TMC is an independent, primarily volunteer organization that relies on ad revenue to cover its operating costs. Please consider whitelisting TMC on your ad blocker or making a Paypal contribution here: paypal.me/SupportTMC

Model 3 Wish List

Discussion in 'Model 3' started by ratsbew, Jun 21, 2014.

  1. ratsbew

    ratsbew Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2012
    Messages:
    371
    What is your wishlist for an idealized Gen 3 Tesla? Here is what I'm thinking.

    - $35,000 base price
    - Loaded performance version for $65,000
    - 200 mile base range
    - 300+ mile EPA large battery option
    - Supercharger capable
    - Performance version in sub 4s 0-60 range
    - Same motor as Model S to reduce unique parts
    - Same battery platform, perhaps 100kW option with improved 18650 cells
    - Solar roof option for ventilation/reduced parasite battery drain
    - LED headlight

    That just about covers a car that would suit me.
     
  2. Raffy.Roma

    Raffy.Roma Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2012
    Messages:
    3,209
    Location:
    Rome (Italy)
    @ratsbew

    I would add:

    - ACC
    - AWD available as option
    - Blind spot detection system
    - Pedestrian and obstacle detection system
     
  3. yobigd20

    yobigd20 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2012
    Messages:
    5,793
    Location:
    Skaneateles, NY
    The thing is that Elon said Gen III would not have all the features that the Model S has. It's going to be a smaller and lesser featured version of the S. I wouldn't expect any of the above. If you want all the high tech cool stuff you'll need to get the S (assuming of course they have completed those features for the S by then). These were words right out of Elon's mouth at one of his talks. They need to keep the costs down so it's not going to have all the cool high-techie stuff the S has.
     
  4. Raffy.Roma

    Raffy.Roma Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2012
    Messages:
    3,209
    Location:
    Rome (Italy)
    Agree. But maybe a Super AWD P++ Gen 3 could be available?

    Then IMO at least the safety features should be available on all Tesla Models.
     
  5. ratsbew

    ratsbew Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2012
    Messages:
    371
    I don't think that anything I mentioned is too outlandish. I doubt the 3 will be an econobox.
     
  6. roblab

    roblab Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2008
    Messages:
    2,020
    Location:
    Angwin (Napa Valley) CA
    What's with AWD?? This is not an off road car. And there are many videos showing that the 2WD Model S and Roadster are more than capable in the snow. AWD is a mental game. All of a sudden you think you can go faster, do corners better, drive crazy, go where you should not be, and then you're in trouble. I have seen 3 Jeeps upside down on curves this last year. I suspect there were deaths. AWD does not make the car safer. I have driven for over 50 years, on back roads, gravel, unpaved, in show and ice in the midwest. NEVER was in a place where I couldn't go.

    It's a waste of money. I hope it is never available on the Gen 3. But of course, what do I know? Most cars with 4WD and AWD never get off the pavement. Or maybe they are able to drive onto the soccer field to let the kiddies out, as if you couldn't do that with the S.

    I take small exception to the idea that we need all these gadgets to drive our cars, watch out for people and obstacles, or control cruise so we can doze off and not have to drive the car. If people didn't weave in and out of traffic, they wouldn't be cutting people off. If they would look at the rear camera picture, maybe they wouldn't hit those pedestrians, or if they would slow down in the parking lot or at intersections, maybe might not cream the kids in the crosswalks. It's called awareness. There is precious little of that.

    Nothing against YOU, raffy. Just that so many want another way to cop out. "My blind spot monitor didn't warn me in time!" "There was water on my back up lens!" Driving requires us to be involved.
     
  7. Raffy.Roma

    Raffy.Roma Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2012
    Messages:
    3,209
    Location:
    Rome (Italy)
    @roblab

    I understand your view. In fact I wrote AWD available as option. Not compulsory. Then people will be free to get it or not.
    I am a lover of safety features and IMO AWD is useful for safety reasons. I see that you also disagree on the other safety features that I would like. Also the obstacles and pedestrian detection system could be options. That very much depends upon the driver's will. I have seen some accidents where the driver couldn't do anything to avoid them and where only an automated system could have done something.
    My opinion is that Tesla should guarantee maximum rating of safety depending upon the driver's will. Then it's up to you to choose such safety features or not.
    Unless the law makes such safety features compulsory. For instance in Europe ACC with complete stop will be compulsory in 2015.
     
  8. Hodginator

    Hodginator Member

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2013
    Messages:
    245
    Location:
    Virginia
    I have to say it..

    pockets
    usable cup holders for all passengers

    With that being, I now really enjoy the large area between the front seats. Hope that stays.
     
  9. AudubonB

    AudubonB Mild-mannered Moderator Lord Vetinari*

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2013
    Messages:
    4,219
    Location:
    Denali Highway, Alaska
    We would very much like to believe that we could justify keeping a Tesla in Europe for our travels there. Another Model S would be very nice....except that in our opinion it really is too big a vehicle for two reasons: (1), just the two of us - no family in tow; and (2) a very large number of Europe's city streets are far friendlier to navigate with a vehicle significantly smaller than the Model S.

    So....our desiderata include:
    1. a price as near as possible as what TMC has been touting for some years now - around $35K
    2. a significantly smaller footprint, as above
    3. a range in the 300km region - that should jibe well enough with Tesla's European SpC network to suffice
    4. handling that is reminiscent of what the Model S affords. Not looking for identical - this is a vehicle with a price point 40% of the S. It shouldn't be the same!
    5. looks that are more reminiscent of a Lotus or Alfa Romeo than a Trabant or, say, Dad's 1950 Austin A40..... :scared:
     
  10. igotzzoom

    igotzzoom Member

    Joined:
    May 26, 2013
    Messages:
    838
    Location:
    Laguna Hills, CA
    This is my wish list for Gen III:

    - Base price at or under $40,000
    - Length of 185 in or less
    - 200 mile base range
    - 300+ mile EPA large battery option
    - Supercharger capable
    - 0-60 6 flat or less
    - 5-door (hatchback) configuration, like Model S
    - LED headlights

    A high-performance version that's like 4 second 0-60 is fine, but 6 flat would be plenty quick for me, and I think most target buyers in the $40-45k price range. Common motor with Model S is an interesting possibility. As it is, it's very compact, and could be software-tuned for different performance levels.
     
  11. yobigd20

    yobigd20 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2012
    Messages:
    5,793
    Location:
    Skaneateles, NY
    You're basically just asking them to knock $40k off the Model S.
     
  12. physicsfita

    physicsfita Member

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2014
    Messages:
    424
    Location:
    Ann Arbor, MI
    #12 physicsfita, Jun 21, 2014
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2014
    Door pockets
    Cup holders for all seats
    Overhead door handles
    Sunglass hutch over mirror
    GPS
    Satellite radio
    iPhone integration
    Backup camera
    Seat and mirror heaters
    Bluetooth
    At least 200 mi range, with option to get closer to 300
    Option for 20 kW charging
    Auto dimming rear view mirror
     
  13. MarkR

    MarkR Member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2012
    Messages:
    893
    Location:
    N. Scottsdale, AZ
    Agree with most of Audie's points. I'd hope for a smaller car, perhaps only four passengers, maybe just two doors plus a hatchback. Eliminating two doors may limit the cost. The MS is already plenty fast, but I'm sure that a performance option will be available. Also agree that having many parts in common should reduce production costs. Gen 3 has got to have killer styling! Nobody on these forums will be wiling to drive a boring car. At the point that Gen 3 arrives in 2017-18, it will need to be upgradable (at some point) to self-driving.
     
  14. ratsbew

    ratsbew Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2012
    Messages:
    371
    I predict 10,000 reservations in 24 hours after its unveiling.
     
  15. igotzzoom

    igotzzoom Member

    Joined:
    May 26, 2013
    Messages:
    838
    Location:
    Laguna Hills, CA
    Your point being? When Toyota Corollas have LED headlights, I don't think it's much of a stretch that it will become a commoditized item by 2018. It would seem to me that it would be in Tesla's interest to expand the reach and capability of the Supercharger network, especially now that it's willing to share its patents with other automakers. Yes, I would be fine with a slightly smaller, slightly lower-performance (but still high-performance by mass-market standards) version of the Model S. Musk himself has said he wants to bring prices down overall. I think once the Gigafactory goes online in full-swing, the prices for the packs will decrease radically. Although the Model S is still not a super-niche product in the vein of the Bugatti Veyron, by mass-market standards, it's still a relatively low-volume vehicle. When volumes start getting to 100,000+ units annually, prices per unit will drop significantly.

    - - - Updated - - -

    I respectfully disagree. Two-doors don't sell well at all. The only exceptions are the musclecars (i.e. Camaro, Mustang, etc.) and the Jeep Wrangler (most of which are now four-doors now anyway). I wouldn't rule out a coupe variant of the Gen-III, but a mass-market model needs to have four doors, period.
     
  16. ecarfan

    ecarfan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2013
    Messages:
    10,319
    Location:
    San Mateo, CA
    Yes Elon has said that, but I believe he meant that the BASE VERSION of the Gen III would not have some of the features of the base Model S. To make that happen it seems possible that by the time Gen III comes out the S will come standard with currently optional features like the Tech Package, Parking Sensors, Fog Lamps, etc., without a price increase.

    I am confident that the Gen III will have a lot of options that will take its price up to the price of the base S 60. Of course a fully loaded S 85 will still be several tens of thousands of dollars above a fully loaded Gen III.

    So I think it likely that it will be possible to get a high performance version of the Gen III as well as all the fancy self driving features that some people find so important (I do not). I do not feel it is necessary for Tesla to offer an AWD option for the Gen III.

    Since the Gen III is meant to compete with the BMW 3 series it needs to offer comparable options to a loaded 3 series.

    The Gen III will initially only be available as a 5 passenger hatchback sedan, as that is the most popular and versatile vehicle globally.
     
  17. AudubonB

    AudubonB Mild-mannered Moderator Lord Vetinari*

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2013
    Messages:
    4,219
    Location:
    Denali Highway, Alaska
    I will agree that it is difficult to consider a vehicle world-class if it does not sell well in the US, but I think it also is very important to understand that the (1) Asian market is significantly larger than the US's; the (2) European market is of similar size to the US's; and the ROW (mostly LatAm + Africa) is of significant size. NONE of those markets share the sentiment you enumerated.

    Irrespective of the above, consider the following: what if the Gen III did incorporate just two doors....but they were the by-that-time the proven Model X falcon wing doors? It seems to me that, if TMC can bring those doors' construction costs down, each could have his desired door access, design and features.
     
  18. ecarfan

    ecarfan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2013
    Messages:
    10,319
    Location:
    San Mateo, CA
    Interesting idea, Falcon doors on the Gen III could be long enough for one door to allow front and rear seat access? (Though ere would likely be structural issue with that approach, not enough body stiffness) But I doubt the cost could be reduced enough to make it happen.
     
  19. gg_got_a_tesla

    gg_got_a_tesla Model S: VIN P65513, Model 3 Res Holder

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2010
    Messages:
    6,097
    Location:
    Redwood Shores, CA
    A different name is all I ask for. Something cool (like the recently announced HD "LiveWire"); no more of this Model this and Model that business. Probably not going to happen.

    The rest - that I care about - is going to happen anyway:

    - 5 doors including the lift gate (like the MS, only smaller)

    - 5 seats (4's a "dealbreaker" for a lot of folks including me)

    - Base range of atleast 180 miles (roughly the 90% range on the MS 60; I know it works very well for me even for today's SC hops)

    - Supercharging (paid option)

    - Killer acceleration
     
  20. igotzzoom

    igotzzoom Member

    Joined:
    May 26, 2013
    Messages:
    838
    Location:
    Laguna Hills, CA
    I challenge you to find any contemporary market where two-doors outsell four-doors by any considerable margin. In fact, most emerging markets are asking for larger rear seat areas, with the Chinese market especially coming to mind. Even ultra-economy minded models (such as the Tata Nano) are four-door. I would not object to Falcon Wing doors on the Gen-III, but I don't think they would be cost-effective. Perhaps the crossover variant. There's no reason there couldn't be a whole family of Gen-III models, including a coupe, touring sedan (5-door) and crossover, but I can tell you from a volume standpoint, the sedan and crossovers will be the biggest sellers globally.
     

Share This Page