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Discussion in 'Australia' started by Blue heaven, Feb 11, 2016.
Yea, may as well, hope this includes Australia.
He did state that this would be Global in a later tweet but I can't see how this would work because it'll be the 31st here in Oz before the 31st in the US so we'll be able to put a deposit down in store here before the Launch event?! Don't think so.
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just did the calcs, base model at $35000 will be 49,912.81 here.
+ 10% GST etc. Looking at $60k Yes,its pretty much exactly the same price as an 3 Series / A4 / C Class!
we wont see it till 2020 at best, might be a lot more by then.
A mass market car? I don't think so!! They should be competing with Camry in that space. Fifty grand is not mass market.
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So Tesla is looking for a twenty to forty million dollar interest free loan!! Just order when you are ready. The delay is unlikely to be more than an extra three months or so, IF they have got their act together by then.
I guess I am no longer the starry eyed enthusiast I was when I gave them a four year interest free loan!! Getting really annoyed with their antics, like the Spotify debacle, the 3 phase connector due a year ago, the delays on the launch in this country and on and on, like the supercharger roll out. Yes, they do eventually get around to it, but boy.....
The car, IF it is launched on time ( doubtful on their record) , will be available 2019 if you are lucky. The X might be available Q2 or Q3 next year, but I wouldn't hold my breath, on my experience to date...
True. Mass market is a whole different ball game/price point. The Hyundai Ionic EV version will most likely beat Tesla to market and I reckon that will be 280km's range and $40K at most. The Leaf's were overpriced on launch but once they fell to $39990 drive away they started to sell. $40K Tesla 3 with a smallish battery giving 300km's range would be right, but 60? By mid-2018 when it's possible, possible I say, when the Model 3 could make it here we'll likely have some second hand Model S's that are over 3 years old and you'd have to get one for $70K ish maybe. I'd be buying an S for 10 grand more rather than a new 3.
Dborn, mass market car is referring to the U.S. market where the average new car is $31000, the model 3 is potentially sub $28000 after tax incentives, throw in lower maintainence costs and fuel savings and it looks even more attractive, in Australia the bare bones will be $50k, that will do nicely for many people here who like me are sick of the roller coaster ride of oil based fuel prices from overseas plus the many other irritations of an Internal combustion engine passenger car, when the model 3 or Hyundai Ioniq or Toyota whatever full EV with range hits our shores the 4 cylinder in our carport is gone, they can give the petrol away and I still wouldn't want a ICE passenger car.
I have no doubt that Tesla has tested the patience of many model S owners over the past few years but they've also shaken up the car industry in a way that no one else has had the guts to do.
I love our P85D but in the end it's meaningless if we can't replace the Dinosaur parked nearby.
Also, it would be nice if our new(est) Prime Minister would get his finger out with a little of that "forward vision" and "innovation" he keeps spouting and funds a few incentives (as per U.S.) for people to own EVs.
money going out (incentive) = money coming in (tax). I don't need to pay more tax. The operational savings from owning a tesla plus a few charging dedicated solar panels are massive, and tesla could do a lot more marketing to promote that option and it's savings.....not that someone buying a circa 200k car is struggling to operate a car, and tesla sales staff dont seem to be sitting around bored.
A fully loaded Model 3 will probably cost close to $100K in Australia and will still sell. Tesla should avoid any ambition to be a mass market producer. The ICE makers will kill them in the market with high volume and low cost. Instead, Tesla needs to be the first EV into each segment, and have a differentiated offering.
Really? What about this for Norway:
"In the month of March this year, Tesla moved over 1,500 of the things. That's not just more cars than any other sold in the country in one month, that's the most cars sold in one month in Norway, ever."
Heres Why The Tesla Model S Is The #1 Selling Car In Norway
With the Model 3 and incentives in Ontario, Canada of up to $14k, who is to say we can't do the same? And if you can get similar incentives in Australia as in Norway, there's no reason you can't also do the same, especially with the Model 3, if Norway can do it with the Model S.
But, as Blue heaven said, the term "mass market car" is referring to the U.S. market and the price point of a Model 3 fits in that category just right, even before incentive. Tesla isn't about offering "segment" cars. Tesla wants to change transportation as we know it altogether - and that includes opening up its patents to other EV makers.
My comments relate to the Australian market.
So did mine. You said "Tesla should avoid any ambition to be a mass market producer" and I said "the term "mass market car" is referring to the U.S. market." I pointed out, however, "if you can get similar incentives in Australia as in Norway" then perhaps the Model 3 can become a mass market car in Australia.
Indeed, "similar incentives" seems to be something our politicians (incumbent ones anyway) in Canberra, cannot seem to absorb through their thick skins. If "innovative" products like the Tesla M3 are to succeed then they (and others like them) need some short term encouragement. However, as I said, the current Federal Gov ehre is too short sighted to do much about that. State governments likewise. They could forego stamp duty on pure electric vehicles, for instance, and (Say) 50% of that on hybrids, but, no, too difficult for them to see the future staring them in the face.
We will never going get those kind of incentives in Australia. Our wealth fund is the other direction.
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Our governments are there because we elected the most popular person in the electorate. That doesn't mean they have skill, intelligence, or vision. It's always astounded me that the treasurer of any australian state, in charge of more expenditure than any company in that state, doesn't necessarily have an accounting or finance qualification.
Beyond incentives I think we should be more worried about some genius politician getting in a twist about the potential for declining fuel excise duty. The result would be increasing road tax to account for the fact that our fuel is excise free and even GST free if it comes from solar panels.
Aside from everything else, Australia now imports refined fuel and we have closed our refineries. Strategic disaster. More, how many steel mills, aluminium refineries remain here? The tax the profitable production sector, spend like drunken sailors on the unproductive sector typical of the left have led to this parlous situation. Too many entitlements and far too few obligations! A trade union hack in charge of the country has led to massive gains for workers, but a massive outflow of jobs overseas, so we have a highly paid workforce with no jobs to go to. Good one, trade unions!
Now we have political geniuses scratching for more taxes to reward the unproductive with. Manufacturing in this country is all but dead. So what jobs are our kids going to have? Service industries? There are only so many of those. We do actually have to make something!
All this because of dropping of tariffs pricing labour out of all proportion in the name of socialism, which all sides of politics endorse in deed if not in word.
Robin Hood died a long time ago. Our pollies seem to have forgotten that.
Just to get it back to the definition of a "mass market car" - I don't think the Model 3 will be a mass market car, but as has been stated by many, it will be a competitor to the entry level luxury car segment.
BMW sold just over 4000 3 series last year.
Mercedes sold just over 9000 C class in 2015.
As a point of comparison, Mazda sold more than 38,000 Mazda 3's last year. So yeah, it won't be a mass market car.
However, the entry level luxury market is still a good one. And if Tesla can take significant market share from the bigger, more established companies, they'll be laughing.
In days gone by, the highest selling car in the USA was either the Ford Torus, the Toyota Camry, or the Honda Civic. THOSE are mass market cars....currently selling price of roughly $30K. There is no way that Tesla's first, less expensive car can compete with those. However, and I agree with Tim, the low end of the luxury market is more likely: Toyota Avalon, Honda Accord, Lexus IS series, Mercedes C (or A/B) class
Time will tell. But for us, my bet/hope is that there is a fully optioned Model 3 with lots of toys (dual engine, high end interior, autopilot, etc) for $70K US ... half the fully loaded model S