TMC is an independent, primarily volunteer organization that relies on ad revenue to cover its operating costs. Please consider whitelisting TMC on your ad blocker and becoming a Supporting Member. For more info: Support TMC

Model 3 Regen goes to full stop?

Discussion in 'Canada' started by pcons, Jul 22, 2018.

  1. pcons

    pcons AWDs on the way to Canada!

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2018
    Messages:
    413
    Location:
    Burlington, Ontario, Canada
    So I test drove a p100d on Friday to get a feel for what a 3 would be like (since they don't have test drives yet). One thing i found very surprising was the Regen doesn't take you to a full stop.

    On my wife's bolt, when you are in low or when you use the paddle Regen it will take you to a full stop and you literally never have to move your foot off the brake unless you have to panick stop.

    I would have assumed having creep off and Regen to max would bring the tesla to a stop but it didn't. I'm assuming the 3 also performs this way? If so, that's one area where I could say I prefer the bolt... The strength of regen is also much higher on the bolt and possibky even on my volt I think.

    I don't expect many more examples like that, but this is already one improvement I would like to see on the model 3.
     
  2. Twiglett

    Twiglett Single pedal driver

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2014
    Messages:
    1,719
    Location:
    Austin
    all Teslas behave the same way.
    No extra paddles that control ONLY regen like the bolt, in Tesla cars regen is just on the accelerator pedal.
    All braking is on the brake pedal.
    Why other EV companies insist on trying to come up with new and crazy ways to stop the car is beyond me.
     
  3. pcons

    pcons AWDs on the way to Canada!

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2018
    Messages:
    413
    Location:
    Burlington, Ontario, Canada
    Respectfully, this isn't a new and crazy way...it just adds to the convenience if 1 pedal driving to actually make the experience 1 pedal. I have had a 2014 and 2017 volt and neither took the car to a stop and I always wished they did. So when my wife's bolt did, I was happily surprised.

    Alas, GM will never do an OTA update to let the Volt do this, but I hoped the bolt had copied tesla since a few owners I spoke to at EV meetups talked about the one pedal driving in a tesla with creep off...so I miss interpreted what they meant by this.

    Once you've driven never having to move your foot you'll understand. Admittedly, it's a minor thing, but also a definite improvement. I realize Regen can't fully operate to a full stop due to the physics and that friction brakes are being applied in the bolt, but since the model 3 has the ability to apply emergency braking and EAP can apply them, it's just a software update that would enable it.

    At least make it an option like turning creep on/off. That way if people don't like it, they don't have to use it.
     
  4. Yangy

    Yangy Member

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2018
    Messages:
    7
    Location:
    North Vancouver
    I think Tesla dailed down regen so you have to use normal brake a bit, after finding that brakes can get stuck, if unused for too long(brake heat helps dehumidify brake oil).
     
  5. outdoors

    outdoors Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2014
    Messages:
    528
    Location:
    MI-FL-ID null
    Just a little read for everyone: Tesla Model 3 Motor — Everything I've Been Able To Learn About It (Welcome To The Machine) | CleanTechnica

    "So, the first puzzle piece in the theory that Tesla has put a switched reluctance motor in the Model 3 is the magnets. We know they’re in there, and now we know that one of the latest breakthroughs in motor design is the inclusion of rare-earths in the stator of the reluctance machine. This is huge. It has brought the reluctance machine out of mothballs!

    Another clue that the Model 3 motor is not using those rare-earths in a conventional permanent-magnet motor design is that the car does not do regen all the way down to 0 miles per hour. For example, the Bolt has a conventional 3-phase PM motor which allows it to do regen to 0 MPH. I saw this for myself last year when I test drove a Bolt — you can stop without applying the brakes. We’re calling this puzzle piece #2."
     
  6. mongo

    mongo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2017
    Messages:
    5,334
    Location:
    Michigan
    Not sure why they think this means something. The 3 has reverse, therefore it can regen (or at least electronically brake) down to zero.
    Design choice vs design limitation.

    S/X with AC induction motors can do this also, but without a quadriture speed sensor, it can't tell if the car is slowly going forward or slowly going backward. 3, with the PMSR setup, likely has full rotor position data and can detect direction, but may be set up to match the operation of S/X...
     
  7. seattlite2004

    seattlite2004 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2016
    Messages:
    630
    Location:
    Puget Sound
    In the Bolt, L mode regen is aggressive and will take the vehicle to a complete stop. The paddle in L mode will provide even more aggressive regen...I use it before I need step on the brakes for when I need to more aggressively stop. One doesn't need to use the paddle in the Bolt to regen to a complete stop.
     
  8. EldestOyster

    EldestOyster Member

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2014
    Messages:
    215
    Location:
    Moonlight Beach
    #8 EldestOyster, Jul 22, 2018
    Last edited: Jul 22, 2018
    As with so many options, it is not a technical limitation; rather, a choice made by the designers. In fact, the Model 3 will come to a complete stop when using cruise control or Autopilot. The BMW Active-E had heavy regen and also would stop itself. The LEAF never came close. But the LEAF had regen control on the brake pedal. And so on.
     
  9. ewoodrick

    ewoodrick Member

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2018
    Messages:
    683
    Location:
    Buford, GA
    So many people seem to equate creep to the wring things.

    Creep On = Emulate automatic transmission
    Creep Off = Emulate manual transmission
     
  10. Buggle

    Buggle Member

    Joined:
    May 16, 2018
    Messages:
    396
    Location:
    Vaughan
    That's not true. It depends on the grade you're stopping on. If you've a 1.5% grade you'll never come to a stop, you'll roll downhill at 2km/hr or something.
     
  11. mongo

    mongo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2017
    Messages:
    5,334
    Location:
    Michigan
    To @EldestOyster 's comment, AP/ cruise control in a Tesla also uses the brakes. Full stops are part of the operating range, but not due to regen.
    (Unless you are refering to the BMW)
     
  12. MacGreiner

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2016
    Messages:
    503
    Location:
    MD
    I don't understand the tech of how it works, all I know is that using 1 pedal driving is amazing. I miss it. Had it in my i3 and the new leaf does it too. Hard to go back to using that second pedal once you try it. I just wish it was a third option for Teslas.
     
  13. ZooSean

    ZooSean ZOO

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2018
    Messages:
    626
    Location:
    Markham, Canada
    One panel driving is illegal. That’s why New leaf and Bolt still have two panels
     
  14. brianman

    brianman Burrito Founder

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2011
    Messages:
    16,647
    On the Bolt, are friction brakes included in the mix of "slow down the vehicle to zero" when lifting from the accelerator pedal? (For Nissan's E-pedal, apparently friction brakes are used to accomplish this behavior.)
     
  15. NYCR160

    NYCR160 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2015
    Messages:
    13
    Location:
    Mansfield, CT
    I prefer the no pedal driving, i.e. Autopilot
     
    • Like x 1
  16. TOFLYIN

    TOFLYIN Member

    Joined:
    May 22, 2018
    Messages:
    26
    Location:
    Toronto
    Edited for effect. New and crazy used to easily describes Tesla. Why put down other companies for trying something new? Having driven a Volt for 7 years prior to my Model 3, I prefer the instant choice of regen or coast. Much more efficient if you want to put in the effort. If you don't just put the car in low and drive 1 pedal. Choice is good. I think that Honda has it best with a regen amount you can dial in with a thumb wheel on the steering wheel.
     
  17. seattlite2004

    seattlite2004 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2016
    Messages:
    630
    Location:
    Puget Sound
    No.
     
  18. MacGreiner

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2016
    Messages:
    503
    Location:
    MD
    This is true on the i3. Even when the battery is full and there is no regen available, the friction brakes will kick in to mirror the same feeling as standard regen. You never got that coasting 'surprise' you get when you first take your foot off the accelerator with a full battery. I was surprised Tesla did not have a similar function to offer.
     
  19. pcons

    pcons AWDs on the way to Canada!

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2018
    Messages:
    413
    Location:
    Burlington, Ontario, Canada
    I had assumed the bolt did apply friction brakes for the last slowdown from ~ 5km/h to stopped, but an earlier post in this thread indicates that the motor used in the bolt allows for regen down to a full stop....so I'm not exactly sure, but it feels very smooth and natural in the bolt.
     

Share This Page

  • About Us

    Formed in 2006, Tesla Motors Club (TMC) was the first independent online Tesla community. Today it remains the largest and most dynamic community of Tesla enthusiasts. Learn more.
  • Do you value your experience at TMC? Consider becoming a Supporting Member of Tesla Motors Club. As a thank you for your contribution, you'll get nearly no ads in the Community and Groups sections. Additional perks are available depending on the level of contribution. Please visit the Account Upgrades page for more details.


    SUPPORT TMC