Also, allow me to specify for those that missed it this thread was for the Top of the Line model NOT the base model. By that I meant the P85D version of the Model 3. If I get some time today I might add a thread for the base model but that does not really interest me personally. Either way I do NOT believe that even the base Model 3 will be like a Honda Civic or Camary or the likes. The base model of the Model 3 will compete directly with a BMW 328i or possibly the 320d a base Audi A4 and a base Mercedes C class.
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Model 3 Top of the Line guesses
- Thread starter Kevin Harney
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- Model 3
Isn't powered related to battery pack size as well? We will probably have a 100+kWh pack next year sometime in the Model S. The Model S will likely maintain a battery pack size advantage over the Model 3.
These comparisons with the 3 series are nice but nothing says Tesla has to exactly copy the BMW range in the 3 series.
Sure, there could be a Model 3 that outperforms the Model S because of weight but something only time will tell I guess. If Tesla decides to stick the D to the Model S that might tip the scales. My guess is the Model 3 will have a D version but likely with two smaller motors not one massive rear motor like the Model S with a smaller one up front.
We are all guessing at this point. Some in this thread seem like they talk with authority and an expertise that is difficult to justify without insider information.
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You quoted me are you referring to me too ? I think I was VERY clear in my original post that this was my speculation as to what I thought the high performance top of the line model 3 would be. You posts seem to be talking of a competitor to the Accord class vehicle. This is rediculous. Elon has publically stated SEVERAL times that Model 3 will compete with BMW 3 Series, Audi A4 and Mercedes C class. Will Tesla evenually make something to compete with the Camary ? Possibly yes but it will not be the Model 3. That is fairly definate at this point. Here in this tread we are specifically talking about the best performing Model 3 not the base model. Can you please clarify your position ? Thanks.
I don't doubt the Model 3 will spank everything in its price range in terms of performance. I'm just not sure we will see a 2.5 second version.
Of course it depends on what market Tesla wants to go after with the top version of the Model 3. It might be made with heavier and and cheaper materials than the Model S with all aluminum panels too so weight savings might not be as much as if construction were identical just 25% smaller in size.
Tesla could probably very easily build a 2.5 second version if they wanted to stretch the upper price range. I don't think it's unreasonable to speculate hey could do it. If they do it will be an amazing achievement regardless of which model gets there.
Of course it depends on what market Tesla wants to go after with the top version of the Model 3. It might be made with heavier and and cheaper materials than the Model S with all aluminum panels too so weight savings might not be as much as if construction were identical just 25% smaller in size.
Tesla could probably very easily build a 2.5 second version if they wanted to stretch the upper price range. I don't think it's unreasonable to speculate hey could do it. If they do it will be an amazing achievement regardless of which model gets there.
OK thanks. To be clear I do NOT think they will match the 3 series exactly. I believe that they will exceed it !! and by pretty far. Thus my predictions above. We are already seeing the big 7 passenger Model S blowing away Hellcats and Ferarris and the like that are more sport cars. Is this fair ? Lets see those cars carry 7 passengers and their luggage. So I believe that the Model 3 will blow the competition away. But those are the competition even if they are inferior. Tesla is creating a new paradigm.
Agree. It will crush the competition. I guess it comes down to if Tesla wants to artificially cap the performance to position the Model 3 under the price and performance of the Model S. Let's say the Model 3 only gets down to 3.1 seconds while the Model S has moved down to 2.8 seconds. That's still impressive. We shall see. Will be exciting to see what direction Tesla takes this and what they can do.
OK so a BMW M3 blows away a 760i what is the logic in not surpassing the flagship. A large passenger car has a different purpose than a small sports car and different buyers. Do I want a Model S or a 7 Series? No. Do I want a Model 3 or a M3. Yes. Tesla should appeal to the 320d to the M3 buyers and give them a better product to buy. Why does a HUGE 4 Door sedan have to perform better than a small sports car ?
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Seeing if I can add the pretty chart instead of the cruddy picture :biggrin:
| Top Trim Levels | Tesla Model 3 | BMW M3 | Audi S5 | Mercedes AMG C63 |
| Horsepower | 600 | 425 | 333 | 503 |
| 0-60 mph | 2.5 | 3.8 | 4.8 | 4.4 |
| Top Speed | 165 | 163 | 155 | 155 |
| Range | 450 | 416 | 416 | 323 |
| Width | 73" | 73" | 73" | 72" |
| Length | 185" | 184" | 182" | 187" |
| Wheel Base | 110" | 110" | 108" | 111" |
| Price | $60-80K USD | $62-87K USD | $48-64K USD | $63-84K USD |
Thanks to Commasign for the charting tips !!
Tesla does not have to follow any of the old rules, because they still make the cars to order. They do not have inventory sitting around on dealer lots. If the Model 3 bites into demand for the Model S, then they can just adjust the production rates.
Even if the Model 3 is not made to order, but the Model S&X are, they will have flexibility with that production.
Exactly. And the top of the line Model 3 will not be a low margin car, it will be expensive. So why not? Model S will then take it's place as an executive/family sports sedan, and the Model 3 will be the lower priced one, but also the smaller sportier one in the high end. People that want really sporty cars don't generally want large cars, and the market for a really sporty 4 door sedan is a lot larger than the sports car/roadster market.
Could the high end Model 3 go 0-60mph in 2.5 sure, but I suspect Tesla will defer that high end performance to the next generation roadster.
Probably for another thread but I'll ask anyway...
Has Tesla talked publicly about "hybrid chemistry" battery packs? For example, if the Model 3 had a 50 kWh battery but 10 kWh of it was a different chemistry that better supported "sprints" of high draw. Rebalancing (or whatever) between cells of the different chemistries might be challenging of course.
Has Tesla talked publicly about "hybrid chemistry" battery packs? For example, if the Model 3 had a 50 kWh battery but 10 kWh of it was a different chemistry that better supported "sprints" of high draw. Rebalancing (or whatever) between cells of the different chemistries might be challenging of course.
Red Sage
The Cybernetic Samurai
'NO COMPROMISES'
That slogan says it all. Tesla Motors will not cripple their cars for the sake of preserving the status of a particular vehicle within a market segment. With electric drive you are no it forced to give up performance for the sake of economy. That is a fundamental advantage that BEVs have over ICE and should never be relinquished.
The Tesla Motors corporate identity hinges upon performance. I don't see anyone advising Ferrari, Lamborghini, McLaren, or Koenigsegg to produce a low cost pretender that drives like a Camry. Be prepared to see a Model ≡ that is fundamentally better than any Tesla product that proceeds it.
That slogan says it all. Tesla Motors will not cripple their cars for the sake of preserving the status of a particular vehicle within a market segment. With electric drive you are no it forced to give up performance for the sake of economy. That is a fundamental advantage that BEVs have over ICE and should never be relinquished.
The Tesla Motors corporate identity hinges upon performance. I don't see anyone advising Ferrari, Lamborghini, McLaren, or Koenigsegg to produce a low cost pretender that drives like a Camry. Be prepared to see a Model ≡ that is fundamentally better than any Tesla product that proceeds it.
favo
P3D+ owner
Imagine how cool it will be to get the smallest tidbit of actual Model 3 information from Tesla?
It's gotta happen sooner or later.Yeah. Tesla has not shied away from releasing new hardware and software that surpasses older Model S's capabilities, and at a much faster rate than the traditional yearly cycle. (Agile development?) However, I could very well see them keeping top performance with the top Model S, but frankly, when you are talking 0-60mph below 3.1 seconds, it's all gravy and bragging rights. The Model 3 is also quite likely to handle better than Model S, due to lighter weight, if nothing else.
wallet.dat
Member
T≡SLA Model ≡? No such thing. It's going to be the T≡SLA Model 3, as has been officially stated previously.
Red Sage
The Cybernetic Samurai
I would be very surprised if in a world with a Mazda 3, AUDI A3, and both BMW 3-Series and M3 if the Tesla Motors Generation III vehicles sport a 'Model 3' badge instead of 'Model ≡' on the back.
How about until Tesla confirms this you simply go with what Tesla had physically said in their tweet that it will be called the Model 3? Your symbol isn't even on the iOS keyboard so I have to cut and paste from your posts anytime I want to write it. Ford has the Model T which is one letter removed from Model S but Tesla still used it. Don't think many people confuse the two.
