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Model 3 Performance...Plaid [speculation]

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Now that the Model S has gone Plaid and demonstrated significantly better performance throughout the battery pack range, when do you all think we'll start to see these enhancements trickle down to the 3?

While it does seem as though Tesla certainly has its hands full with other, more important models such as CyberTruck, Roadster, etc, eventually the 3 will get a more significant refresh with performance enhancements, and I can't help but wonder if the battery improvements, better motors and the like would add up to a truly track-weapon-capable M3P. The question is... how long will that take?

Thoughts?
 
Tesla never even offered the old ludicrous mode on the 3-and currently the X plaid isn't even going to be out until much later this year or early next- no reason to suspect any of that will show up on the cheaper cars anytime soon.

Note, too, the LR (non plaid) refreshed S comes in 0-60 same as the current 3P. I suspect that's intentional (since we know from the 1/4 mile trap speeds there's more than enough power to have made the S quicker if they wished)
 
I doubt this will ever happen but here's my dream model 3:
  • Tri motor powertrain
  • Similar power curve to plaid where it pulls hard beyond 60mph
  • 2.5ish 0-60
  • 5.5ish 60-130
  • Base price around 80k so you could add paint, wheels, FSD and be under 100k. (not counting taxes/fees of course)
They drop that and I'd be the first one placing a preorder.

I totally understand why they don't want the performance of their "budget" car getting too close to their flagship. But personally I'm not huge on the S just because of the size of the vehicle. I also just flat out can't afford a optioned out plaid. If I could I'd probably get one anyway despite my issues with the S.
 
At some point they will switch to 4680 batteries which can deliver more current. My guess is when that happens the Plaid+ will happen and a Ludicrous 3 and Y will also happen. My guess is that will happen in two years, first they have to get the 4680s into production and produce enough of them for the Cybertruck and Semi. When the production is really ramped up they can start using them in the 3 and Y but not before. BTW Elon's claim that the Berlin Ys will have 4680s from the start is BS, they will have 2170s for at least the first six months, then they'll transition to the 4680s in the long range, the SR+ in Berlin is likely to be using CATL LFPs. Eventually there will be an LFP 4680 but that can't happen for a couple of years at least.
 
I don't think Tesla would ever allow a Model 3 that's quicker than the slowest Model S.
Not quicker than a Model S just quicker than the current Model 3 Performance. The Plaid is 0-60 in 2 seconds, a Model 3 Ludicrous that can do 0-60 in 2.5 seconds would be a big step up from the current P while not challenging the S. As I said I suspect they will offer that when the 4680s make it to the 3 in about two years. One more assumption, the S will get the 4680s around the same time as the 3 which would up it's performance over the current Plaid so the gap between the 3 and the S will still be large.
 
I wish Tesla would just partner with Unplugged or Mountain Pass and start building the equivalent of M or RS versions of the 3. Optimize the aero, cooling package, suspension and brakes for higher performance road/light track use. Season with some interior tweaks like performance oriented front seats...

I would pretty much pre-order one right now.

The M and RS models are the most profitable models, and Tesla has a crazy high customer retention. Would hit the competition where they are the fattest and slowest moving 😇
 
I don't think Tesla would ever allow a Model 3 that's quicker than the slowest Model S.
Current M3P have the same 0-60 rating at 3.1. Top speed M3P 162 vs 155 Model S. So The M3P does have a slight advantage with the current new offerings.
The Model S will probably always be quicker than the M3, but maybe not all Model S's will be quicker than all Model 3's.
Tri motor would be nice in a M3 Plaid, but probably not happening.
Nice RUSH avator. Big fan.
 
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They already sell cars faster than they can build them-- and with massively higher profit margins than BMW or Audi... so adding build complexity would only slow them down.
Yes, I unfortunately agree with that sentiment and realize this won't happen in the shape of an OEM Tesla product. As long as the car gets sold anyway it makes little sense in bare numbers - but I think it would make a big difference in terms of marketing and competitiveness.

Take for instance quattro Gmbh. They served Audi's motorsport clients for a long time before developing cars for road use; and a built the original B5 RS4 as an inhouse versions of a current Audi (the B5 A4). Designed on the A4 platform and with access to Audi talent and resources. quattro then recieved incomplete stock A4s from Audi and completed them with their own upgraded components in their own factory. This means a quattro built car met the same compliance and pretty much the same quality criteria as a regular Audi, but targeted a market segment that was too small for Audi. (I use this model as example because today the RS cars are produced alongside regular ones, albeit at a much higher profit.)

Tesla aren't going to build this car because it's total overkill for any reasonable road use and just not compatible with a 500km+ range. But we know there are plenty Tesla owners out there (and in here) modding their cars and who are probably wiling to compromise on cruising range just as an M3 owner gladly accepts that car's fuel economy.

I'd propose a "Tesla Performance" brand offering a "Model 3 Performance Nur Spec" - best name ever - or "EVO", or "ZL1" or "RS" through the official sales channels. If Tesla sold such a model as an OEM - even if only a limited number and an expensive option - the halo of a Model 3 Performance that can beat an M3 around the most demanding race track on the planet would permanently bury the argument that an EV can't be true enthusiast's car.

The "Nur Spec" should be a motorsport oriented car with the necessary tweaks to run the Nurburgring at level of performance to outrun a well driven BMW M3; which will do something like a 7:52 full lap so call it 7:45. It's safe to assume that a car that goes fast at the Ring goes fast pretty much everywhere, so a Nur Spec would make waves in the track day and time attack crowds as well.

It even seems pretty straight forward. The upgraded car Unplugged ran a 7:44 BTG in back in 2019 set that time in damp conditions while struggling with serious battery cooling and brake issues.
There is nothing magic to solving these issues, Tesla has all the data they need and would easily specify the necessary parts. Garnish with off the shelf parts like Recaro CS airbag front seats, full Unplugged suspension and BBK and some Sport Cups. And no offense intended; but even the 2019 time could have been improved significally with a Ring specialist behind the wheel.

For Tesla this only has upsides - a halo model, a number of happy owners, and a clear goal for enthusiasts and aftermarket suppliers to aspire to and improve upon.

For enthusiasts, a best case would be Tesla igniting an EV weapons race similar to the homologation wars of the 1980, 90 and 00s. In this period manufacturers had to produce a number of cars with a certain spec in order to homologate parts for motorsports. All of a sudden some lucky people were able to buy road legal racecars while every other car enthusiast on the planet aspiring to buy or build one. This is the exact reason legends like M3s, Cosworths, STIs were made, creating the practical performance car and changing the market for ever. Only now we want the practical electric performance car, and we want them to rule.
 
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The Model 3 runs at the limit of what Tesla believes the 2170 pack can safely output.
Same for the Model S Plaid with 18650's.

The 4680 cells are capable of much higher power output so within the next year or two we will likely see some "Insane Mode" Model Y's tearing up the autobahn. And the 2nd gen Model 3 will surely be offered with a "Plaid" powertrain that takes the tires to the limit. That's Tesla's M.O.

Unfortunately the Model 3 is the only product in the world using 2170 cells and now is not a good time to shut down one of the world's largest battery factories to completely re-tool for the dramatically different 4680's. So, as much as they want to switch to the cheaper 4680's, it'll probably be many years before disrupting any existing battery factories makes sense.
 
Yes, I unfortunately agree with that sentiment and realize this won't happen in the shape of an OEM Tesla product. As long as the car gets sold anyway it makes little sense in bare numbers - but I think it would make a big difference in terms of marketing and competitiveness.

Tesla doesn't spend any money on marketing. And sells cars faster than they can build them.

So what difference, specifically, would it make? New cars would still be backordered faster than they can be built.

On competition--- what competition?

The current 3 Performance is the quickest EV in the world 0-60 or 1/4 mile anywhere close to the price.

Outside of maybe the C8 corvette it's the quickest car for the $ of any kind on the market.

Hell the NON performance LR AWD with boost is quicker than 99% of sedans on the market, especially anything close to the price.


And if Tesla already doesn't have enough batterys to build more cars- where would this third party partner get them from?
 
I honestly feel that a 4680 Model 3 will work more on weight saving and efficiency rather than give us a Ludicrous option, since they’ll be able to match the advertised 3.1 0-60 with less battery capacity and increase their profit significantly. Not confident we will see a Model S motor / Trimotor variant given its an entry level vehicle. But who knows maybe they will bring the price down significantly back to its 55k price. While it would be awesome to see an $80k Model 3 with big performance upgrades I don’t think it’s in their timeline any time soon since they have the Cybertruck/Roadster/ 25k vehicle to worry about. I do wish tho that the Model 3 could AT LEAST match the 2.9 of the Trimotor Cybertruck. Would hurt to lose a drag race to a car of that size 😂
 
I honestly feel that a 4680 Model 3 will work more on weight saving and efficiency rather than give us a Ludicrous option, since they’ll be able to match the advertised 3.1 0-60 with less battery capacity and increase their profit significantly.


Yup.

4680 is gonna be supply constrained for a good while anyway between Y in Austin and Berlin, Cybertruck, and Semi-- so it'll be a while before we see it in the 3 at all, and until they have enough of em for all models they're likely gonna just cut down the # of cells used to match 2170 specs and be able to make more total cars.


. I do wish tho that the Model 3 could AT LEAST match the 2.9 of the Trimotor Cybertruck. Would hurt to lose a drag race to a car of that size 😂


Last I heard they'd removed all specs, as well as suggesting there won't be a tri-motor CT anyway-- just 2 and 4 motor configs... (which honestly makes sense given how Tesla hates config complexity)
 
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But who knows maybe they will bring the price down significantly back to its 55k price.

As long as Supply < Demand, prices will be going only one way. At that is UP.
Even if the BOM goes down with the new batteries, prices will still go UP.

I do wish tho that the Model 3 could AT LEAST match the 2.9 of the Trimotor Cybertruck. Would hurt to lose a drag race to a car of that size 😂

No point - ain't gonna to happen.
TM3P sales are only 17.5% of total Model 3 sales, and have been declining over the past three years (13.7% in 2021).
Increasing the vehicle performance further will only provide marginal lift in sales. At the time when there is excess demand on Model 3's already (aka wait-lists), there is no point in marginally increasing demand. There just isn't.

The capital, management attention, and production capacity would be better spent on launching brand new models.

a
 
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