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Michelin A/S 3 feedback at 8,000 miles

Discussion in 'Model S' started by Firewired, Mar 4, 2016.

  1. Firewired

    Firewired Member

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    I know that there have been a ton of threads that have at times seemed very emotionally charged regarding the optimum wheel size and right tire for our cars.. I know, I tried to read through as many as I could when I was trying to decide about sticking with the PS2s that my P85D came with or switching to someone else. I now have about 8,000 miles on the A/S 3s I switched to and want to provide feedback that I hope might be useful to anyone going through a similar line of reasoning. My car was a December delivery P85D which came with the staggered setup PS2. I absolutely loved the faultless grip of the PS2s, but several factors lead me to consider changing tires:

    -Fragility - My tire developed a sidewall bubble without any impact that I perceived, and had heard many reports of rim damage from the low sidewall tires not being able to protect the rims from minor impacts with the weight of our 5,000# cars.

    Treadlife - In the staggered setup, the PS2s are only officially rated for 10,000 miles, though I was able to get double that.

    Cost - The PS2s at the time were coming out to near $600/tire after tax compared substantially less then the other tires I was considering Michelin Pilot Super Sport and All Season 3s. (Though now they are listing for almost $200 cheaper.)

    My fear was that I didn't want to give up much in performance. I really loved the way in the D the PS2s never seemed to slip, they seemed glued to road without any slip. Ultimately after much rumination I ended up downsizing to the TST Tportline 19" and putting the Michelin A/S 3s. I was especially swayed by talking to the guys at Tire Rack that told me the A/S3 performed very close to the Michelin Pilot Super Sport (one of my favorite tires) with the added benefit of better tread life.

    now, after driving on the Pilot Sport A/S 3s for 8,000 miles I can say they are absolutely a great tire 9/10 of the time, with decent road holding in the dry and awesome performance in the wet, but for me I will be switching back to the PS2s, Pilot Super Sports or some other tire that anyone suggest that I consider. Where our cars really shine is in laying down instant torque and that is where the A/S 3s falter. I cannot stomp on the pedal in Insane, and soon to be Ludicrous with feeling tire slip. I have felt this both from off the line as well as when trying to overtake if you maximally accelerate the tires give up the ghost the traction control will blink before catching. If you dial it down one notch the tires are faultless and hang in there. I have likewise felt the tires loose grip when going through a sweeping 180 turn that the tires suddenly and not incrementally loose grip. These are all things I never experienced with 20k miles on the PS2s.

    These are just my opinions / experience, hope some may find it useful.
     
  2. AmpedRealtor

    AmpedRealtor Active Member

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    The A/S 3 also result in lower efficiency and higher Wh/mi because they are not low rolling resistance (LRR). I've noticed a 5% increase now that my tires are past the first 1,000 miles. The increase was closer to 10% when the tires were brand new.
     
  3. randall_s

    randall_s Member

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    @AmpedRealtor Are you saying the A/S 3 (all season) is 5% higher than the PS2 (a summer tire)? I would expect the summer tire to have lower efficiency than the all season.
     
  4. AmpedRealtor

    AmpedRealtor Active Member

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    I'm saying it is higher than my previous tire, the factory installed Primacies.
     
  5. AmpedRealtor

    AmpedRealtor Active Member

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    PILOT SPORT A/S 3 NOT RECOMMENDED!

    After only 15,000 miles my A/S 3s need replacement. My previous tires, the factory installed Michelin Primacies, lasted just over 40,000 miles with no issues. I was told by Tesla that my A/S 3s have become scalloped/feathered, and Discount Tire (where I purchased) looked at them and concurred. I will be getting a credit pursuant to the Michelin tread life warranty from Discount Tire and will be going back to the Primacy. I'm down to 3mm after only 15,000 miles, from 7mm when new. I drive conservatively and tires have been rotated every 5,000-7,000 miles as recommended. I had my alignment done 8 months ago at my last annual and had it done again 2 weeks ago after the tire issues popped up, where it was only slightly out of spec and not enough to cause the issues I'm seeing. Suspension was checked and there is nothing out of the ordinary going on.

    Despite having the same tread life rating as the Primacy, there is something very different about the Pilot Sport A/S 3 in the way that they wear on a RWD Tesla. Never again.

    The tire I am referring to is the Pilot Sport A/S 3, ultra-high performance all-season.
     
    • Informative x 1
  6. Firewired

    Firewired Member

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    I had the same experience. My A/S 3's lasted only about 17k with religious rotation every 5k miles. This is compared to my OEM staggered 21" PS2s which got 22k miles with no rotation. I was very dissapointed. I was also given credit for the premature wear by Michelin and went into non-staggered 21" Pilot Super Sports.
     
  7. AMPd

    AMPd Active Member

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    Whoever said the A/S 3's were close to the same performance as the Super Sports should get smacked upside the head for such a lie.

    If by close he meant they are both round tires, then yes.
     
  8. silver00

    silver00 Member

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    Interesting to see all of the negative feedback on this tire. I think it may have to do with the 21" diameter of the wheels which really does place unique demands on the tire.

    I have the AS3+ on a 2007 Chrysler 300 SRT8 in 255/45/20 and absolutely love them. It's a completely different use case being a RWD car for which I am most concerned with cool, wet weather traction, but they have been awesome for that.

    That being said, when I got 21" wheels on the S I ordered Pilot SS for them (they are my summer config).
     
  9. Firewired

    Firewired Member

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    In may case I downsized from my 21"s to non-staggered 19", and put them on the TST rims from TSportline. My goal was to have a similar appearance to my original 21"s, but get the better treadlife, and hopefully near the similar traction of the original PS2s. I got neither. I couldn't figure it out and was perplexed, the tires not only didn't last near their longer advertised treadlife, they actually wore out quicker, this was despite babying them with the recommended rotations which I couldn't do on the staggered wheels. On top of that the original tire traction was not bad, as well as the wet performance was really decent, but by 7k miles the tires frequently lost grip from a start.
     
  10. sorka

    sorka Active Member

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    Folks let's not confuse the as3 with the as3+ which are a totally different tire.
     
  11. Firewired

    Firewired Member

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    I know for me, the tire I got and was talking about was the Michelin Pilot Sport A/S 3 in size 245 45 R19 all around.
     
  12. randall_s

    randall_s Member

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    A few data points on the A/S 3+. I took a round trip on the interstate about 207 miles total. Took the first leg pre-warmed. Parked all day and returned.

    Trip 1: 30F-36F, 70 mph, 350wh/m
    Trip 2 (return): 65F-50F, 70 mph, 326 wh/m

    Extra info: Arrived with 53%. Moved vehicle once to different parking spot. Return trip started with 52% and ended with 10%, using a total of 70.2 kwh for a trip average of 339 wh/m. Total trip was 207.1 miles.
     
  13. yobigd20

    yobigd20 Well-Known Member

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    My 19" 255/45ZR19 Michelin Pilot Sport A/S 3 lasted 45k miles on the 19" Tsportline TST's. Yes they scalloped which was annoying towards the end but that was due to me rotating every 12-15k miles or so. I very highly recommend this tire as the grip is superior to even summer tires. And if I recall the tire reviews themselves they actually outscored all the summer tires too. This tire is really a summer tire, I don't know why they classify it as all season. They absolutely suck in snow and ice though so make sure you only use it as a summer tire. Don't know why you all are getting short 15k out of them.
     
  14. randall_s

    randall_s Member

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    The A/S 3+ has relatively good (7.9 good) snow and ice ratings on tirerack compared to the A/S 3 (4.8 fair).
     
  15. randall_s

    randall_s Member

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    Yesterday it warmed up (high of 85 F), and I got 309 wh/m mostly on the highway between 70 and 75 mph with a few quick overtakes and one pit stop. I was initially a little concerned about this tire not being LRR, but I can live with those numbers if they hold.

    About half way through the trip, I started feeling the rear end "bounce" and I figured my tire pressures were too high. I had added some air a few days before to deal with 30 F temps and now they were exceeding 50 psi warm. When I pulled off the exit, the pressure rose to 52 psi. I suppose this is because there was no longer air flow to cool them. I removed a few pounds of pressure. The "bouncing" stopped and the efficiency was not affected.

    The grip on these tires is amazing, especially on wet roads. It's uncanny how well they stick to wet pavement. They're a little noisy, but not annoying. Coming from PSS on 21's, they don't feel as stable at highway speeds, but they may just need rebalancing.

    IMG_20170228_183057.jpg
     

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