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Model 3 review - After moving from RWD to AWD

Discussion in 'Model 3' started by Merle Corey, Jan 1, 2019.

  1. wcorey

    wcorey Active Member

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    It's really too early to tell, no snow, no ice, no slush. I had a Prius Plugin Advanced before the Model 3 so I am used to not hearing an engine, just wind and road noise. I think snow tires have always been louder than All Season or 3 Season tires. They aren't obnoxiously loud. I'd guess plus or minus the same as the Michelin 3 season, MXMX. The Prius came with Michelin Energy tires, designed to max mileage but as they wore down (I was driving 500+ miles/wk) they were dangerous in snow. But I got outstanding mileage in the Prius except for winter. There was a table I saw day before yesterday, Tesla Range Table - Teslike.com that showed range for the M3 in various configurations. I don't see anything remotely close to that. I'm probably avg 350-400 wh/mi now. It's partly tires, probably mostly heat. People take heat in ICE cars in winter for granted. One can't do that in a Tesla. That said, I am not so anal to turn the cabin heat off and use mittens and seat warmer. I leave the cabin temp at 70, the rest is what it is. I spoke to several people, one of which was @Mad Hungarian and he concurred with the local tire store the R3s were the best Winter tire period. XIce are in the same neighborhood and appear similarly priced. On the Prius, once I bagged, the Michelin Energy's I put on Nokian WR G4 all season (with snowflake mtn). While there was a dramatic drop in miles per charge from 11-12 to 9 so 25% drop, they were outstanding tires. Nokian doesn't recommend them for the Tesla though. They do have an 18" version so I am guessing they are rated for the weight / tire. I'll see if I can't bookmark this thread / your question and revist it in a month or two with real world Winter tire performance. Or, perhaps April start a new thread on Winter tire performance for M3s.
     
  2. StealthP3D

    StealthP3D Active Member

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    I don't want to speak for Mad Hungarian, but I'm confident he would not say any single tire is "the best winter tire, period". It doesn't work that way.

    I've had plenty of winter tires with more snow/ice drip than my Pirelli Sottozero 2's but unless you were on roads that were covered in snow/ice, those winter tires were terrible tires. The Sottozero's perform more than adequately when actively driving on roads covered in snow/ice and continue to perform when there is pavement peeking through.

    They are, as close as I can tell, the same loudness as the OEM Michelin MXM4 Primacy's and have better cornering on bare pavement because they have a much more predictable release. The Primacy's grip just as well on most cold weather pavement, wet or dry, but cut loose unpredictably when they lose grip. This makes the Sottozero 2's a much more fun tire than typical winter tires and even better than the Michelins on bare pavement. I only compare the winter Sottozero's to the all season Primacy's to illustrate that not all winter tires have to suck when you're not on snow/ice.

    Granted, I have them on an AWD. If it was for the RWD, and I needed to climb the same steep hills in the same severe winter storms, I might reluctantly consider a more winter orientated tire. But the superior electronic stability and traction controls of the Model 3 make the Sottozero's perform more than adequately on my AWD P3D. Are they "the best winter tire", of course not, there is no such thing.
     
    • Informative x 1
    • Disagree x 1
  3. RachH

    RachH "Christine" Model 3 Blk Obsidian, LR, AWD

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    Hey everyone! I have the AWD, LR with the upgraded wheels. I LOVE it!!!! I have only had it a couple of months but I have already driven to CA from TX (where I picked it up) and Los Angeles to San Francisco and back. I'm happy to answer any questions about mileage and such since I have been playing with that- if anyone is interested.

    I became a Tesla fan years ago since my x had a roadster (number 109 out of the factory) and then an S (I think it was 67 out of the factory) and now has a 3. I have driven the first two and I was sold. Put in my order on day one. I've also done research and gone to Tesla events as well so I am not a total newbie.

    BUT, I have two questions and they may sound dumb- I apologize for that. I have looked everywhere and can't seem to find the answers. Figured you all would know since there are so many Tesla experts on here :)

    - What letters would my car be- in other words is mine a 3D or something else?
    - I supposedly have the Obsidian Black but I can't really tell the difference when I see someones regular black car. Isn't it supposed to subtly change colors when you look at it from different angles- that's what I was originally told?!? Mine doesn't.

    I'm beginning to wonder why I paid the extra for the Obsidian. Sigh.
     
  4. TEG

    TEG TMC Moderator

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    Just calling yours AWD should be good enough.

    Yeah, I suppose "3D". There is the "P3D-" which has more power, and the "P3D+" which has more power, bigger brakes, bigger wheels, etc.

    Obsidian Black is another type of black, and doesn't really change colors, but should have (on close inspection) visible metallic flakes in the paint, and have a different sort of reflective capability than the regular black. I think it tends to look better when dusty, whereas the regular black just looks dirty.
     
    • Helpful x 1
  5. Merle Corey

    Merle Corey Member

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    I thought about this also and checked my last year’s return. Yep, I do have enough tax liability. I don’t know if that’s a good thing or bad! I guess a good thing for at least this year!
     
  6. Merle Corey

    Merle Corey Member

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    That calculation did not count for tax loses. I figured that was an eaten cost... I wouldn’t expect to get anything close if taxes were counted. Just close your eyes at that point and hand it over to Uncle Sam (again).
     
  7. geometro

    geometro Member

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    I asked Tesla for a trade in offer for my LR Blue (10K) this past week as I was thinking of switching to AWD. They came back with an offer of $35.5k :( so I can’t make the math work.

    I’m surprised by the low offer for a car that’s only 8 months old.
     
  8. JeffK

    JeffK Well-Known Member

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    I've heard that Tesla notoriously lowballs Tesla offers and that you should go through someone else. You might consider shopping around for quotes.
     
  9. wcorey

    wcorey Active Member

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    That's remarkably close to calling me a liar. Are you really certain you wanted to do that, just to have me publicly prove you wrong? Strictly speaking it wasn't "...period", it was "... for the Model 3".
     
  10. wcorey

    wcorey Active Member

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    I don't think it's so much a case of notorious for low-balling. It's what they do. They don't resell the cars, as in having a used car lot, they sell them to a wholesaler, ala the guy with the shingle out on the vacant lot that takes and sells repossessed cars. Frankly I don't know where they come from but the cars dealers don't want on their used lots go to wholesalers. If you look in KBB and do a what's my car worth and tell it, regardless of the condition, that it's in good condition, that is, in my experience, what you'll get. Remarkably that is also what CarMax gives. As in rather than study the pictures themselves they'll take, penny for penny, what Car Max offers. So you could try them, get it in writing and give that to Tesla if it's better than $35.5k.
     
  11. StealthP3D

    StealthP3D Active Member

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    Calm down now...I'll clarify what I said. I really don't think he would say any single tire is "the best winter tire, period" or even "the best winter tire for a Model 3" because there isn't such a thing. If he said that, I disagree with him. If he didn't, maybe you misunderstood what he was really saying. But I don't think it's necessary to get all hot-headed about it and accuse me of calling you a liar (because that's not what I said or implied). You can see my post above (#82) to understand why no one winter tire could ever be "the best tire, period".
     
  12. Dbregmam

    Dbregmam Member

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    I am glad to hear this - I love my AWD, but have wondered if I would have been better with a RWD for the extra range/efficiency. Since, in your case, the RWD had Areo rims and you did not that is ~4% gain there. So it looks like only a ~5% difference between RWD and AWD.

     
  13. Dbregmam

    Dbregmam Member

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    One more thing that occurred to me reading this thread - is there any difference in regen in the RWD vs the AWD? I have seen posts that there is a regen issue with RWD in snow.
     
  14. wcorey

    wcorey Active Member

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    It's more nuanced than that. At one point, perhaps it's fixed in software now, if you had a snow tire other than the one they sell in the Winter Package Kit, you MAY have an issue. I put on Nokian Hakka R3s on the same 18" Aero rims and regen works just fine. As I recall it, what Tesla said was if you put on a snow tire other than that recommended in the owners manual and did have a problem with regen to let your local Service Center know so they can add that to the list to test and, perhaps, program for. I think it has to do with side give and that may confuse the sensors.
    There's got to be a snow tire thread on here or you could start one. As what snow tires people have on their Model 3? and do they have issues? Again, the 18" Nokian Hakka R3 works fine.
     
  15. LyftupX

    LyftupX Member

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    AWD

    Is less efficent but the real range killer is using any kind of AC controls.

    Out the gate my first 1.5 k miles were 310 w/m ..... i now implemented Chill and am sitting at 284 for the most recent 400 miles.

    There are long stretches and good runs i can get in the 235-245 range.

    Overall love the car and glad i went with AWD.
     
  16. wcorey

    wcorey Active Member

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    I'm thinking 310 wh/mi sounds really good. From what I can tell I am running about 340 wh/mi.
    Heat is set at 70 and I don't use seat heaters. It is what it is New England winters.

    The AWD barely makes a dent as shown in
    Tesla Range Table - Teslike.com
    and, according to @Mad Hungarian the Aero covers save about 4%.
     
  17. RachH

    RachH "Christine" Model 3 Blk Obsidian, LR, AWD

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    Yes- they do low ball. For my trade in, my service rep recommended I go to CarMax to get a trade in quote- which they would match. It was higher than what Tesla offered so Tesla matched.
     
  18. Knightshade

    Knightshade Active Member

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    seems pretty YMMV... Carmax offered me about 5% less than Tesla did when I got quotes from both for example.
     
  19. ℬête Noire

    ℬête Noire Active Member

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    The colder the weather I drive in the more I agree with my wife, Tesla missed the mark not including a heating element in the Model 3's steering wheel. And I'm a Canadian ex-Pat living in SE Texas.

    Damn it I'm getting old. LOL
     
  20. ℬête Noire

    ℬête Noire Active Member

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    Sometimes they won't even do that. :/ Just a big, fat "take it or leave it".
     

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