"Met the X" yesterday...meh

[Electroman]

X could have been the same style as the 5 seater Lexus RX 350, and it would have been cheaper and massive hit. That kind of design is simple, a ton of flat cargo space. Essentially same as 'S' with a much higher seating and great view.

 

[Superloud]

My P90D is working its way down the line, and I agree with djbakasan.

I would probably be more jazzed if I had bought a non-presenting door and non-FWD two years ago rather than having endured two years of "Didja get that car yet?" But, the vehicle is what it is, and I think it will work for my almost-empty-nest family.

i saw a post the other day by someone who mentioned spending $50k more than they should for the X. I know people are leasing and financing. I wonder if that affects their evaluation. Personally, and I'm not throwing rocks, I would not purchase such an expensive car if I had any difficulty coming up with cash. If I were being stretched financially, I imagine that every imperfection would stick in my craw. Just my 2 cents.

Indeed!
None of these comments really mean much without at least some context.
Are we people who routinely pay ~$100k for our vehicles and don't think the X is worth it?
Or are we people who can't really afford an X, and are just realizing that now, and just want to magnify the issues to justify why we actually "decided" not to buy one anyway?

I'll admit, I'm someone who could certainly afford an X. But, for a number of reasons, I've never actually spent more than ~$36k on a car.
I do really like cars. And I'm finally in a position, with 2 small kids, of being able to justify buying a bigger car. Given my tastes, that's pushing
me into higher territory. I'm like, I could go super practical, get a Honda Pilot, pay somewhere in the low $40s.
Or, move into the the BMX X5/Volvo XC90/Audi Q7 range...but I really want my next car to be an EV, and I hate the idea of spending that much for 17MPG.
The X was supposed to be my no compromise (except for price) option that could compel me to justify spending more than any of those other options.

But, I just don't know if it's perfect enough. It's a ton of money. Just because you can afford something doesn't necessarily mean you should.
Some of the statements about the X crushing everything else...well, for the price, the 70D isn't so amazingly fast, and the 220 mile range sounds a little
low if you want to drive up to Tahoe with a car full of people/stuff. The reliability concerns in my mind essentially add $4k to the cost of the car
(since I'd probably consider the extra 4 year ESA mandatory), so that inches the price up even more. And finally, it's such a rapidly changing sector,
batteries getting better, other competition may emerge, I just don't know if I'm all in on the X right now.

I'm not saying the X is a flop.
I'm saying, a lot of the conversation out there is that Tesla has a magical ability to coax people to spend way more than they usually would.
I feel like I'm squarely in that demographic. I really want(ed) it, I could afford it, if the product was so awesome, I probably would buy it, but...honestly I'm really on the fence.

It's almost becoming an all or nothing thing in my mind. Paying even ~60k for a ICE SUV just seems wrong - it's the worst of both worlds in terms of price and MPG.
It's like I should either just get an X, or go with a super practical Honda Pilot...or, just keep fixing my current car and wait...

I wonder if the X will "eat" market share out of the larger SUV category - but not by actually getting sales. But rather, by making people like me, who, if I was where I
am now in life 5 years ago, would have totally bought a luxury SUV, but now that I know the X exists, I can't buy an ICE SUV, but I also can't bring myself to
pull the trigger on the X.

 

[CarlK]

Indeed!
None of these comments really mean much without at least some context.
Are we people who routinely pay ~$100k for our vehicles and don't think the X is worth it?
Or are we people who can't really afford an X, and are just realizing that now, and just want to magnify the issues to justify why we actually "decided" not to buy one anyway?

That's a good point. Don't want to sound cocky but people who think the X is too expansive at $100K+ probably have never owned or looked at cars at this price level. A higher end Cayenne or Range Rover that has less performance and functionality would have costed much more than that. And when you say I could have bought a Lexus RX, c'mon that's a RX isn't it?

As for people who's moving up there is the precedent there. A lot of S owners came from Prius or Odyssey. They just see it as a lifestyle change instead of extra spending. Spend a little more on the car you enjoy to dirve but perhaps a little less on travel or going to movies for example. Another example is no one have thought buying a $700~800 phone every few years is a sane thing to do before the iPhone came out. Now most believe that's money well spent for the new lifestyle it brought onto the table.

I would never want to buy a $180K Cayenne Turbo S but a ludicrous X is a different story. Cayenne is just an expensive car but the X is a life style change. I should know. I own an S too.

 

[PeteP]

I'm confirmed P90D and have concerns around reliability of the falcon wing doors and auto present doors over the long haul. I'll agree w/ the sentiment that there are things that feel far too over engineered. But auto purchasing is in many ways so clearly subjective. Some of the precise things that others have sighted as a deterrent and something they'll lump together as evidence of a "flop" are in turn some of the things that I find most attractive. I *like* the nose cone, so much more than the Model S. I think the sizing is spot on for my needs and my admittedly small family--just enough space and interior cargo but able to haul my daughter and a few friends, yet still easy enough and non-intimidating feeling for my diminutive wife of 5'1" to be able to feel comfortable driving.

Tesla has TONS to prove over the long haul. But the correlation between "nope, just not right for me" to therefore mean "Tesla has a flop on their hand, time for doom and gloom!" seems so overly dramatic.

Perhaps it's a bit overly dramatic, however, if you read other threads you get the sense that a large number of reservation holders are not converting their reservations to orders. If the people who shelled out $5,000 to get in line are not enthusiastically ordering, then you may have a real problem on your hands. Personally, I reserved in January 2015, but I am extremely reluctant to order because I think it's kind of ugly. I've had my Model S for over 2 1/2 years and people always comment on how great the car looks. Everyone I know that has seen the Model X thinks it looks like a glorified BMW 535GT. That's not a good comparison. If Tesla moves quickly, they can fix it, however, if this car gets publicly labeled as a flop, it's over.

 

[Zroiron]

X could have been the same style as the 5 seater Lexus RX 350, and it would have been cheaper and massive hit. That kind of design is simple, a ton of flat cargo space. Essentially same as 'S' with a much higher seating and great view.

You would never have the thrill of passing gas (stations)!:biggrin:

 

[lowcarbondiet]

I met the X today in NJ and was able to take it for a spin - I thought it was awesome. Spacious inside the 6-seater, which is what I ordered in December. I changed the settings to have it drive like a 90D (also what I ordered), and the driving was fantastic. Can't believe how much pick-up it has for such a big car. The glass roof is also great, and was plenty dark to block the full overhead sun (my friends who came along to ride in the 2nd row thought so, too). FWDs operated perfectly on the one I drove, as did the seats. The seats on the one inside that people were exploring were kind of wonky. I'm 6'3" and was quite uncomfortable in the 3rd row - I won't be sitting back there, but seemed decent enough for anyone up to 5'8" or so in the 6-seater (the 7-seater I saw made that 3rd row look really cramped). With the 3rd row folded down there is way more cargo space than I will need. The 2nd row was very comfortable and I would have no problem sitting there. Car is definitely wide - will be interesting with my garage and may need to fold the mirrors to get in/out. Overall I was very impressed and very glad I had ordered the 6-seater - I'm excited for when they start producing the 90D's and I can actually take it home.

 

[MrBoylan]

It's almost becoming an all or nothing thing in my mind. Paying even ~60k for a ICE SUV just seems wrong - it's the worst of both worlds in terms of price and MPG.
It's like I should either just get an X, or go with a super practical Honda Pilot...or, just keep fixing my current car and wait...

I know exactly what you mean. I could "afford" to buy an X in that I wouldn't need to take out a loan for it or touch our retirement accounts, or have to eat mac and cheese more often than we already do. It would make a big dent in our liquid assets, but it was manageable. But I tend to be a frugal guy in most things. I have only ever bought one new car before in my life, and it was a similar situation. When Toyota announced the Highlander Hybrid, I *had* to have it. I hate the idea of losing loads of $$$$ just by driving off the lot with a new car. But I wanted a hybrid and I wanted 7 seats. And that was the only choice. I got in line, waited a few months for them to get to stores and wrote a check for around $47K including tax and extended warranty, etc. And I drove off the Toyota lot with a big smile on my face (maybe not a Tesla grin, but it was close). Still driving it today, almost 11 years later.

Six or seven years after we got the Highlander, I started hearing about and reading about Tesla and finally went to test drive a Model S in 2013. Love at first drive! I wanted to get one, but then heard about the Model X and thought: this is it! 7 seats, fully electric, falcon wing doors, etc. I *had* to have it. I put down a deposit and began the long wait. I was a little disappointed about the non-folding middle seats, and the tight-feeling 3rd row in the 7-passenger configuration. But I was still excited to get it. I confirmed my order after riding in and playing around with one at the launch event. But a niggling concern was growing for me: the width. Seeing numbers on a web page is one thing, but actually trying to fit a Model S down and around our driveway was a harrowing feat. Knowing the X is 5 inches wider eliminated it from consideration. I don't expect this to be an issue for most people (with normal-sized driveways) but it was a show-stopper for us. But now that I cancelled (and got my deposit back, thankfully), I have no interest in buying something else. Driving a Tesla literally spoiled me from considering anything else... except another Tesla. Although it does look pretty sweet, I'm not interested in a Volvo XC90 plug-in hybrid (it too would be a super tight fit for our space), and the other EVs on the market today are just too limited in range for our needs. So we'll squeeze another couple of years and 20,000 more miles out of the HiHy and hope that the Model 3 will be a significantly smaller car than the S and X.

Your decision will be based on your own preferences, of course. And no one can make up your mind for you. But I would say don't let the perfect be the enemy of the amazingly good. Yes, the middle seats don't fold flat. And yes, there have been some glitches with the early Model X samples. And yes, you might need to bring it in once in a while for service (probably mostly minor stuff, from what most Sig owners are saying). But it's a 6 or 7 seat super-safe rocket car from the future which offers a driving experience unlike anything else on the road, a tiny environmental footprint (particularly if you have solar panels), frequent improvements and fixes via software updates and the coolest doors and windshield ever made. Will it have lost 40% of its value in three years? Probably. That's a little better than average, and Tesla does seem to depreciate slower than comparable cars. Will the Model X of three years from now be better than the one they're delivering today? I would certainly hope so. I wouldn't worry too much about the battery tech making a current car obsolete. Lithium Ion batteries are the only tech that make sense right now for EVs, not just because they offer a decent performance to weight ratio and relatively low cost (both of which are getting better), but because they've been field tested for years in the demanding automotive environment. And Tesla is squeezing about the best long-term performance out of its batteries. If/when your X range gets low enough that it's problematic for you, replacement packs will probably be much cheaper and will offer even greater range. That Netherlands study on the Model S showed that the Tesla battery pack only loses about 6% in range after 50,000 miles and another 1% per additional 30,000 miles. With those numbers, a Model X 90D should still have over 200 miles of range after 500,000 miles of driving. For me, that would be 45 years of use, so I'm guessing other parts might need to be replaced before that.

But if you get a Model X now, you and your family will get to enjoy something that is quite unique instead of waiting or settling for something that you just know represents even more of a compromise. It's up to you whether that enjoyment - and the good feels that come from driving a car without direct emissions and supporting a visionary company with a mission to change the transportation world - is worth that monetary investment. Best of luck with your decision.

 

[johnnyduval]

My 12 month journey has also just ended in cancelling my order here in Germany. March last year when I placed my deposit I was quite excited and even bought some Tesla shares. Obviously the only information I have had since then (you get nothing from Tesla) has been on this forum, and combined with the European prices released this week, and huge production delays, has been enough to put me off.

Sounds like it's probably quite a nice car overall. I don't think the looks are *stunning* but more kinda average jelly mould. My kids are old teenagers so I don't need the funny doors and the 7 seats.

Unfortunately due to the weak €uro and some rather "enthusiastic" exchange rate pricing from Tesla a well specced MX is €172.000 ($188,000) and scarily this is only the Signature prices so it could get worse??? (not sure I followed the Sig pricing thing very well).

Like I say, it sounds quite nice, but not €172.000 nice - especially as we won't get them until 2017 and the market *may* be close to getting some competition that year (or maybe not).

 

[CaliX]

I get that 100K is a big pill to swallow for a lot of people. I have been going back forth between getting a Range Rover or an X. It comes down to this for me the Range Rover inside is boring and it's the place I will be looking at the most. I have a few friends who have the X now and they get a lot of positive feedback on appearance of the X (Los Angeles is big on appearance ) So the versatile X it will be. I do get if you don't want to spend 100K+ on a vehicle but I am pretty sure the X will not be a flop.

 

[CarlK]

I get that 100K is a big pill to swallow for a lot of people. I have been going back forth between getting a Range Rover or an X. It comes down to this for me the Range Rover inside is boring and it's the place I will be looking at the most. I have a few friends who have the X now and they get a lot of positive feedback on appearance of the X (Los Angeles is big on appearance ) So the versatile X it will be. I do get if you don't want to spend 100K+ on a vehicle but I am pretty sure the X will not be a flop.

A lot of people in the Bay Area don't blink an eye buying a $100K, or a more expansive car. I've seen three new Ferarris passing through an intersection in Palo Alto (or Menlo Park?) within a couple minutes. Model S is dime a dozen here. No way the X, arguably an even more desirable car than S, could be a flop.

 

[Nototrader]

I think this thread has gone in two different directions. If you look at my first post, I certainly wasn't bashing the X as I am picking one up next week. And I thankfully am not stretching myself to get it. I was giving my initial first impressions while stating clearly that I was not able to test drive one and at the end of the day, that is the most important thing. But I do think that tesla over engineered certain aspects of the car and may have to make changes in the near future. Just an opinion.

 

[AnOutsider]

"Met the X" yesterday...meh

I'm always baffled by this type thread, mostly because nobody can ever name a similarly-dimensioned CUV out there with the same specs as Tesla but better overall carrying capacity. Not to mention the performance, which is unmatched by CUVs that cost 100k more.

I'm not sure how a hair higher quality interior can counteract the unique features of the MX. And when you say unique, it is quite literal because no other production car, no matter how pricey, even has many of its features or performance.

On paper yes... Reality doesn't always match up. "want it, but don't love it" was our reaction too. Probably in part due to the series of disappointments leading up to it. In the end though, we're giving the X tbe ole college try. It has enough to make it an amazing vehicle... just falls short on things that should have been easy hits.

*edit* my tablet crashed when I was typing this post last night and when I booted up chrome tonight it finished the POST. Thread has moved on since then, apologies

 

[KyP85D]

After having our model s for a year we really wanted to love the X. It would be replacing our Yukon xl. The real killer for us was towing capacity for our boat. We ended up going with a Land Cruiser.

 

[eddiemoy]

how come you didn't get to drive it? is it not the meet the model x event? i had a crap load of issues with my model s and i had mine delivered almost a year after the launch. but it was all painless since tesla service is like no other. i don't mind being on the bleeding edge of technology this is what i'm paying for. there are those that will hate it for what ever reason, it isn't going to please everyone. if you don't like it, move aside for the next person. i heard it all... its too small, its too big, its over engineered. who gives a crap.

all i want to know is if it is the safest car that i can put my family in? why yes it is...

is it the fastest suv on the planet? why yes it is....

will it have any issues, probably, but it will be just as painless to service as the model S, so who cares.

 

[maratd]

I just got back from checking out the X in NJ. For those that want to see the 7 seater, you have to ask nicely and wait, they do have one available, but I believe they're using it for test drives.

Honestly, if I was asked to improve upon the car ... maybe just a tad larger so there's a bit more space for the 3rd row and for the 2nd row to fold flat somehow? But those are small quibbles and may not even be feasible.

This is a good car if you need to move a moderate number of people. It is absolutely not for everyone, but I think it will be a good fit for my needs. I finalized my order today.

I was surprised by how deep the "hidden" storage space is in the trunk. It's quite deep and it's hard to see that in pictures. The LCD screens used are also very high resolution, I didn't expect that. Everything else seemed as described in videos, etc.

 

[Oceanwolf]

If the threads like this continue, I will be able get my X70D sooner. I suggest we continue to bash Model X to prevent the P90D and 90D orders to be confirmed.

Sorry, I have been reading too many of these lately.

Onur

 

[Nototrader]

how come you didn't get to drive it? is it not the meet the model x event? i had a crap load of issues with my model s and i had mine delivered almost a year after the launch. but it was all painless since tesla service is like no other. i don't mind being on the bleeding edge of technology this is what i'm paying for. there are those that will hate it for what ever reason, it isn't going to please everyone. if you don't like it, move aside for the next person. i heard it all... its too small, its too big, its over engineered. who gives a crap.

all i want to know is if it is the safest car that i can put my family in? why yes it is...

is it the fastest suv on the planet? why yes it is....

will it have any issues, probably, but it will be just as painless to service as the model S, so who cares.

I think it was for people that ordered the car. Test drives weren't available. I guess they don't need to convince you at that point.

 

[Red Sage]

OK, a show of hands... How many of you were hoping the Model X would be a prettier, fully electric, modernized replacement for a Buick Roadmaster Estate, Volkswagen Vanagon, or Pontiac Aztek?

 

[FarmerDave]

X could have been the same style as the 5 seater Lexus RX 350, and it would have been cheaper and massive hit. That kind of design is simple, a ton of flat cargo space. Essentially same as 'S' with a much higher seating and great view.

Not for me.

I needed a six seater. If five seats were sufficient I would have purchased a Model S and had my car much sooner.

I also sought the safest possible car to put my grandkids in, and the falcon wing doors so that I could load my granddaughter into her car seat without the bending and twisting that my back can no longer handle.:tongue:

 

[djbakasan]

All the back and forth reaffirms my belief really. There is no one single car that is going to tick all the boxes. It just isn't feasible. There's tons of things about a car that makes them mutually exclusive for whether it works for you or not. Seating. Cargo. ICE vs electric. Range/milage. And that's all before we even get to subjective things like looks. It's totally OK for the X to not be the right car for everyone or that there's folks who are disappointed. To get the car to market, Tesla made some decisions that are going to draw some in and deter others. Playing armchair CEO and shuffling the choices is just going to mean that you change up who gets pulled in and who gets alienated.

I still think it's crazy this early on to be tossing notions of "flop" or any other such doomsday prophecies, which I get, isn't what many are saying here. In fact, of all the press stories I've read of the "Meet the X" events, they've all been largely glowing of the ones I've read. The sky is falling camp seems largely contained to the various Tesla forums and is, I theorize, our own doing via our neurotic slash compulsiveness about talking about the car for years waiting in anticipation and being largely met with silence. If there's anywhere I'll fault Tesla and give them abysmal scores on, it's not their design or decision making around the X, it's been around their communication and control of misinformation about the X.