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FTFY
Look I get the holders of Tesla are "strong hands" motivated as much by ideology as business. Hats off to you guys, you are making the world a better place.
For me BMW are playing a far more cautious game with their shareholders money, and that is their prerogative.
Only time will tell who is right or wrong. But I for one am grateful for every BMW EV sold to date, each one has replaced an ICE.
I can't get beyond that bizarre design decision to make the dip in the rear seat side door/windows. Totally disrupts the flow of the lines of the car. The front, snub-nosed, looks squished from a side view and front view and the access to the rear seats is so narrow. If I don't like a glaring feature of a car, I just can't see owning it.
If I set out wanting to buy an EV, the fact the i3 is so battery range limited is another reason not to buy from a more practical standpoint. And when you need a full charge, due to it's charging structure, you'll looking at 4.5 hours. And no way if going EV do I want any kind of gasoline extender. Yes, I'm so spoiled now by our Model S; and in the i3's price range (starting at 44,500 and with range extender 47,650-51,500), the Model 3. They advertise a zippy 0-60 in 6.8-8 seconds.
If I set out wanting to buy an EV, the fact the i3 is so battery range limited is another reason not to buy from a more practical standpoint. And when you need a full charge, due to it's charging structure, you'll looking at 4.5 hours. And no way if going EV do I want any kind of gasoline extender. Yes, I'm so spoiled now by our Model S; and in the i3's price range (starting at 44,500 and with range extender 47,650-51,500), the Model 3. They advertise a zippy 0-60 in 6.8-8 seconds.
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I'm not threatened at all. I'm welcoming, eager for new electric cars that I want to drive. But I know what I like, and as much as I use to like pretty much every other BMW before converting to electric, the i3 ain't it. What a shame.
The i3 is an excellent city ev. I have a 2017 i3 all electric as a commuter vehicle for hov access. Its light weight, has great handling, interesting interior, and one of the funnest drives available on a car. Biggest shortfall of the car is the 120 mile range, but it's a solid commuter vehicle with quirky looks. Tesla's are more refined and bigger but also come with no discounts besides tax credits and no crazy lease specials like BMW can offer. I will spend only $4850 total out of pocket including registration, taxes and all for a 30 month lease with 12k miles per year. I think it's a pretty incredible value at the payments I am making for a 51k msrp car.
FTFY
Look I get the holders of Tesla are "strong hands" motivated as much by ideology as business. Hats off to you guys, you are making the world a better place.
For me BMW are playing a far more cautious game with their shareholders money, and that is their prerogative.
Only time will tell who is right or wrong. But I for one am grateful for every BMW EV sold to date, each one has replaced an ICE.
The stock market disagrees with your assessment of things, but I'm speaking as a consumer wanting to buy a car. Tesla makes a car I want to buy, BMW doesn't. Giving BMW more profit by buying their little city car is not something I'm interested in. So they won't be making another single dollar off of me until they make something interesting. And this is from somebody who has mostly owned German cars their entire life.
@gregincal While the stock market may currently be in love with TSLA, I simply can't bring myself to buy a product from a firm where the brother of the CEO has drawn more out in share vesting than the total revenue ever generated in sales from the country where I live.
If Elon sacks Kimbal from the board, esp. in the light of the Rives and SCTY, then maybe just maybe I would think it truly is for the good of the planet....
At least the German manufacturers are more subtle in how they keep it in the family (Quandt, Piech Porsche et al, )
If Elon sacks Kimbal from the board, esp. in the light of the Rives and SCTY, then maybe just maybe I would think it truly is for the good of the planet....
At least the German manufacturers are more subtle in how they keep it in the family
(Quandt, Piech Porsche et al, )@turtlesz I think you've hit the nail on the head. It's nothing to do with headline MSRP. It's out of pocket expense over the term you own the car.
It all adds up, The i3 is a much cheaper car in that respect.
If anything it will get even cheaper now the Model 3 is out. At least in this way Tesla are being true to their mission statement of bringing sustainable transport to the masses
It all adds up, The i3 is a much cheaper car in that respect.
If anything it will get even cheaper now the Model 3 is out. At least in this way Tesla are being true to their mission statement of bringing sustainable transport to the masses
Too much is made of the servicing IMHO.
A Model S costs between £500 and £700 a service here in the UK, and is required every 12,000 miles.
Even with an ICE. the i8 schedule is 20,000 miles with no oil changes (using extended life oils as per the manufacturers requirements), each visit is <£300.
I think part of the problem is people in America have been convinced they need to change their oil almost as frequently as they refill the gas tank
Maybe that was true with old push-rod engines and mineral oil. Here in Europe 24k mile / two year services are commonplace. Just top up the oil as required.
(I'm sure this is making some people wince, but it's been going on here for 10+ years and it's not like all our cars are self-detonating due to lack of oil changes!)
Its got a piddly range which makes it a city car for a small city, or town. Looks fugly. BMW makes them in small numbers and has been recalled many times. Priced insanely - laughably - high. Costs more than Tesla M3 but only has half the range as M3.
But other than that it is an amazing car.
AustinPowers
Total Smeghead
Too much is made of the servicing IMHO.
A Model S costs between £500 and £700 a service here in the UK, and is required every 12,000 miles.
Even with an ICE. the i8 schedule is 20,000 miles with no oil changes (using extended life oils as per the manufacturers requirements), each visit is <£300.
I think part of the problem is people in America have been convinced they need to change their oil almost as frequently as they refill the gas tank
Here in Europe 24k mile / two year services are commonplace. Just top up the oil as required.
(I'm sure this is making some people wince, but it's been going on here for 10+ years and it's not like all our cars are self-detonating due to lack of oil changes!)
+1000
I am repeatedly totally gobsmacked by all those comments from US members about their frequent oil changes (and their consequently exorbitant servicing costs versus what we in Europe pay). Almost like a mania there. They seem to want to bathe their cars in oil one might think. No wonder that, when in the US, you see oil patches at almost every stoplight or most spots in any car park you go to. Boggled my mind when I first saw that. Over here you'd have the fire department around with chemical binder stuff, putting up signs "danger, oil spill". But that's good ole eco-crazy Germany I guess.
AustinPowers
Total Smeghead
Your "Total Smeghead" is so, so wrong
OT: true, doesn't fit the Austin Powers alter ego, but I'm a huge Red Dwarf fan as well. And contrary to Lister I really like Rimmer. I'm kind of sympathetic to likeable loser characters. I like Donald Duck and Howard Wolowitz too, you know...
There is at least a Red Dwarf to EV connection in the form of Kryten, aka Bobby "Fully Charged" Llewellyn.
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@AustinPowers I blame all the TV adverts for drive-through oil places on American TV.
Fortunately we don't have drive through oil places here, to rip us off for $200 wiper blade replacements on top of our $50 oil changes.
Fortunately we don't have drive through oil places here, to rip us off for $200 wiper blade replacements on top of our $50 oil changes.
AustinPowers
Total Smeghead
Who is a thoroughly nice bloke in real life btw
Even though I have been to England so many times, I have not had the chance to meet him yet unfortunately. Would love to though, not just because of his Red Dwarf fame, but because it seems like he would be a joy to chat with, especially about all things renewable.
@turtlesz I love the M3 and have a second day reservation, which sadly means I won't get the car until like 2019 (I'm in Canada). In the meantime (24-36 month lease), I am looking at leasing an i3s. I know lots might say I should go for a Bolt, but I need to keep the Admiral happy, and she prefers the BMW. Also, for our use case (urban), the i3 makes range sense. With that in mind, could you provide any more detail on your lease (duration, equipment spec etc)? I appreciate you may be dealing in US dollars, but I'm trying to get any kind of comparator before negotiating a lease package next weekend with our dealer here in Canada. Sorry for the thread drift...
EV-lutioin
Active Member
The i3 definitely the best EV bicycle out there... love those tires!
Its not our fault the car manufacturers are in cahoots with the oil companies. As you said, the same cars that "require" 5000 mile oil changes in the US are 7500 miles or more in other countries. The manufacturers require it to maintain your warranty, so what are we to do?
Brando
Active Member
BEST most HONEST review of the Ultimate Driving Machine's EV.
Seriously some BMW managers should read (if only to confirm that they succeeded in not cannibalizing Series 3 sales.)
A Year With The BMW i3 Has Left Me Baffled — So Close To Perfection
Seriously some BMW managers should read (if only to confirm that they succeeded in not cannibalizing Series 3 sales.)
A Year With The BMW i3 Has Left Me Baffled — So Close To Perfection
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