I am far more impressed by an athlete that wins medals in 2 different sports than someone who wins 2 in tiny variations of the same thing.
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I am far more impressed by an athlete that wins medals in 2 different sports than someone who wins 2 in tiny variations of the same thing.
That said, the guy who wins the decathlon might be a more impressive athlete than a swimmer that wins 5 individual gold medals like Phelps did in 2008.
What is impressive about Phelps is that he has gold medals from a span of 8 years.
But it's super hard to repeat in the decathlon because if you make a mistake and foul out of any one of 10 events you can't win or even compete ( see Bryan Clay who got silver in 2004 and gold in 2008 but then fluke fouled out at the 2012 olympic trials and doesnt get a chance in 2012 ).
Ok, so I'm confused by this.
Boat A - Jim and John win gold 2 man canoe
Boat B - Jim wins gold 1 man canoe
John's accomplishment is meaningless? Or Jim's first accomplishment is meaningless but John's is not (because it's not "duplicative")?
This must be the new math I keep hearing about with modern SATs.
They are both medal winners, grats. John is unlikely to be a better athlete than Jim. Do I take Jim's performance as proof that he is better than John? Nope.
1 man canoe and 2 man canoe are different, but not very different.
I am still more impressed by an athlete that wins 2 medals in 2 very different sports.
But you are distracting from what I said about relays. A relay is still just a series of individual races.
If Joe wins the 1 man canoe and the serial 1 man canoe relay with someone else - Joe is not proven better than someone who wins just the 1 man canoe.
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rolosrevenge
Dr. EVS
I used to run the 4x100m relay in high school, we won second in our state (a pretty meaningless accomplishment). The relay team is in fact much more than 4 individuals. You have to have exchanges. Exchanges have to be perfectly synced or you can be disqualified. Our relay team practiced together, sat next to each other on the bus, hung out in school, and did lots of other activities to build a camaraderie. We beat many other teams who had faster individual people because we were a much better team. Ultimately, the only reason we lost, is because I botched the hand-off. I was thinking too much about running my fastest leg ever (which I actually did), and not enough about making the perfect exchange. Don't belittle the accomplishment of a relay team. True, you need four of the top people, but you need more than that.
Rather than argue with you about the work required to handle the hand-offs during a running relay - I will just stick to disrespecting swimmers.
Swimmers don't have to do jack on the exchange, just jump in the water.
rolosrevenge
Dr. EVS
Ah, well that's a different story all together then. For a 4x100 though, we would spend hours every week just on practicing the handoffs. And then you have little tape marks you set on the track, one for where you start outside the exchange zone, and one for when your teammate crosses, you turn and start running at full speed, while listening for the "hit" that he'll yell when he wants you to reach backwards. All without looking of course, you've got to be in your fastest sprint headed forward, any delay and you're toast. You have to have the most perfect trust and confidence in your teammate which comes from the hours of practice.
See, this is great. I've now gone several hours without pining for when my Model S will arrive...
DAMMIT!!!!!!
bonnie
I play a nice person on twitter.
bonnie
I play a nice person on twitter.
It would be really funny if another mod moved bonnie's post to somewhere ... unusual ... for no good reason.
Who let you in here?
gg_got_a_tesla
Model S: VIN 65513, Model 3: VIN 1913
It would be really funny if another mod moved bonnie's post to somewhere ... unusual ... for no good reason.
Yes, I think it belongs in "Random chitchat"
My 2 cents: despite all the points discussed, 22 medals spanning 4 Olympics, 18 of them gold is simply astounding! He has repeatedly and convincingly beaten extremely talented and well-trained rivals from nations with a proud swimming ethos.
I'd be surprised to see this bettered in the next 3 or 4 decades if not longer!
rolosrevenge
Dr. EVS
Yes, I think it belongs in "Random chitchat"
My 2 cents: despite all the points discussed, 22 medals spanning 4 Olympics, 18 of them gold is simply astounding! He has repeatedly and convincingly beaten extremely talented and well-trained rivals from nations with a proud swimming ethos.
I'd be surprised to see this bettered in the next 3 or 4 decades if not longer!
Phelps was clearly the best swimmer in the world from 2003 to 2008. He lost multiple times between 2008 and 2012. In 2012 I would argue that Ye Shiwen, Sun Yang, and Missi Franklin all had performances that were as impressive as Phelps ( all won 2 gold medals in individual events, and only Phelps did not set world records doing so ) - so I don't think he can claim to be the best swimmer in the world this year. But even if you think he is the best swimmer in the world, and that spans 9 years:
Al Oerter won olympic gold in discus 4 olympics in a row.
Carl Lewis won olympic gold in the long jump 4 olympics in a row as well as 100m and 200m two in a row.
Yelena Isinbayeva was by far the best pole vaulter in the world from 2003 to 2009 winning 2 olympic gold in a row and a bronze this year - but also won the 2012 world indoor championships.
Many other athletes were the best in their sport 3 olympics in a row - but they only won as many gold medals as their sport allowed.
The record he beat: Larisa Latynina's might be more impressive. She won a medal in every event she entered in 3 olympics - and has more individual medals.
Just because swimming hands out so many medals for variations in length and stroke and relays doesn't make Phelps better than any of those athletes.
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