Once the logging dried up [cpa]

    Huh? This is a sustaining industry AFAIK. Solar driven at that.:)

    [a smiley a day keeps the moderator at bay]
    --
     

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