Model 3 Supercharging Capable Discussion

[Muaddid]

Agree with MP3Mike, pay-as-you-go means a whole different payment system, compared to a lump sum you can activate in-store or even through mytesla. In some areas, to be able to charge someone for electricity requires you to be considered a utility company, not a car manufacturer, which overall brings more cost than the revenue from a pay-per-use system.


I think it'll be around 1000$ for long distance supercharger usage for the smallest battery, and probably included in the first battery upgrade.

 

[eye.surgeon]

I suspect paying for supercharger access will be an option paid at the time of deliveryon the Model 3, rather than at point of use, and one important differentiator between it and big brother. That premium can then be used to fund expansion of the S/C network.

 

[Drumheller]

I also like the pay per use model and I think the idea of a 2c charge over local rates to help pay for the superchargers is good. If Tesla does go pay per use, they can open the supercharger network up to all other manufacturers. That's quite the opportunity.

 

[Xaff]

Elon Musk said during the unveil that Supercharging will be standard. The only way that you would pay extra for supercharging is if Tesla changes the way Superchargers operate (i.e. pay per use model, etc.). You will not have to pay to have it enabled on your Model 3.

 

[Big-T]

This all seems contrary to the model 3 reveal. at 7:21 in the reveal Elon said "With respect to supercharging all model 3's will come with supercharging standard" and then he went on for quite a while about how this was critical to freedom of travel.

To me, that seemed very cut and dry, supercharging will not be an "add on option" it will be standard, even on the base car.

Everyone seems tied up in the finances of whether they can "allow" it. It's Elon's company he's already shown he's not going to do things just for the accountants sake. He wants supercharging to be mandatory that's how it's going to be.

 

[MP3Mike]

I also like the pay per use model and I think the idea of a 2c charge over local rates to help pay for the superchargers is good. If Tesla does go pay per use, they can open the supercharger network up to all other manufacturers. That's quite the opportunity.

They have already offered the Supercharger network to other manufactures. But the terms were that the partners would have to pay their fair share of the cost of building and maintaining the network, as well as making the charging free for the customers. (i.e. the cost needs to be built in to the cost of the car, or a one-time opt-in option.)

 

[kavyboy]

I wonder if they could do a mix of pay and free. For example, each car could supercharge for free for a certain number of times within a period of time at each supercharger location. For example, you might get 8 free charges a month at each supercharger. That would be enough for people without home charging to keep charged, would prevent Uber/taxi "abuse", would be just inconvenient enough to encourage home charging, and wouldn't limit long-distance travel at all since you're unlikely to hit the same supercharger more than twice on a long-distance trip.

Maybe that's easier said than done, but I think the result would be generally make everyone happy.

 

[owen.shift]

I also like the pay per use model and I think the idea of a 2c charge over local rates to help pay for the superchargers is good.

It might not even have to be 2c more: Here in Germany, the cost for electricity is approaching 30c / kWh. And that is Euro cents; so more than $.30. However, Tesla is not paying nearly that; it's probably not much more than 10 cents. So they could leverage their bulk discount, sell at market rate – and still make a healthy profit.

If Tesla does go pay per use, they can open the supercharger network up to all other manufacturers. That's quite the opportunity.

Especially in combination with the above.

 

[TexasEV]

I guess we need to see an "official statement" from Tesla. IT better be included! Thats half of the reason to buy one.

If you think that's half of the reason to buy a Tesla, you really don't understand what it's all about.

 

[houdini]

Tesla has already talked about no pay per use as there's stupid costs involved in running a billing system and it comes fraught with data and customer management problems.

Why do people think it won't come baked into the price of a $35,000 car? This isn't a cheap car. I don't know what it's ike over there in the US but here a BMW 3 series (competitor to the 3) is not a mass market or cheap car. It's actually for people that are quite well off. W have new cars here down in the teens of thousands. So you can buy a $13999 car and then spend $20,000 on petrol and you're still ahead of the Tesla in many years. I'm travelling in the wrong circles if people think a $35,000 car is "cheap" and "mass market".

I understand also that Tesla pulled the Stats and most owners charge at home, most of the time, and some have never used a supercharger ever. It'll be the same with the Model 3. It's just so handy to plug in when you get home and wake up to a full charge.

Personally I do think however that we'll probably get slugged with a fee on the small battery. Maybe $1000 to enable super charger use for life. Or if Tesla is so happy/giddy from the success of the launch they'll go back to the original wording and keep it free.

 

[Rookie]

Well in the website for model 3 the feature is listed as supercharger "capable". I also feel that it would be an option. Because it being included was not confirmed. May be for higher version it may be included but for base i am not so sure.

 

[ikjadoon]

I wonder if the massive number of pre-orders made them change their tune.

If we're this high already, imagine how high it will go after Part 2.

 

[hoang51]

This has happened (people using a local SC frequently instead of charging at their house). Tesla tracks it and has slapped their wrist.

Link to source?

 

[raysspl]

Technically speaking, Tesla can make the Supercharging stations perpetually free of use as long as long as they pass the costs in the car line-up.

 

[burgerandshake]

Tesla has a supercharger problem. With today's 'all you can eat' model there's already contention for superchargers. To prepare for the onslaught of Model 3's Tesla said they'd double the number of Superchargers, however once all the pre-orders have been delivered there will be at least 4x the number of Tesla's on the road. Either Tesla is going to have double their Supercharger deployment plan again or they'll have to develop a new model.

Personally I don't think the 'all you can eat' model is sustainable once the Model 3's hit the road. My preference is for the Model 3 owners to use a pay per use model as it'll help fund Supercharger growth, it'll manage contention, and it'll help differentiate the Model 3 from the Model S. Model S owners of course would continue to receive the 'all you can eat' plan they paid for.

 

[Snow Drift]

Link to source?

Tesla sends out 'don't use our Superchargers all the time' letters


Now, what about the old S60? That didn't have access to SC without a $2500 upgrade.
Tesla — Enable Supercharging

They could make base owners pay an upgrade fee and give it free to bigger battery and/or Dual Mode.

 

[MP3Mike]

Tesla has a supercharger problem. With today's 'all you can eat' model there's already contention for superchargers.

What is your point? There is already contention at gas stations. The lines I have seen at Costco sometimes are just plain stupid.

They don't need to plan the Supercharger network such that there is always at least one spot open when someone pulls up.

 

[PaulusdB]

...Here in Germany, the cost for electricity is approaching 30c / kWh. And that is Euro cents; so more than $.30. However, Tesla is not paying nearly that; it's probably not much more than 10 cents...

You're (partly) talking retail prices, I'm afraid.
Dutch retail price is € 0,045 per kWh, excluding consumer taxes.
Tesla Motors buys wholesale and therefore happily waives the energy cost (€ 1,00 per charging session?) for not having to run a billing system and the hassle of the car/customer identification process.

 

[burgerandshake]

What is your point? There is already contention at gas stations. The lines I have seen at Costco sometimes are just plain stupid.

They don't need to plan the Supercharger network such that there is always at least one spot open when someone pulls up.

Agreed, those lines are crazy and I want to avoid them. I think Tesla is trying to achieve a user experience better than an ICE experience. An EV is great for local driving, however driving a distance beyond the capacity of your battery is still a little sketchy, the Superchargers are suppose to address that, however, if we have to wait for a Supercharger to become available then that's going to diminish the user experience, might as well go back to ICE.

 

[tpoltron]

I like the pay as you go model as I really fear the impact on travel convenience that 300k M3s will have.

To minimize Supercharger congestion they could even charge per minute plugged in - not by how much electricity is being used. As many of you know Tesla's start charging fast then slow down to protect the battery as they get full. Set the pricing so Tesla only breaks even on the electricity costs at the peak charging current then once the car starts to taper down or, even worse finish charging, the profit is an incentive to move your car, that also funds further Supercharger expansion. As an example at $0.25 per minute it would cost $4 for a 20min 1/2 battery charge, $12 for a 95% 45 minute tapered charge, and $15 an hour for 'parking'. Even though the fee would seem relatively small to some, I expect it would significantly reduce Supercharger congestion.

Some posters raised the hassle of billing and collection as an issue, but I don't think is has to be. Supposedly all the Supercharging data goes back to Tesla including start and stop times. If they required you to have a credit or debit card on file to enable Supercharger access then their system should be able to bill and charge you easily every month for the time that you are plugged in.

Tesla could even be nice to road trippers and make the first 20 minutes of charging free if you are more than 100 miles from your billing address to align it with their more recent 'free long distance' wording.