Model 3 : Anyone Driven the RWD on Snow or Ice yet?

[EV-lutioin]

Now that there are more Model 3's out there, I was hoping we could get some data on rear-wheel-drive winter driving dynamics. Also: Best tires, wheel size etc. for winter driving.

I received my Model 3 invite to configure.... I'm so tempted, but wondering if I should wait for AWD??

 

[DR61]

If only we had snow and ice here in California right now. Warmest and driest December that I can remember.

 

[run-the-joules]

If only we had snow and ice here in California right now. Warmest and driest December that I can remember.

No kidding. I'm thinking I'm gonna have to cancel my mammoth trip in January if we don't see some changes. Not enough of the mountain is open to be worth it right now.

 

[Snow Drift]

The car should perform like a RWD, non-performance, Model S. If you drive in snow often, then wait for AWD. If it's just a few times a year, just get snow tires or at least really good All-Seasons for the winter months.

 

[EV-lutioin]

The car should perform like a RWD, non-performance, Model S. If you drive in snow often, then wait for AWD. If it's just a few times a year, just get snow tires or at least really good All-Seasons for the winter months.

Do you think the Model 3 AWD will have more range than RWD?

 

[Stu Redman]

Do you think the Model 3 AWD will have more range than RWD?

I suspect AWD will have a little more range and a little better accel. But isn't it absurd that Tesla won't tell anyone those numbers nor the cost? Here you are able to order your car, but without the information you should have to decide to wait or not. Same with the P version. As of now, I don't think they will even supply you with an Owners Manual. Why the secrets? Crazy. I wish you good luck ordering your car and being able to decide what to get. When they ask for your credit card security code, tell them it's a secret.

 

[SSedan]

Stock LRR tires on EVERYTHING stink on snow and ice, the hard rubber for the LRR rating is just too firm to be good in adverse conditions.
RWD is fine on snow with decent tires that don't necessarily have to be "snow tires" IF the driver is up to it, FWD is not really "better" just more forgiving to inexperienced drivers, most folks confuse FWD being more forgiving with RWD being bad and that isn't the case.

That said your concern would seem to suggest you have no experience with RWD and snow, buying a $50K car might not be the best way to learn should you not like it. Do you have a secondary vehicle you are comfortable in the snow with?

 

[Snow Drift]

Do you think the Model 3 AWD will have more range than RWD?

It does in the S and X, so I assume it will.

Stock LRR tires on EVERYTHING stink on snow and ice, the hard rubber for the LRR rating is just too firm to be good in adverse conditions.
RWD is fine on snow with decent tires that don't necessarily have to be "snow tires" IF the driver is up to it, FWD is not really "better" just more forgiving to inexperienced drivers, most folks confuse FWD being more forgiving with RWD being bad and that isn't the case.

That said your concern would seem to suggest you have no experience with RWD and snow, buying a $50K car might not be the best way to learn should you not like it. Do you have a secondary vehicle you are comfortable in the snow with?

Agreed that RWD with snow tires can be fine, but AWD with the same snow tires will be even better.

FWD is only better than RWD in the snow (in most cars), because the weight of the ICE engine over the front axle pushes the tires down and allows for more traction. This also means that the rear wheels have less weight over them and so that can lead to fishtailing.

Tesla is a bit different with the motor on the rear axle. Either way, Dual Motor will get better traction than RWD (assuming tires are the same).

 

[DR61]

Stock LRR tires on EVERYTHING stink on snow and ice, the hard rubber for the LRR rating is just too firm to be good in adverse conditions.

Certainly LRR all-season tires in general are probably not very good on snow, but the same can be said for most non-LRR all-season tires. According to this Canadian report:
Study shows low rolling resistance tires perform well in winter conditions, increase fuel economy and reduce greenhouse gas emissions
current generation LRR tires are about the same as non-LRR tires.

But I have no personal experience with either of the two Model 3 tire tire choices. Remains to be seen how well they work.

I agree with your comments about RWD.

 

[SSedan]

My comments on how bad LRR tires are are based on my wife's cars, the last couple of which have been Impalas FWD, current generation is pretty big as modern cars go. I forget what was stock/original but I know it was BAD BAD BAD on both cars, a swap to a cheap General tire rated well on TireRack made a huge difference in winter safety and improved summer rain performance with some impact to economy, but the extra fuel is a reasonable tradeoff vs. dedicated snows here where frequent light snowfalls are the norm not big storms. If we bought snows we would have 2 sets of tires NOT worn out but aged out and junk in 3-4 years.

LRR are great for economy but they do make tradeoffs. Just like snow tires compromise handling, and longevity, they also tend to be louder.

The study you posted is for Class 8 trucks, I hope you don't actually believe that directly equates to passenger cars.

Far as RWD/AWD yes AWD is better given the same tires but is it worth(pure speculation based on NO INFORMATION) waiting another year, spending $6k more if snow performance is only a concern 10 days a year?
If the difference is 4 months wait $3k and snowpack is the winter norm then heck yes, but we don't know any of that.

The Michelin Primacy on my P85 are bad on the slightest amount of snow, but the traction control in this thing is great. For this winter I plan to deal with them and any future decision to buy "snows" will be based more on if I want summer performance tires.

 

[DR61]

The study you posted is for Class 8 trucks

I missed that. I hope someone (Tire Rack?) does some actual snow performance tests on current passenger car LRR "all season" tires vs same manufacturer's non-LRR "all season" tires.

 

[boaterva]

On the original topic, if you’ve not seen it:

 

[Zaxxon]

Just beat me to posting that video. It has me significantly less interested in waiting for AWD even here in Colorado.

I figure Tesla is likely to charge $4k for the option. (Previously stated 'less than Model S' at $5k) Plus half the federal tax credit as I'm not a current S/X owner. So add $3,750. Is AWD worth $7,750 to me? Given this video, and that the 3 would replace a Leaf, and that our other car has AWD for when we may truly need it?

I'm thinking no. Would like the likely modestly higher range of AWD, as well as the likely slightly better acceleration. But$7k+ is a big ask if the RWD model does well in snow/ice.

 

[boaterva]

Just beat me to posting that video. It has me significantly less interested in waiting for AWD even here in Colorado.

I figure Tesla is likely to charge $4k for the option. (Previously stated 'less than Model S' at $5k) Plus half the federal tax credit as I'm not a current S/X owner. So add $3,750. Is AWD worth $7,750 to me? Given this video, and that the 3 would replace a Leaf, and that our other car has AWD for when we may truly need it?

I'm thinking no. Would like the likely modestly higher range of AWD, as well as the likely slightly better acceleration. But$7k+ is a big ask if the RWD model does well in snow/ice.

Same here. Unless you need AWD for mountain/ski areas to avoid chain use requirements or areas where you have really snow covered roads, I’d go for RWD and snow tires.

Here in Virginia the only snow we’ve ever had the last few years has been in side roads and then only for a few days. A RWD 3 with all weathers should be more than fine.

If I still lived in New England where I grew up, I’d probably put the money into a set of wheels/tires.

 

[djplong]

I noticed that, on the MyTesla page, the AWD options now lists the same ranges as the LR/SR.

 

[MP3Mike]

I noticed that, on the MyTesla page, the AWD options now lists the same ranges as the LR/SR.

It always has as far as I can remember.

 

[smorgasbord]

Just beat me to posting that video. It has me significantly less interested in waiting for AWD even here in Colorado.

The video shows that the rear tires lose their grip pretty easily, despite being rated M+S. The video doesn't show what happens when the front tires lose their grip.

 

[deadcat]

This guy tried to but it didn't go so well

 

[Exsomnis7]

I took my delivery yesterday and drove my car to work this morning. The last 6 miles of my commute was long stretches of black ice.

The stock tires are crap on ice. I was fish tailing just from the regen braking. I ended up switching it to low and still slid a bit. However, so were all the other cars around me. Many were in ditches and a lot of crashes. I slid around a bit just going around 15 mph, but I think the only thing that would have been better would be to have good snow tires.

 

[jackbowers]

I was driving around Spokane after 7 inches fell overnight. Model 3 with stock tires did better than a similarly equiped RWD Model S. The regen was very effective for slowing down, though sometimes would cause the rear wheels to slide around. Steering control was impressive. Defrosting for the front windshield and rear glass very fast and effective.