Model 3 review - After moving from RWD to AWD

[Alt168]

One would hope with RFID the number of combinations would be so large as to be impossible.

Not trying to be acquisitory, but I too find it unlikely that the RFID card would open even one other car. While I've never seen a technical write-up on the key cards, I doubt Tesla is using the RFID card's ID number. If they are, then conceivably someone could duplicate your key by simply scanning it via brushing up against your wallet. My guess would be that the authentication is a cryptographic challenge and response sequence where the RFID card's hard coded key is never revealed on the radio channel.

That said, there have been many past examples where companies have taken the easy route over the secure route.

 

[Bad Dolphin]

Having both a RWD and AWD in our garage, they are very different animals.
The RWD is light and sporty feeling in the steering. it takes the perfect amount of effort to move the wheel (normal setting). and the car feels light and playful and like a happy dog ready to bounce.

The AWD feels heavy in the wheel and more serious. It doesn't make jokes. if it does, it makes them in German, and they are very serious.

the AWD is WAY quicker in and out of the turns and whoa is it a fun ride in the twisties. But the RWD begs to be played with. the AWD takes away some of the fun, but adds the rip your face off feel.

Depending on my mood and the road, I'd be happy to drive either...
Also, the AWD doesn't send as much power to the back, so you don't feel like you need more grip from the OEM (18) tires. The RWD begs for more grip. the AWD uses available grip better, but again it's so serious about it!

Anything below 'the limit' of the tires/horse power... the cars are very similar. almost impossible to tell apart. Only when pushed do you notice the difference... and really... I still can't tell which I prefer.

Very nice comparison!

 

[ElGuapoGuano]

When I stood in line in March of 2016. I had said then that I wanted Dual Motor, Autopilot, and a color. Well when my number came up, only the RWD was available. So I jumped on it. Even if I would have done like the post creator did, I wouldn't have had the tax liability to cover $15,000. But it's all good. I am very happy with my purchase. Best car I've ever owned... by far.

 

[t0mmyr]

question, when tesla offered 45,100. do they add tax to that offer or is that a cash offer? seems like you'd loose another 4500 in taxes if not

 

[bwestlak]

Anyone needing additional tax credit always has the option of converting IRA money to ROTH IRA to incur additional tax to offset a tax credit. We have done this a couple of times sizing the conversion to the tax credit we want to offset.

 

[StealthP3D]

Anything below 'the limit' of the tires/horse power... the cars are very similar. almost impossible to tell apart. Only when pushed do you notice the difference... and really... I still can't tell which I prefer.

I agree. They are both great. I think I prefer the RWD LR for its efficiency and range and the AWD P3D for its stunning acceleration. If I had to choose to keep only one it would probably be the P3D but once you factor money into the equation it might be the RWD LR.

I love the way the P3D can go from 0-45 mph with no noise and no drama in about 2 seconds flat. It can silently merge from a stop sign into 45 mph traffic without having to "catch up" to the car in front. In other words, by the time you step on it, you're already there in the flow of traffic. Other drivers are not accustomed to seeing this, it looks very odd to them and they will wonder if they just saw what they thought they saw. It's the same way leaving a stop light if you are first in line. You can silently "eject" yourself about 1/10 mile ahead before the cars behind you have even crossed the intersection.

 

[pdamski]

I agree. They are both great. I think I prefer the RWD LR for its efficiency and range and the AWD P3D for its stunning acceleration. If I had to choose to keep only one it would probably be the P3D but once you factor money into the equation it might be the RWD LR.

I love the way the P3D can go from 0-45 mph with no noise and no drama in about 2 seconds flat. It can silently merge from a stop sign into 45 mph traffic without having to "catch up" to the car in front. In other words, by the time you step on it, you're already there in the flow of traffic. Other drivers are not accustomed to seeing this, it looks very odd to them and they will wonder if they just saw what they thought they saw. It's the same way leaving a stop light if you are first in line. You can silently "eject" yourself about 1/10 mile ahead before the cars behind you have even crossed the intersection.

I test drove a P3D for my first experience and there was no going back from there. My Owner Advisor took me up the Palms-To-Pines Hwy (74) for my test drive. This becomes a very twisty climb up to the top of the Santa Rosa Mountains. I had driven this road many times in my Benz and was pretty familiar with the upcoming curves so I was able to push the demo pretty hard and encouraged to do so by the advisor. This was the first time I had driven an AWD car and I was immediately impressed by the ability to stick in the turns and the lack of body roll. This car is tight. On the downhill return there is a long straight section and the advisor encouraged me to "step on it." I felt that butterflies in the stomach I had felt in my BIL's Model S P85 and I was sold. To quote my Owner Advisor, "there is nothing better than being the first in line in a Tesla."

 

[SabrToothSqrl]

been there. done that. I've left lights at what I thought was a normal pace, look back and wonder if the light was actually green...?!

Of course now that I'm back in a Tesla, anytime there is a car in front of me, I hate that person with the fury of 1,000 suns on 1 million solar panels!

 

[JeffnReno]

I've seen several people reference that. However, I am puzzled by one thing. Just as there are differences between Audi Quattro and, say, Suburu AWD my understanding is AWD can engage any or all of the wheels. Here is the language from Tesla on the AWD option.

This makes it sound like the car is, at any point in time, either FWD or RWD as opposed to 60/40 or 40/60. Would someone elaborate on just what the implementation of AWD actually is?

I would like to see that explained in more detail myself. When I was looking at Tesla prior to the Model 3, it seems like the dual motor versions actually were rated to be slightly more efficient in the Model S/X of the same model cars in various battery sizes. It was explained that since Tesla controls the power to each motor for the best for result, that a traditional AWD/4X4 ICE car being less efficient to a FWD or RWD of the same variant can't be compared for that reason. It seems that isn't true when it comes to the Model 3.

 

[Zextraterrestrial]

Having both a RWD and AWD in our garage, they are very different animals.
The RWD is light and sporty feeling in the steering. it takes the perfect amount of effort to move the wheel (normal setting). and the car feels light and playful and like a happy dog ready to bounce.

The AWD feels heavy in the wheel and more serious. It doesn't make jokes. if it does, it makes them in German, and they are very serious.

the AWD is WAY quicker in and out of the turns and whoa is it a fun ride in the twisties. But the RWD begs to be played with. the AWD takes away some of the fun, but adds the rip your face off feel.

Depending on my mood and the road, I'd be happy to drive either...
Also, the AWD doesn't send as much power to the back, so you don't feel like you need more grip from the OEM (18) tires. The RWD begs for more grip. the AWD uses available grip better, but again it's so serious about it!

Anything below 'the limit' of the tires/horse power... the cars are very similar. almost impossible to tell apart. Only when pushed do you notice the difference... and really... I still can't tell which I prefer.

This is pretty much how I'd compare my '12 P85 to an '18 75D, with the exception that the 75D is more light and sporty feeling <30mph. P85 is more fun to drive hard...love the 'Jokes in German' .. kind of like a car with a stiff upper lip lol

 

[JeffK]

I would like to see that explained in more detail myself. When I was looking at Tesla prior to the Model 3, it seems like the dual motor versions actually were rated to be slightly more efficient in the Model S/X of the same model cars in various battery sizes. It was explained that since Tesla controls the power to each motor for the best for result, that a traditional AWD/4X4 ICE car being less efficient to a FWD or RWD of the same variant can't be compared for that reason. It seems that isn't true when it comes to the Model 3.

Two things to keep in mind

• The Model 3 has a more efficient rear motor.
• The weight difference in the dual motor vs RWD is more significant as a percentage of total body weight in Model 3 vs Model S/X

 

[David29]

AFAIK, the amount of power delivered to each wheel under different conditions is known only to Tesla engineers. I've never seen a published report that attempted to quantify this. My assumption is that under normal gradual acceleration (like what you see in typical traffic) the front motor is only powered enough that the front wheels are not a net drag overall and that under stronger acceleration the front wheels are relied on increasingly to prevent excessive slip/wear of the rear tires. In slippery conditions, of course, power is directed as needed (and it can do this faster than any ICE AWD). My P3D feels more like a RWD car than a FWD car when accelerating hard around a curve.

The primary reasons the dual motor versions are less efficient is because the front motor is a different type of motor with a lower efficiency factor (and it adds around 250 lbs.). Also, there is one more gear reduction unit and drive axle that is always engaged. The lower efficiency is not because both motors are constantly powered, that's actually a good thing.

Curious that you say dual motor versions are less efficient. For Model S anyway, when there were RWD versions, the AWD had longer range and hence must have been slightly more efficient (5 or 6 miles more range advertised for the 70D than for the 70, as I recall). And according to this tabulation (Tesla Range Table - Teslike.com), the difference in actual range was even more than that for the 70/70D and 85/85D, etc.

Is there maybe something about the Model 3 motor design or the control system that would make Model 3 AWD less efficient where Model S AWD is apparently more efficient?

 

[JeffK]

Curious that you say dual motor versions are less efficient. For Model S anyway, when there were RWD versions, the AWD had longer range and hence must have been slightly more efficient (5 or 6 miles more range advertised for the 70D than for the 70, as I recall). And according to this tabulation (Tesla Range Table - Teslike.com), the difference in actual range was even more than that for the 70/70D and 85/85D, etc.

Is there maybe something about the Model 3 motor design or the control system that would make Model 3 AWD less efficient where Model S AWD is apparently more efficient?

In Model S you have two motors of similar efficiency geared differently. Whereas in Model 3 your rear motor is much more efficient than the front. Just having the front motor there or using it at all will lower efficiency.

 

[StealthP3D]

Is there maybe something about the Model 3 motor design or the control system that would make Model 3 AWD less efficient where Model S AWD is apparently more efficient?

Yes, the rear motor of the Model 3 is considerably more efficient than the motors in the Models S & X while the front motor is a standard AC induction design similar to the motors in the S & X. Even under easy driving, the AWD Model 3 is penalized by the weight of the front motor in addition to the additional friction inherent in having the front drive motor as well as the two front drive shafts always turning. Under harder acceleration, the less efficient front motor consumes more electricity per unit of "work" and thus decreases efficiency further.

The situation in the Models S & X is somewhat different since they use two AC induction motors that have less overall efficiency and a less broad efficiency sweet spot. AWD versions of the S & X were able to squeeze out a bit more efficiency through the magic of gearing each motor for optimum efficiency at different speeds. Thus, they could hand off the task of propelling the car at various speeds to whichever motor was in its natural sweet spot for efficiency.

 

[RSL2020]

Curious that you say dual motor versions are less efficient. For Model S anyway, when there were RWD versions, the AWD had longer range and hence must have been slightly more efficient (5 or 6 miles more range advertised for the 70D than for the 70, as I recall). And according to this tabulation (Tesla Range Table - Teslike.com), the difference in actual range was even more than that for the 70/70D and 85/85D, etc.

Is there maybe something about the Model 3 motor design or the control system that would make Model 3 AWD less efficient where Model S AWD is apparently more efficient?

For the model 3, it has to do with the motors being different designs. The rear motor is the new permanent magnet design which is the most efficient. The front motor is the traditional Tesla induction motor design which is also used in the Model S. So by adding the front motor to the model 3 you are reducing efficiency. The new permanent magnet motor is only used in the rear of the model 3.

 

[Rural]

glad everything worked out! the AWD Non P is a beast.

Thats cause its the same car, minus the wheels, breaks and shiny pedals. Same motors.

 

[StealthP3D]

Thats cause its the same car, minus the wheels, breaks and shiny pedals. Same motors.

I have a Performance Model 3. It came with the same wheels, brakes and pedals the AWD Model 3 came with. The difference is the software unleashes the beast inside. It goes 0-60 mph about 30% more quickly. Other than that, it's an AWD.

 

[SabrToothSqrl]

I have a Performance Model 3. It came with the same wheels, brakes and pedals the AWD Model 3 came with. The difference is the software unleashes the beast inside. It goes 0-60 mph about 30% more quickly. Other than that, it's an AWD.

I wish you were closer. I'd love to pace the 0-30, 0-60, 0-100, 30-60, 45-60, 50-75, etc of these cars.
I'm a SUV guy, so I skipped the Perf. as I plan to sell this when the pickup or Y is out.

It's also my understanding that much past 45-50 mph the AWD and P-AWD are similar.
I don't know if that's accurate without the numbers, and I've not driven the performance one.

While 0-60 is sure hella fun, it's the 45-75 that makes on ramps and highway's fun for me...

 

[Knightshade]

I wish you were closer. I'd love to pace the 0-30, 0-60, 0-100, 30-60, 45-60, 50-75, etc of these cars.
I'm a SUV guy, so I skipped the Perf. as I plan to sell this when the pickup or Y is out.

It's also my understanding that much past 45-50 mph the AWD and P-AWD are similar.
I don't know if that's accurate without the numbers, and I've not driven the performance one.

While 0-60 is sure hella fun, it's the 45-75 that makes on ramps and highway's fun for me...

The #s are out there in previous threads- and yeah most of the difference is in the 0-60.. (check out where the 1/4 mile times and trap speeds are compared for example to see the difference between the two after 60 being pretty small....versus the RWD that's way behind both all the way to the end)

 

[Ubermentis]

With snow tires or stock Michelin 3 season tires? My Model 3 was delivered Nov 7 and about a week or so later, swapped the 3 season tires for Nokian Hakka R3s. I literally believe it hasn't snowed since. Of course February is the big snow month. Also our driveway has a 30% incline for 250'.

I just placed a set of 19" Michelin Xice. Was going to put Nokian Hakka R3 but couldn't get them in 20". Bought 19" rims and will consider the Hakka again next year? How have you liked them?