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Minimum Daily Charge vs Daily Basic Charge SCE

On the TOU plans Edison has a minimum daily charge of $0.35 and a daily basic charge of $0.03 for the TOU 4-9. On the Prime they have no minimum daily charge but the daily basic charge is $0.40.

What is the difference between the two charges? Do you add them both to make a daily charge of $0.38?

What works best with battery backup where you can control when you pull from the grid and when you use a battery?
 

power.saver

Grid Specialist
Supporting Member
Mar 4, 2018
664
707
Arcadia, CA
On the TOU plans Edison has a minimum daily charge of $0.35 and a daily basic charge of $0.03 for the TOU 4-9. On the Prime they have no minimum daily charge but the daily basic charge is $0.40.

What is the difference between the two charges? Do you add them both to make a daily charge of $0.38?

What works best with battery backup where you can control when you pull from the grid and when you use a battery?
The Basic Charge cannot be offset by usage. So for Prime, you are paying $0.40 per day on top of what you use.

The Minimum Charge is your daily minimum, but that can be offset by your usage. You only pay the "Bal of Min Charge" if your usage was less than the monthly minimum.
 

jjrandorin

Moderator, Model 3, Tesla Energy Forums
Moderator
Nov 28, 2018
12,514
14,937
Riverside Co. CA
One thing I find funny is, SCE just (as in less than 24 hours ago now) emailed me about "you can switch to another rate plan, here is what that would look like".

I am still under a regular domestic (tiered) plan, which is not TOU, and holding onto it for dear life. Under that current plan, I dont have a Time of use, I pay more for energy the more I use. Keeping my energy use as low as possible (using self powered mode) benefits me more than "when" i use it.

I also have been using energy in my home "as if" I had a time of use plan for several months now, in preparation / practice for when they finally try to take this away from me. What I mean is, I charge my model 3 at 3am in the morning (always finishes by 5am), we set the dishwasher to run after midnight with its delay setting, stuff like that. I have been doing that for almost a year.

The reason this is relevant is, I have been using energy as if I had a time of use plan for almost a year, so any evaluations by SCE on my energy usage and swapping to a new plan should be fairly accurate.

This is what they sent me, as costs for my current domestic plan vs TOu 4-9 and TOU prime:

SCE rate plan options - rofl.JPG


I found it interesting (and funny) that their own tools show that I should "do nothing" as all the options are more. The interesting part is, TOU 4-9 shows as cheaper for me than TOU prime, even though I have an EV and charge it overnight. I am guessing this is because I drove a "LOT" less last year (like 20k miles in 2019 vs 6k in 2020).

To me, this shows that people likely need to do their own research on whether TOU 4-9 or TOU prime is better for them, regardless of whether they have an EV or not (and if you are grandfathered into a domestic plan in CA, you likely dont want to do anything to change that.)
 

power.saver

Grid Specialist
Supporting Member
Mar 4, 2018
664
707
Arcadia, CA
This is where I am confused as this is a daily charge. How can usage offset daily charges?
It's daily only in the sense that they add up all the days in the billing cycle to get the amount. Then they deduct any usage charges from that so you only pay if your monthly usage was less than the sum of the daily charges. It's this way because the billing cycle varies from 28 to 33 days.
 
It's daily only in the sense that they add up all the days in the billing cycle to get the amount. Then they deduct any usage charges from that so you only pay if your monthly usage was less than the sum of the daily charges. It's this way because the billing cycle varies from 28 to 33 days.
For Prime the daily charges are $0.40 (basic charge) per day

For TOU 4-9 they are $0.03 (basic charge) and $0.35 (daily minimum) per day. Does this mean that the total daily charge for the 4-9 is $0.38/day? Do you add the two daily charges?
 
I'm currently on the Prime and pay way less than what others on Prime claim I should pay for my monthly charges. My bills are often less than $10/month. When I called to ask about changing it to the 4-9 plan they told me I would actually be worse off since I am a net producer.

*BTW, I am only a net producer this past year because we had the driest winter on record (so I was able to be a net producer in winter when I normally would be a net consumer), and we had a cooler than normal August. This past August we used 42 hours less AC according to my thermostat report than the previous year. This is equivalent to about over 100 kWh less energy for the month. And we had a net production of 88 kWh this past August. Normally we would be close to zero for our True-up next month.
 
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power.saver

Grid Specialist
Supporting Member
Mar 4, 2018
664
707
Arcadia, CA
For Prime the daily charges are $0.40 (basic charge) per day

For TOU 4-9 they are $0.03 (basic charge) and $0.35 (daily minimum) per day. Does this mean that the total daily charge for the 4-9 is $0.38/day? Do you add the two daily charges?
No, because the minimum charge can be offset by usage. The $0.03 basic charge you have to pay regardless, but if your usage is more than $0.35 per day, then you owe no minimum charge.

If you are a net producer, you will have to pay the minimum charge and the basic charge, since negative usage doesn't offset the minimum charge.

I thought you were in a program that credited ~$10/mo which would be reducing your Prime bill.
 
No, because the minimum charge can be offset by usage. The $0.03 basic charge you have to pay regardless, but if your usage is more than $0.35 per day, then you owe no minimum charge.

If you are a net producer, you will have to pay the minimum charge and the basic charge, since negative usage doesn't offset the minimum charge.

I thought you were in a program that credited ~$10/mo which would be reducing your Prime bill.
That makes sense. That’s why she said that Prime is better for me.

My true up is next month. I was looking to change. I’ll probably just keep Prime.
 

jjrandorin

Moderator, Model 3, Tesla Energy Forums
Moderator
Nov 28, 2018
12,514
14,937
Riverside Co. CA
One thing I find funny is, SCE just (as in less than 24 hours ago now) emailed me about "you can switch to another rate plan, here is what that would look like".

I am still under a regular domestic (tiered) plan, which is not TOU, and holding onto it for dear life. Under that current plan, I dont have a Time of use, I pay more for energy the more I use. Keeping my energy use as low as possible (using self powered mode) benefits me more than "when" i use it.

I also have been using energy in my home "as if" I had a time of use plan for several months now, in preparation / practice for when they finally try to take this away from me. What I mean is, I charge my model 3 at 3am in the morning (always finishes by 5am), we set the dishwasher to run after midnight with its delay setting, stuff like that. I have been doing that for almost a year.

The reason this is relevant is, I have been using energy as if I had a time of use plan for almost a year, so any evaluations by SCE on my energy usage and swapping to a new plan should be fairly accurate.

This is what they sent me, as costs for my current domestic plan vs TOu 4-9 and TOU prime:

View attachment 721601

I found it interesting (and funny) that their own tools show that I should "do nothing" as all the options are more. The interesting part is, TOU 4-9 shows as cheaper for me than TOU prime, even though I have an EV and charge it overnight. I am guessing this is because I drove a "LOT" less last year (like 20k miles in 2019 vs 6k in 2020).

To me, this shows that people likely need to do their own research on whether TOU 4-9 or TOU prime is better for them, regardless of whether they have an EV or not (and if you are grandfathered into a domestic plan in CA, you likely dont want to do anything to change that.)

Just one other data point on this, to clarify something about my usage. I do have powerwalls ( may not be clear to everyone who is visiting, although I am sure regulars likely know this). I use self powered mode, which does get me through the "time of use" period of 4-9. Since I use self powered mode, my system does not send all solar back to the utility during peak. My home runs on some combination of solar or solar + powerwalls until it hits my powerwall reserve.

From March - the beginning of November, solar + powerwall covers at a minimum of 20 hours of energy use a day for me. Most days during this time, I use from zero to 3kWh a day from the grid.

I mention this, because there might be a question on the above pricing SCE sent me above on whether my potential peak usage is being covered. I am definitely using solar + powerwall or powerwall only during peak time, the entire year.
 
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