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Mid-range changes in range or battery degradation

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Wanted to report back here as well... I, too, have noticed that a recent update - maybe 28.2 my 80% range has dropped from 211 mi to about 206. This was an all-of-a-sudden thing. I was consistently (for months) getting 210-211 in my "charge complete" notification, then one day it changed and ever since I get consistently 206. have not tried charging to 100

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I too have a December LEMR with ~6800 miles on it that started at 260 miles of range, got boosted to 265 with an update, then seemingly was limited to 250 miles with a subsequent update.

I mostly charge at home to 90% at 32A on my wall charger (250V 50A), but occasionally have to charge or add some miles at a supercharger.

I have discharged to single digits (9 miles remaining), but have never charged to 100%.
 
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I too have a December LEMR with ~6800 miles on it that started at 260 miles of range, got boosted to 265 with an update, then seemingly was limited to 250 miles with a subsequent update.

I mostly charge at home to 90% at 32A on my wall charger (250V 50A), but occasionally have to charge or add some miles at a supercharger.

I have discharged to single digits (9 miles remaining), but have never charged to 100%.

I’m in the exact same situation as exeon, except my Dec 2018 Lemr is at 21,948 miles. By my year anniversary on 12/15, I should be around 25,000 miles. As long as my 100% is > 245 in 45 days then I will not be too upset to lose 15 miles (260 was what was published as the max range) which would be about 6% loss.

I charge to 90% nightly since I drive at least 100 miles daily and this morning 90% was 222 putting 100% ~246. But I’ve seen 250 every 10 days or so and then it goes back down. One thing I have noticed is that I have way less miles erosion and range loss after starting to drive. Although when I first got the car it would say I would have 235 at 90% when I left the house but after 5 miles I’d have 220 miles of range remaining. Now it says I have 225 when leaving the house and 5 miles later I’ll have 219 range left. I’d rather have it be more accurate than have to discount the range myself.

I’m posting my Teslafi results from when I started in June 2019:

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Mid-range built in December 2018

A few days ago, I did a road trip & charged at home to 90%. At my fist stop I set it to 100% at the super charger at 239 it said I was fully charged. No big deal I thought. But later on, in the trip I tried again & topped out at 238. When I got home, I tried charging with a wall outlet in the garage 239 was all it would go to. This was my fist road tip & I normally only charge to 80% for my daily commute to work 50 miles round trip. Don’t know if the software updates that have reducing the range or what going on.
 
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I have a Dec 2018 build MR Model 3 that I took delivery on 12/21/18. Probably after 3 months of ownership, by capacity displayed on the UI dropped about 6%. My daily usage is about 180kwh/mi. I did usex to charge from 60% to 80% charge daily, but since I saw the the capacity drop, I started charging from 50% to 90% for the past 6 months or so and have not seen any change to capacity reading. I do find that I can best the estimated range displayed on screen by 20 miles or so. But that is with mostly highway driving in chill mode, and not running the A/C or heater. I've always been told to ignore the displayed capacity, but it is hard to do so. I really wish it just showed the actually capacity and reduce the remaining range based on my driving style.
 
Isn’t something like 10% degradation after 10k miles normal? There is a quick drop then the degradation slows, if I’m not mistaken.

I’m normally around 200 at 80% or 250-ish at 100%. That’s like 5% degradation, seems normal, right?

Plus, do they not factor in the colder temps when calculating?
 
Isn’t something like 10% degradation after 10k miles normal? There is a quick drop then the degradation slows, if I’m not mistaken.

I’m normally around 200 at 80% or 250-ish at 100%. That’s like 5% degradation, seems normal, right?

Plus, do they not factor in the colder temps when calculating?

2-5% would be normal from the stats that I've seen. Not 10%.

I am also at around 250.
 
I too have a December LEMR with ~6800 miles on it that started at 260 miles of range, got boosted to 265 with an update, then seemingly was limited to 250 miles with a subsequent update.
I have not tried charging to 100

I normally only charge to 80% for my daily commute to work 50 miles round trip. Don’t know if the software updates that have reducing the range or what going on.

Not sure if this helps you.... but I also have Mid Range dec 2018 build and right now it's showing 153 mi on the range display at 58% state-of-charge. If I do the math to check what 100% would be, i get 153/0.58 = 263.8 mi.

However, I have never charged it to 100%, so I don't know if it would actually display 264 if I did that. My daily usage is about 50 mi and I charge every night to 80%

Isn’t something like 10% degradation after 10k miles normal? There is a quick drop then the degradation slows, if I’m not mistaken.

I’m normally around 200 at 80% or 250-ish at 100%.


Someone from the other thread accused me that I was "assuming" too much so this is why I quoted most of the people (and I missed some) just for a reference. If you look closely, the common denominator here is - never charged to 100% (or rarely), extrapolating the values via TeslaFi/Stats, mostly charging to 80%-90% daily and only driving 50 miles (at least some of the users) and charging right back to 90%

This will give you a charging range of about 70%-90% every day. As discussed in the other thread - this seems to be a bad idea on a Model 3. It tricks the BMS into thinking you have less capacity.

You should try longer discharges to 10% followed by 90% consistantly over a month and after that a 100% charge. If that doesn't help then you should contact Tesla to reset the BMS CAC reset. After that you will get the miles back and never charge from 70%-90% daily again.

Isn’t something like 10% degradation after 10k miles normal?
No, I am at 10,000 miles and have 1.5% real degradation from the 77-77.5kWh I had when brand new , meaning above the available rated capacity (explained why there is a difference here in this thread)
Battery Degradation and Rated Range explained

If I were using only stats apps and only read what the KM screen is saying, it would probably show 0.02% degradation. I charged yesterday to 100% and it showed 1km degradation, which is the same as what the CAN is reporting at 75.9kWh.

10% should be normal after 100,000-150,000 miles.
 
Someone from the other thread accused me that I was "assuming" too much so this is why I quoted most of the people (and I missed some) just for a reference. If you look closely, the common denominator here is - never charged to 100% (or rarely), extrapolating the values via TeslaFi/Stats, mostly charging to 80%-90% daily and only driving 50 miles (at least some of the users) and charging right back to 90%

I am there. After 10 thousand kms I have 5% "degradation" (which could be a BMS bias and/or real degradation). Almost all my charging has been done to 80% SoC. I usually drive 20/50kms each day. Why have I done this? Because I was following the Tesla "always leave your car plugged" recommendation.

I don't feel like asking for a BMS reset after "only" a 5% but don't want to see this number go further down. I guess I will do now regularly 30%->80% and every now and then 20%->95%. That should do keep the BMS balanced, right?

In any case, it's strange there are many other users following my charging pattern that have not seen any degradation. I've been reading many messages and 50 kms per day driving and charge to 90% is SUPER common. So it's weird why it only affects some and not others.

Also, it's strange Tesla has not "fixed" the BMS estimation "problem" after so many cases and bad press. If they're aware of the problem I'm sure they would be trying to fix it ASAP.
 
In any case, it's strange there are many other users following my charging pattern that have not seen any degradation. I've been reading many messages and 50 kms per day driving and charge to 90% is SUPER common. So it's weird why it only affects some and not others.

Also, it's strange Tesla has not "fixed" the BMS estimation "problem" after so many cases and bad press. If they're aware of the problem I'm sure they would be trying to fix it ASAP.

Few things to mention here - a lot of people don't care or don't have Stats or TeslaFi apps. They charge to 80%, keep the car at % and never see if there is any change in their rated km/miles.

Unless you actively look for it with stats apps, like people here, if you only drive 50kms a day and keep the car in % you will never see any issues or degradations, because you are only using 10-15% of the capacity...

And even if you drive to a Supercharger, you still wouldn't notice anything, because you are mostly an inexperienced driver who follows what the car suggests and the car will probably just suggest to get a stop in about 200kms, which you can easily do on 80% battery...
So the simple answer is - people don't care for the range.

But there are people like us who care.

The other thing to mention is that there are a lot of S and X drivers in these forums. Their cell chemistry is different, their BMS is different. So you might hear someone say - I charge to 90% and have never seen an issue. Which brings us back to the above IN ADDITION to the fact that they drive an S or X, whichs screws the stats.

I also don't know if its really a BMS issue or some cell issue in combination with BMS or some battery gauge. Tesla is doing expansion and trying to deliver 100,000 cars each 3 months I think they have limited resources. Plus the amount of cars on the roads and the small number of people complaining - I don't think this is a priority. It might not be that easy to fix either. No idea.

But the simple observation so far has been that charging 70-90% daily and almost never discharging below 30%-20% on a Model 3 is a bad idea.

I have 10,500 miles (16,000km+) and am stil at 75.9kWh from 77kWh new, which gives me 498km displayed at 100% or 0.02% range degradation (1.5% real). Have never charged from 70%-90%, not even once. Most of my charges happen between 30% and 80% and I also do a lot of highway stunts where I go from 100% to 7% and then back to 80% (never charged to more than 85% on a Supercharger) I also have 60% DC vs 40% AC charging, which is supposedly bad.
 
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I am doing an experiment where I am discharging to below 10% and then charging to 90% (at home with HPWC). So far I have done two cycles of this with no change in "Estimated 100% range" - at 90% charge, the car displays 219 miles (which is 243 at 100%), so at this point, I bought a Mid-Range and and now basically have an SR+ after 8,000mi
 
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I am doing an experiment where I am discharging to below 10% and then charging to 90% (at home with HPWC). So far I have done two cycles of this with no change in "Estimated 100% range" - at 90% charge, the car displays 219 miles (which is 243 at 100%), so at this point, I bought a Mid-Range and and now basically have an SR+ after 8,000mi
Well, if you read the SR+ posts, SR+ people who have experienced similiar BMS decalibration are reporting 210-220 range at 100% so you are still good:)

I am wondering what the typical consumption of the Mid range is - could you please pull up the energy graph and try to match the typical with the avg (should be about 145Wh/km) and please change to km and post the screenshot? The energy graph should be set to average and not instant and you can set whatever the miles/km option you like as long as you can match both dotted and straight lines and record the digits displayed under "avg Wh/km" on the left side.

This will give you an indication of how many kWh the BMS thinks you have.