Model 3 owner in a loaner Model S: impressions

[BrownOuttaSpec]

I have a 2016 MS90D and got into a 2015 MS85 loaner and it was night and day difference. The Dual motor, air suspension, alcantara fabric, next gen seats that mine had made a huge improvement in the experiance of the car and i didn't even get into the feature that are most noticeable at night like the premium lighting and automatic trunk opening. The model I was in actually had the older navigation on it even though it had 2019.16.2 software so that also made it feel weird. I can only imagine how foreign it must have felt for you going from a Model 3 to an older S.

 

[CarlK]

I have a 2016 MS90D and got into a 2015 MS85 loaner and it was night and day difference. The Dual motor, air suspension, alcantara fabric, next gen seats that mine had made a huge improvement in the experiance of the car and i didn't even get into the feature that are most noticeable at night like the premium lighting and automatic trunk opening. The model I was in actually had the older navigation on it even though it had 2019.16.2 software so that also made it feel weird. I can only imagine how foreign it must have felt for you going from a Model 3 to an older S.

I was going to say that. Model S was a 7 year old car. The P85 was discontinued by end of 2014 after dual motor P85D came out. Just to put things in perspective. I also don't understand why people keep on comparing driving dynamics of Model 3 to the Model S that is much bigger and 1,000lb heavier. Isn't everything you "discovered" just part of the equation and reason why there are different models?

 

[qdeathstar]

cheapening out on power seats on a 50k car would not have been a good idea.

The extra the S offers is worth the price difference from the 3. Most shoppers don't care about it though, and won't spend the extra money. Its the same reason the BMW 7 series, MB S class, Lexus LS sell much lower volume than their cheaper/smaller sedan counterparts.

Tesla needs the volume -- even if its at 0 profit -- otherwise the stock price tanks, and they can't fund R&D the way they have been.

What makes you think the s is worth it? Top tier 3 vs entry level S??

 

[Magellan55]

What makes you think the s is worth it? Top tier 3 vs entry level S??

Different car for different needs/tastes. Just like some people buy an S7 instead of a similarly priced RS4. To some it's worth the extra $$$ just to have a car that stands out more in a crowd. But to 80-90% of buyers, the S (or S7) isn't worth the price difference.

 

[NickFie]

We have both S 100D and P3D-.

3 is around-town favorite for all the reasons cited above.

S is first choice for long-haul, also for adults in back seat. Better range, smoother ride, more room. EAP on AP 2.0 not as good as the 3's 2.5, but still gets the job done. MCU 1 definitely slower than MCU 2 on 3, but still generally good enough. Bought FSD, that should bring the S back up to par.

 

[mswlogo]

After also getting a loaner S I’m kind of wishing I got an S, loved it. Only issue is insurance is insane on Model S compared Model 3. If 3 climbs to model S range, no more Tesla’s for me. Insurance on model S wipes out any fuel savings for me. And I have Solar to power it.

 

[Uncle Paul]

People that want to be able to buy a Model 3 should thank the owners of the Model S/X.

It was part of Elon's master plan that they would build a higher end, and more profitable larger car to develop the technology and gain the financial and technical means to build a lesser cost model for the masses.

The X/S models had lots of break through technology that paved the way for the Model 3. Both the chassis and body panels were made of high quality aluminum. Great and efficient for break throughs, but not cost effective in higher production vehicles. (Model 3 has mostly steel structure underneath aluminum skin.

They developed and tested both rear driver and AWD with electric motors that could communicate with each other. The developed world class crash protection, with crumple zones not available with typical American made cars. They innovated the wonderful skate board battery pack located low in the chassis for great handling and additional safety structure. They showed the way forward with cyndrical Lithium Ion batteries with liquid flowing between the packs. They financed the development of Supercharger network by rolling in about $2,000 from each car sold into the high speed charging Superchargers. They innovated both Free Supercharging, and also the ability to offer pay for use all around the world. They paid for the roll out of Display centers and hundreds of service centers. They kept Fremont humming, paying the bills and generating the confidence and solid base to finance the new assembly lines and development of the Model 3. Also forged an alliance to produce batteries at the Gigafactory in Nevada.

They innovated the large center mounted display screen, autopilot, and on board monitoring of all critical systems.

In other words. Without the S there would be no 3...Be grateful, and think a bit before bashing the cars that made the 3 possible.

 

[gene]

After also getting a loaner S I’m kind of wishing I got an S, loved it. Only issue is insurance is insane on Model S compared Model 3. If 3 climbs to model S range, no more Tesla’s for me. Insurance on model S wipes out any fuel savings for me. And I have Solar to power it.

Shop around. I have Kemper insurance. On my S it was only $900 per year, on my Model 3 it is $700 per year. Full coverage and high liabilities.

 

[dmurphy]

Without the S there would be no 3...Be grateful, and think a bit before bashing the cars that made the 3 possible.

Who’s bashing the S? I think this has been a very respectful and interesting comparison of the 3 and S. Highlights and lowlights of both vehicles. If the same vehicle were perfect for everyone, there wouldn’t be dozens of manufacturers and hundreds of models out there.

I love my Model 3, but that doesn’t mean there isn’t room in the world for the S, X, or any other vehicles. Heck, there’s a freakin Buick next to it in my driveway, and it fulfills a need for us quite well.

 

[Electra3]

Agree that this is not about bashing the magnificent S. It was just so interesting to experience the difference between my S loaner and the M3--I could really sense the evolution from one model to the other. For the rest I would quote Freud and call it "the narcissism of small differences" I also would note that I found it hard to go back to having the behind the wheel console display as I've gotten used to the single screen--no looking through the steering wheel spokes. As I recall the single screen was "bashed" by early reviewers. As it turns out one easily adapts to it and to me it now seems like second nature and preferable to me.

 

[SantaMonicaBum]

I rather like the S, seating position and overall driving effort.
Model 3 is sporty, low seat position and heavy steering effort.
I’m getting old and lazy, so the S not a bad choice for me.
I might be looking into buying an S in the future maybe. Can’t wait to see what the refresh S looks like!

 

[insaneoctane]

I also think the dialog here had been respectful. I still consider the MS a "step up". There are differences that I like and don't like. I could never justify the price difference for a new one. The MS cost and history commands respect from me. It was the MS that convinced me that I wanted a more affordable Tesla before the 3 was even revealed

 

[insaneoctane]

heavy steering effort

Isn't there a setting for this?

 

[SantaMonicaBum]

Isn't there a setting for this?

Haha, yes I have it on comfort setting, but the overall steering wheel diameter is smaller. The S has a normal size steering wheel. I’m accustomed to luxury car steering effort!

Took my parents in the P90D for ride in ludicrous mode. Launched it, they both said “oh no, this is no good, waay tooo fast! We don’t want a car like this...” lol!

 

[aagosh]

Agree that this is not about bashing the magnificent S. It was just so interesting to experience the difference between my S loaner and the M3--I could really sense the evolution from one model to the other. For the rest I would quote Freud and call it "the narcissism of small differences" I also would note that I found it hard to go back to having the behind the wheel console display as I've gotten used to the single screen--no looking through the steering wheel spokes. As I recall the single screen was "bashed" by early reviewers. As it turns out one easily adapts to it and to me it now seems like second nature and preferable to me.

So far, I love the dual screen layout on my ModelX. The center screen is mostly used by my wife for changing songs playlist/surfing while I focus completely on the driver display - monitoring the surroundings (3d visualization), navigating the roads and monitoring energy usage.

If the true autonomy comes - there wouldn't be the need for driver information. However, until then I like the split screen layout.

 

[UngaBunga1989]

People that want to be able to buy a Model 3 should thank the owners of the Model S/X.

It was part of Elon's master plan that they would build a higher end, and more profitable larger car to develop the technology and gain the financial and technical means to build a lesser cost model for the masses.

The X/S models had lots of break through technology that paved the way for the Model 3. Both the chassis and body panels were made of high quality aluminum. Great and efficient for break throughs, but not cost effective in higher production vehicles. (Model 3 has mostly steel structure underneath aluminum skin.

They developed and tested both rear driver and AWD with electric motors that could communicate with each other. The developed world class crash protection, with crumple zones not available with typical American made cars. They innovated the wonderful skate board battery pack located low in the chassis for great handling and additional safety structure. They showed the way forward with cyndrical Lithium Ion batteries with liquid flowing between the packs. They financed the development of Supercharger network by rolling in about $2,000 from each car sold into the high speed charging Superchargers. They innovated both Free Supercharging, and also the ability to offer pay for use all around the world. They paid for the roll out of Display centers and hundreds of service centers. They kept Fremont humming, paying the bills and generating the confidence and solid base to finance the new assembly lines and development of the Model 3. Also forged an alliance to produce batteries at the Gigafactory in Nevada.

They innovated the large center mounted display screen, autopilot, and on board monitoring of all critical systems.

In other words. Without the S there would be no 3...Be grateful, and think a bit before bashing the cars that made the 3 possible.

I am HUGELY grateful. That said, if Tesla did not create the 3 I would never have become a customer. The S and X just ain't my cup of tea...

The reality is that the only things these three cars have in common is that they are EV's and made by the same company. They are aimed at completely different market segments. As someone who wants a very sporty, efficient Daily Driver, the P3D hit that target in spades.

 

[Peteski]

M3 is a different animal and of course a new generation for Tesla. The S is a very big car and will still suit those who really need the extra interior space. The S has had a good run over the years, with many incremental updates, but now needs a full refresh to stay ahead of the game. For us the M3 will make a perfect companion for our MX, which I would always prefer on a long road trip or when loaded up with the family.

 

[tnt1971]

This is a great thread. I have an 2016 S 85D. I love the car, but when I am due for an upgrade, I will probably go with the performance 3. My previous car was a Corvette, so I like the smaller, lower handling. The S is very heavy and not nimble, but it does handle well. I also did not get the air suspension because I wanted a more sporty feel, and I don't this it is an option anymore on the S. Also, my kids are getting older, with my youngest about to get his license, so I have less need for the big car. I am a cyclist, and I love the fact I get get my bike in the trunk (with the seats down and only the front wheel removed). If I cannot do this in the 3, I will reconsider.

I will also add this, when my car was in for service they gave me a 75D as a loaner. My car is the same weight as the 100D, but the 75D is about 400lbs lighter. It also had the air suspension. I was amazed at how much lighter the 75D felt compared to my car, so I will probably love the 3, which is nearly 1,000 lbs lighter than that.

 

[alexGS]

The Model S reminds me of the Mercedes CLS that I used to own; the Model 3 Performance seems more the equivalent of the AMG C55 that was the same age as the CLS. The car is smaller, simpler, without air suspension - less luxurious, but you really can’t say one is always better than the other in all situations.

We are lucky to have several models of Tesla to choose from. The problem we face in NZ is that everyone thinks of “the Tesla” as being the first-generation Model S, and it seems an uphill battle to convince people that Model 3 (soon to arrive) is a different type of car. Commonly we hear “I can buy a Model S for the same price, why would I buy the new Model 3?”

-Alex

 

[kpedraja]

Who’s bashing the S? I think this has been a very respectful and interesting comparison of the 3 and S. Highlights and lowlights of both vehicles. If the same vehicle were perfect for everyone, there wouldn’t be dozens of manufacturers and hundreds of models out there.

I love my Model 3, but that doesn’t mean there isn’t room in the world for the S, X, or any other vehicles. Heck, there’s a freakin Buick next to it in my driveway, and it fulfills a need for us quite well.

Ya, to be clear, I was just remarking mostly on the obvious evolution in design thinking, especially about information display and ergonomics. Also, the embrace of minimalism vs. the older car's more traditional and somewhat overly fussy (IMO) interior. Was definitely NOT intended to be a complaint about the S (though my preference has always been toward more sport sedan vs. luxury cruiser sized cars). I fully expect the next version of the S to leapfrog the 3 in many ways.