Model 3 - demo car first impressions

[MXWing]

Contrary to popular expectations:

The Model 3 is not twice as good as the Model S for half the price.

Also, where was OP when I was writing book reports in school? I wish I had a vivid enough imagination to produce that much content from five minutes with the source material!

I learned something new though. Have probably heard commentary from over a hundred women about the Model 3 and none of them said the trunk was heavy.

Hmmmmm

If I’m gonna have to ask my wife or a random stranger to hold something before I can lift the trunk due to the strength requirements of owning a 3 - I might need to cancel my reservations.

What is OP 1 rep maximum bicep curl? Just need a point of reference so I don’t buy something I can’t open.

 

[svp6]

I had the P85D, now M3. The P95D was the nicer car - it was only ~65k more.... As others said, you cannot beat the price. M3 drive is very good (bar the occasional bumpiness). Wish it had larger icons / fonts on the screen. I am not missing the in-dash screen, but I wish they had some previous apps (energy app). The interior has better fit and finish, but still misses on interior lighting. Could use some physical buttons / standard stalks (glovebox, cruise control, wiper control). And who came with the idea of hiding the hazard lights button on the ceiling? Last place I would have looked for it - especially when needing to turn hazards on quickly....

 

[ishareit]

Contrary to popular expectations:

The Model 3 is not twice as good as the Model S for half the price.

Also, where was OP when I was writing book reports in school? I wish I had a vivid enough imagination to produce that much content from five minutes with the source material!

I learned something new though. Have probably heard commentary from over a hundred women about the Model 3 and none of them said the trunk was heavy.

Hmmmmm

If I’m gonna have to ask my wife or a random stranger to hold something before I can lift the trunk due to the strength requirements of owning a 3 - I might need to cancel my reservations.

What is OP 1 rep maximum bicep curl? Just need a point of reference so I don’t buy something I can’t open.

Honestly don’t know how to react to this comment without being too rude but if you are still in middle school (which seems likely) and need help with your book reports, I’ll ask my dog to help you.

 

[MXWing]

Honestly don’t know how to react to this comment without being too rude but if you are still in middle school (which seems likely) and need help with your book reports, I’ll ask my dog to help you.

I’m sorry dude. Was taken aback by the mental image of a 6’1 guy in skinny jeans setting his pumpkin spice latte (with soy)on the ground so can open up a trunk with both hands.

Seriously - I don’t get the 3 hate. It’s amazing range for much less than S and still has the guts of a Tesla.

Tesla marketing is to antisell the 3 and they are intentionally downplaying the acceleration and range of the 3 to not cannibalize sales.

Thousands of people have been in and out of it, opening and closing the doors, etc.

 

[R-123]

About the door rattle... it was pretty bad and it was the same on the demo cars in Stanford, San Jose and on a rental I had for a day (VIN 36xx). I could probably live with it. And I know Tesla and M3 fans could turn a blind eye to it, but I was checking out the car with my friend, who drives Audi, and for him that was one big WTF - how could you buy a car that does that.

 

[SigNC]

I own a model 3 and it's been a while since i'd driven an S. I had a P85D loaner and while the acceleration was great the rest of the car I actually preferred the 3. Headroom feels very tight on the S compared to the 3. (I'm 6'1"). Visibility is much better on the 3, the middle rear headrest i find particularly annoying. Handling is much better on the 3. I always drive with my hand on top of the steering wheel so for me the speed off to the side on the 3 is actually much more convenient than having to move my arm to see the speed on the S or any normal car. I think the S would be better for touring or if you needed the extra space but for my money, I'll take the 3. (clearly I'm biased as a 3 owner)

 

[ishareit]

I’m sorry dude. Was taken aback by the mental image of a 6’1 guy in skinny jeans setting his pumpkin spice latte (with soy)on the ground so can open up a trunk with both hands.

Seriously - I don’t get the 3 hate. It’s amazing range for much less than S and still has the guts of a Tesla.

Tesla marketing is to antisell the 3 and they are intentionally downplaying the acceleration and range of the 3 to not cannibalize sales.

Thousands of people have been in and out of it, opening and closing the doors, etc.

There was no hate in my post. That is your interpretation of it.

 

[MXWing]

@sumitkgarg

I stole this from the TM3OC comparing the 3 and S. What like to know if it made sense to you, owning an S

Model 3 vs Model S ♞

Model 3's Advantages:

• The Model 3 LRD has more range than the Model S 100D. Check out the numbers here.
  
  
• The Model 3 is 25% more efficient than the Model S which means you will pay 25% less to charge at home.
  
  
• The Model 3 LRD has 78.3 kWh usable battery capacity (source: page 6 footer) vs 72.6 kWh in the Model S 75 (source) and 77.5 kWh in the Model S 85 (source). That means the Model S/X battery capacities are over advertised but the Model 3 capacity is under advertised.
  
  
• The Model 3 battery degradation will be 25% slower than the Model S because it requires fewer charge cycles to achieve the same mileage. If you look at the graph here, you can see that the S and X are already pretty good but the 3 will be better.
  
  
• The Model 3 uses the newer battery technology. The 2170 cells in the Model 3 have 18.5% higher energy density than the 18650 cells in the latest Model S based on EPA documents. S/X will probably switch to the 2170 cells in the future. That means if you buy an S/X it is likely that it will become the old technology soon. When the S/X switch to 2170 cells, this should increase the range, reduce weight and improve handling. See the calculation and data sources here. Also, listen to Elon here.
  
  
• The Model 3 has the newer motor technology. These motors are lighter and have better track performance and Autobahn performance. They reduce weight and improve handling. The permanent magnet motors don't go into limp mode as quickly as the current Model S/X AC induction motors. The Porsche Mission E has permanent magnet motors for better track performance. The Bolt and Model 3 have permanent magnet motors for high efficiency. Unlike common assumptions, these motors are not the less capable economy option. They are superior in every metric. For more info see page 15 here, and this and this) research. They were more expensive until recently but the prices have come down. Check out paragraph 10 that starts with "Alternatively, in terms of ..." here. The Model S does not have permanent magnet motors because they were expensive and difficult to source at high volume until recently because of rare earth materials but Tesla has made a deal with a Chinese supplier (source).
  
  
• The Model 3 has a driver-facing camera. This might enable facial recognition related features for driverless Autopilot or it might be used for monitoring the cabin against vandalism under the Tesla Network. There is a video about it here.
  
  
• Better handling because of less weight. Model S 75 and the Model 3 SR have similar range and both are RWD. Therefore comparing these two makes sense. Model S 75 curb weight is 4469 lbs (source). Model 3 SR curb weight is 3549 lbs (source). The difference is 920 lbs (417 kg). The Model S 100D and the Model 3 LRD are also comparable in range. Model S 100D's curb weight is 4736 lbs (source). Model 3 LRD's curb weight is expected to be around 3895 lbs. The difference would be 841 lbs (381 kg).
  
  
• The Model 3 center console has more storage space and charger docks for two smartphones (Source: See video here)
  
  
• The Model 3 has door pockets, coat hooks, lighted vanity mirrors and adjustable front seat belt anchor points. The Model S does not.
  
  
• The Model 3 has a folding rear seat armrest with cup holders. Photo
  
  
• The Model 3 infotainment computer has a liquid cooled and faster processor. Therefore the touchscreen is more responsive. Even the latest Model S doesn't have this yet. To prevent any confusion, both the Model 3 and the latest Model S have liquid cooled AP2.5 computers with dual graphics cars. The AP2.5 computers are the same but the media control unit processors are different. The Model S/X still use the Tegra 1 mobile processor from 2011. Quote: "On one side, there’s the infotainment Electronic Control Unit (ECU) or MCU now powered by the Intel Gordon Peak BMP and Intel Apollo Lake system-on-chip instead of Nvidia’s Tegra chip in Model S and Model X." Source.
  
  
• The Model 3 insurance will cost less than the Model S.
  
  
• Price: The Model 3 costs a lot less than the Model S. Many people are comparing the wrong cars. The Model 3 LR is not comparable to the Model S 75D. These cars are comparable: [Model S 75, Model 3 SR], [Model S 75D, Model 3 SRD], [Model S 100D, Model 3 LRD]. The Model S 100D starts at $97,300 before options. The Model 3 LRD is expected to start at 35+9+4.5+2= $50,500 assuming $4,500 for dual motors and $2,000 for air suspension. EAP and PUP are not included in either price. The Model S 100D is 93% more expensive than the Model 3 LRD.
  
  
• The Model 3 front armrest has storage space. Model S does not. Also, the front cup holders are better positioned in the Model 3. They are difficult to use in the Model S.
  
  
• The Model 3 will support up to 184 kW Supercharging when Tesla upgrades the Superchargers. The Model S can only support up to 120 kW. Even the latest Model S doesn't support 184 kW yet. More info here.
  
  
• The Model 3 production line is more automated. Listen here to Elon confirming this. That means fewer parts are hand assembled compared to the Model S which means fewer manufacturing errors. See the video here and thread here.
  
  
• The Model S is not more premium than the Model 3 because there is no difference between the Model S and Model 3 gross margins. Check out the second bullet point on top of the shareholder letter here. Even though the Model S prices are high, Tesla doesn't have higher gross margins on the Model S because half of the car is hand-assembled but the Model 3 production line is a lot more automated. The Model S is expensive because Tesla uses 7 times the number of employees as other car makers to build the S/X (source).
  
  
• The Model 3 has 1.5" more headroom in the front and 2.4" more in the rear seats than the Model S. Model 3: Front= 40.3”, Rear = 37.7”(source), Model S: Front= 38.8", Rear= 35.3" (source)
  
  
• The Model 3 has practically the same legroom as the Model S: Model 3 Leg room: 42.7” Front, 35.2” Rear (source) Model S Leg room: 42.7" Front, 35.4" Rear (source)
  
  
• The Model 3 is only 1.2 inches (3 cm) narrower: Model 3 width: 76.1” with mirrors folded (source) Model S width: 77.3” with mirrors folded (source)
  
  
• Only the pano sunroof version of the Model S supports a roof rack. The all-glass version does not. However, all Model 3 roof versions (all glass or metal) are expected to support a roof rack. Check out this and this video.
  
  
• The Model 3 air vents are digitally controlled. That means when FSD is enabled and a family member summons the car for a driverless ride, air vents will work the way the passenger wants. Each passenger won't have to adjust physical settings.
  
  
• Model 3 steering wheel has scroll buttons that with extra functions.
  
  
• Better audio quality with the Model 3 with PUP compared to the Model S with PUP has been reported by many people who have compared the two. Check out this video.
  
  
• The headlights are better. They distribute the light evenly and provide a clearer view. Check out the photos here.
  

Model S' advantages:

• The Model S has more cargo capacity: 30 cubic feet instead of 15.
• The battery failure and drive unit warranty is different. You get 8 years or 120,000 miles (whichever comes first) with the Model 3 LR, compared to 8 years and unlimited miles for the Model S. The warranty extension for the Model 3 will probably increase the mileage from 120K to 240K. Details have not been released yet. Practically, this doesn't make much difference because the overall warranty on both cars is 4 years or 50,000. Therefore most Model S owners who keep the car longer than 4 years already buy the warranty extension.
• Model S steering wheel is thicker, more comfortable and attractive.
• Model S has a heated steering wheel.
• Free unlimited Supercharging for the duration of your ownership if you buy a Model S until the end of January 2018. See details here for the 31 Jan 2018 deadline. Free Supercharging does not stay with the owner or with the car anymore. Tesla changed this more than a year ago. See the details here.
• The Model S has optional third-row seats for kids.
• Bioweapon Defense Mode.
• Better backup camera than the Model 3 which seems to have a fisheye view. See the video here.
• Availability: In most cases, you can take delivery of a new Model S sooner than a new Model 3. The only exception to this is existing Tesla owners who don't mind an RWD car.
• The frunk is larger.
• Model S has a power liftgate.
• Autopilot following distance can be set using the cruise control lever instead of the touchscreen.
• Model S has less road noise. The reason is unclear. If this is related to what Elon mentioned here, the Model 3 could have the same thing.

 

[suwaneedad]

and realized you can slide those seats back a country mile!

Indeed, I'm 6'2" and while in my driver's seat driving position my 6'5" son happily sits behind me.
Space is not scarce in the 3, amazingly.