Model 3 specs

[FlatSix911]

Back in the late '70s when I lived in Alaska for awhile, I was car shopping and the SAAB dealer was extolling the virtues of the Swedish marque with its front-wheel drive and heated seats. As a young man at the time, I was concerned about raising my body temperature in certain regions and the impact it may have on my future ability to be fruitful and multiply. I did not buy the SAAB (but that wasn't the sole reason).

I had a SAAB Turbo 900 back in the 70's ... with no lasting impact for potential offspring

 

[Vic4Model3]

Why is EPA showing, on their July 5 document, a range of 495 miles for the rear wheel drive, long range battery 2017 Tesla Model 3?

 

[shrspeedblade]

Why is EPA showing, on their July 5 document, a range of 495 miles for the rear wheel drive, long range battery 2017 Tesla Model 3?

Probably because the test was done at a comparitively slow speed in a controlled environment. Keep in mind, a Model S 100D has broken the 600 mile/1000km barrier in a controlled environment and at I believe just over 20 mph.

 

[Vic4Model3]

Right, I'm aware of the Italian getting 620 miles on an S100D with 27mph average.

But, the EPA shows the Bolt at 238 miles range. So I can only assume the Model 3 was put through the same set of tests.

Maybe Tesla is underestimating range for the worstcase scenario (extreme temps at either end of the spectrum). Definitely good to avoid range complaints from a less forgiving customer base.

 

[Topher]

But, the EPA shows the Bolt at 238 miles range. So I can only assume the Model 3 was put through the same set of tests.

Probably same test, but in the Bolt case you are looking at numbers after analysis and corrections (e.g. air resistance), and the Tesla is raw numbers.

Thank you kindly.

 

[Vic4Model3]

Page 7 of the reference EPA doc shows the Charge Depleting Range as 454.64 (not 495, as I posted earlier) for both Calculated AND Actual. Very suspect!

So the EPA results can be taken with a grain of salt.

 

[Vic4Model3]

EPA Certificate HTSLV00.0L13-004.pdf for 2017 Tesla Model 3, Long Range:
city cycle = 495 miles range
gentle highway cycle = 454 miles range

 

[insaneoctane]

Those numbers are performed on a dyno and used to calculate epa numbers, but misleading by themselves.

 

[SageBrush]

Very suspect!
So the EPA results can be taken with a grain of salt.

Raw data from the UDDS and highway cycles.
The Monroney sticker numbers you are thinking of have been discounted ~ 30% to account for A/C etc
Not suspect at all.

 

[KarenRei]

Raw data from the UDDS and highway cycles.
The Monroney sticker numbers you are thinking of have been discounted ~ 30% to account for A/C etc
Not suspect at all.

*** This. To mimic the more real-world five-cycle, the raw city and highway charge depletion ranges are multiplied by 0.7:

https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/pdfs/EPA test procedure for EVs-PHEVs-7-5-2012.pdf

 

[SageBrush]

To mimic the more real-world five-cycle

I call this the "no driver left behind" cycle, to honor the moronic school policy in the US from the li'l Bush era.

If only I had a penny for every time someone has written the equivalent of "that test does not drive the way I do so it must be wrong." As if "real world" was not ~ 1 billion different results.

 

[SageBrush]

Very suspect!

Suspect, of what ?

 

[Vic4Model3]

Suspect of real world driving range.

 

[SageBrush]

Suspect of real world driving range.

Whose real world ?
What real world ? The one with wet roads or dry roads ?
The "real world" that is always the same termperature ?

Or do you think that the people driving 65 mph have the same "real world" as driving 85 mph ?
Any chance people in the "real world" might use brakes more or less than another ?

 

[Vic4Model3]

Thanks for the clarification (.7 multifunction factor), I'll change my Model 3 Saved Preference back to 220 range.

 

[ohmman]

Whose real world ?
What real world ? The one with wet roads or dry roads ?
The "real world" that is always the same termperature ?

Or do you think that the people driving 65 mph have the same "real world" as driving 85 mph ?
Any chance people in the "real world" might use brakes more or less than another ?

While your point is taken - "real world" can mean different things to different people - I think the argument is more about whether or not it's within one or two standard deviations from the mean. At some point, it's potentially "real world" for a few people but excludes the majority of ownership. Something like:

 

[SageBrush]

"real world" can mean different things to different people

I say 'normative US driving' when I am trying to describe +/- one SD from the mean.

To your point though, a long time ago I read that the old EPA 2 cycle tests captured the best performing 30 percentile of drivers and the 5-cycle now misses the bottom 30 percentile. Left unstated buy implied though is that as Americans use more A/C and heating, drive faster and more aggressively, the percentile shifts.

 

[stopcrazypp]

Right, I'm aware of the Italian getting 620 miles on an S100D with 27mph average.

But, the EPA shows the Bolt at 238 miles range. So I can only assume the Model 3 was put through the same set of tests.

Maybe Tesla is underestimating range for the worstcase scenario (extreme temps at either end of the spectrum). Definitely good to avoid range complaints from a less forgiving customer base.

The EPA shows 364.4 and 310.63 for the Bolt from a similar sheet (vs 495.11 and 454.64 for Model 3 LR).
[Spoiler Alert + Mild Speculation] Tesla has created a monster!

The raw numbers in the document can't just be used directly.

 

[voyager]

I know that the Model S features a battery pack that tips the scale at 500 kg.
My question is:
how much does the Model 3's battery pack weigh?

 

[KarenRei]

According to the M3 press kit, the weight difference between LR and SR is 265 lbs, corresponding to 90 miles range, so you could extrapolate to 648lbs for the SR and 912lbs for the LR. Although in practice it's not that simple since there are knock-on effects to weight and there's more to a battery pack than just cells, not all of which scale linearly.