Model S 75D Range Anxiety

[RAW84]

Do you live in one of these wonderful Northern states? If yes, what type of range do you get on your 85D and what does Tesla/EPA says it should be? Just curious. Thanks

Massachusetts here. I have a P85D, not an 85D, which would have better range than my car. I don't recall what the EPA range of my car is; since I rarely charge to 100%, that's not my basis of comparison. I prefer to compare rated mile range on the dash versus the mileage I get before having to charge again. I've found that if I get about 308 Wh/mi, my actual range will equal the rated range on the dash and on a non-winter day without inclement weather I can usually get 300-350 Wh/mi. Just from the temperature drop, that can catapult me over 400 Wh/mi. Add in a snow storm and I'm over 500 Wh/mi even into the 600s. This is probably more qualitative than you'd like, but once you get the car you'll start to appreciate all of the caveats that go into answering questions like these (we haven't even started talking about vampire drain!)

I don't do many long trips, but one good data point for you would be a Bos-NYC trip I did last summer. Charged to nearly 100%, 240 rated miles and drove continuously (no vampire drain) for 177.2 miles to a supercharger arriving with 4%, 12 rated miles. For the trip I averaged 380 Wh/mi. It was December so it was cold, but I don't think it was below freezing and there was no snow or rain. This was driving, on average, 10 miles over the speed limit for most of the trip...that's what I consider "normal" highway driving lol.

On the way back, I charged to 97%, 237 rated miles at a different super charger and traveled 148 miles home where I arrived with 6%, 17 rated miles averaging 430 Wh/mi. Weather was colder, but still no storm, and because I felt confident I'd make it, I drove faster.

 

[Magus]

As said, if you can afford it go for the bigger battery pack. That being said even in single to 20 degree weather I still get low 300, like 320-330. With snow it pretty much stays at that range- yourself and traffic are driving slower. I only ever saw 360 if I'm cold soaked in subzero weather. 360 was temporary and decreased with driving further. In year 2 of my 70D I am getting better than EPA going at or 5 mph above speed limit. The only reason at this point to get a bigger battery pack would be to upgrade the features (bioweapon, full self driving). Otherwise I am happy with my 70D and would not upgrade just for increased range.

 

[No2DinosaurFuel]

I understand most people here is recommending the 90D. But I think the 160 miles is totally doable in a 75D assuming you don't get lost or detour and you will plug in while you are visiting. Keep in mind the 75D is a lighter car compared to the 90D or the p85D or what not. It is also more efficient compared to other tesla people are quoting here. Again I highly recommend you look at evtripplanner.com. Their numbers are conservative too. But it is much closer than what you can estimate using tesla's calculator.

Just use the 90D as your car and see how much energy you use for your trip and make your decision. change it to 70D and do the comparison. You can safely assume the 75D has 70KWh and the 90D has 83KWh usable. I can't see you using more than 468wh/mile unless you are in a blizzard going 75mph.

Edit: I just went to evtripplanner and created a random trip 175 miles and in similar conditions you mentioned. It used 71KWh. Remember their numbers are a tad bit conservative too. So like I said if you got 160 miles to go you should be fine if you don't detour and what not. If so just go slower and you will be good to go. Finally if you are in a pinch, there are probably public charging stations. Again the only real problem is when your car gets older. You might have to go slower then. As with every recommendation I am also assuming you are not climbing some mountain to get to your destination. That can really drain your battery. But on the bright side when you come down the mountain you will need less charge to make the same trip.

 

[Tribaltech]

Massachusetts here. I have a P85D, not an 85D, which would have better range than my car. I don't recall what the EPA range of my car is; since I rarely charge to 100%, that's not my basis of comparison. I prefer to compare rated mile range on the dash versus the mileage I get before having to charge again. I've found that if I get about 308 Wh/mi, my actual range will equal the rated range on the dash and on a non-winter day without inclement weather I can usually get 300-350 Wh/mi. Just from the temperature drop, that can catapult me over 400 Wh/mi. Add in a snow storm and I'm over 500 Wh/mi even into the 600s. This is probably more qualitative than you'd like, but once you get the car you'll start to appreciate all of the caveats that go into answering questions like these (we haven't even started talking about vampire drain!)

I don't do many long trips, but one good data point for you would be a Bos-NYC trip I did last summer. Charged to nearly 100%, 240 rated miles and drove continuously (no vampire drain) for 177.2 miles to a supercharger arriving with 4%, 12 rated miles. For the trip I averaged 380 Wh/mi. It was December so it was cold, but I don't think it was below freezing and there was no snow or rain. This was driving, on average, 10 miles over the speed limit for most of the trip...that's what I consider "normal" highway driving lol.

On the way back, I charged to 97%, 237 rated miles at a different super charger and traveled 148 miles home where I arrived with 6%, 17 rated miles averaging 430 Wh/mi. Weather was colder, but still no storm, and because I felt confident I'd make it, I drove faster.

Jeesh 500 to 600 wh/mi? Wow!!! OK thats a reality check. And like you, I too consider 10 mph above speed limit as the "actual" drivable speed lol! So yeah the writing on the wall's pretty clear that with the 75D I'd be cutting it too close. I don't want to be in constant hypermiling mode and the average speed limit here is 70mph so people flying at 80+ is very normal. So I don't want to be that person who is on the right lane driving at speed limit.

Yes its seeming more and more clear that 90D is the only way to go for me. One does start to appreciate gasoline during such discussions but god knows it how badly I want to break away from being a gas user and just go EV. This was very helpful. Thanks

 

[jgillispie]

Most of the Midwest interstate traffic runs about 75-78mph with a speed limit of 70 from my experience. In winter that might slow down 5-10mph with cleared roads. The peace of mind and less hassle is probably worth price difference between the 75 and 90.

 

[Archer]

Not all extensions are the same so in order to take full advantage of a dryer outlet, I would recommend buying one from EVSE adapters.

Adapters for Tesla

I got their heavy duty extension cable and used it in Yosemite earlier this year. They are heavy and bulky but great as a backup when in a pinch.

 

[Footer]

Jeesh 500 to 600 wh/mi? Wow!!! OK thats a reality check. And like you, I too consider 10 mph above speed limit as the "actual" drivable speed lol! So yeah the writing on the wall's pretty clear that with the 75D I'd be cutting it too close. I don't want to be in constant hypermiling mode and the average speed limit here is 70mph so people flying at 80+ is very normal. So I don't want to be that person who is on the right lane driving at speed limit.

Yes its seeming more and more clear that 90D is the only way to go for me. One does start to appreciate gasoline during such discussions but god knows it how badly I want to break away from being a gas user and just go EV. This was very helpful. Thanks

I don't recall much worse than 450 Wh/mi on the highway with the heat on and 70 mph in an S85. Since your trip is only 80 miles each way you will be able to find 110V somewhere to charge your car. Just don't leave your family's home until you have enough charge. Stay there 5 hours and you'll get another 19 miles. And you can always drive the speed limit if necessary. 65 mph really does make a huge difference compared to 75 mph. Seems a shame to spend $10,000 if you don't need to. Only you can decide the value of $10,000.

 

[liuj2001]

I have been driving 75D for two months now, my daily commute is 80 miles roundtrip, about 80% highway, and involve up and down hills. I don't really look at speed while driving, would go over 80 mph when traffic is clear. My last 1000 mile is 279Wh/mi, so I think the EPA range is pretty much on spot. Well, given 50-60 degree temperature in California, it may be ideal for the battery. IMHO, $10,000 is too much for an occasional 160 mile trip. If you are too concerned about couple of those trips in winter, renting an ICE car makes more economical sense.

 

[jeffb]

You didn't mention how long you would be staying when you go on these trips but if you are staying overnight the 110v plug in will be plenty to get you the cushion you need to avoid anxiety, yeah its slow, but it adds up if you are staying long enough!

If you go the dryer plug route you should be able to get enough cushion to be comfortable in a couple hours, even in the worst conditions.

 

[hacer]

90D is the way to go to future proof yourself.

Look at the calculator I linked from Tesla's site. A 75D, in 0F weather, going 70mph, with cabin heat on, can go 194miles. Expect a 5% hit in the first couple years from that 259 EPA number, so you can take 194 miles - 5%*259 rated miles = 181miles.

With a 75D you'd have a 21 mile buffer, at most, in your winter driving on the trip with no superchargers. Now add 5mph to your speed to go 75mph. Or imagine a 10mph headwind.

But since this is a ROUND-TRIP distance, plug in to a 110V outlet while at the relatives. Let's say you're only there for 4 hours before you return. That should get you another 15 miles to your 21 mile buffer, or 37 miles of range for "just in case". Stay longer and you have even more buffer. For future proofing, in the future there will be superchargers on that path.

I'd say save the money you'll be fine.

 

[Wuggado?]

Jeesh 500 to 600 wh/mi? Wow!!! OK thats a reality check. And like you, I too consider 10 mph above speed limit as the "actual" drivable speed lol! So yeah the writing on the wall's pretty clear that with the 75D I'd be cutting it too close. I don't want to be in constant hypermiling mode and the average speed limit here is 70mph so people flying at 80+ is very normal. So I don't want to be that person who is on the right lane driving at speed limit.

Yes its seeming more and more clear that 90D is the only way to go for me. One does start to appreciate gasoline during such discussions but god knows it how badly I want to break away from being a gas user and just go EV. This was very helpful. Thanks

Tribaltech,
When I first started looking at Tesla, I was thinking 70D, but for many of the same reasons as listed previously by others I decided to maximize the battery pack to minimize range anxiety, and maximize travel flexibility. Now that you've seen the light on the 90D, let me further confuse things for you. I'm in the camp that believes a 100D is not that far away. There is part of me that is hoping one gets announced before the end of the year so I could make the jump to AP 2.0, as well as bump the battery pack up at the same time. Yes, it would be costly given that my car is only 5 months old, but it's something I do have my eye on. The end of the year is the cutoff in my mind because of the reduction in free Supercharger privileges that comes along with the new year.

I guess what I'm saying is, if you can stand to wait a few weeks, it might be worth that wait to see what comes along.

Also, if you plan on having this car for a while, you may want to expand your thinking beyond today's situation. While 160 miles round trip may be your current longest without a Supercharger (that also assumes no additional driving around while on the trip (groceries, etc.), who knows what your situation might be 5-10 years down the road.

 

[No2DinosaurFuel]

Now that I read your post more carefully, If it's 160 miles round trip, definitely go with the 75D and do the following:

1) Preheat/cool the car depending on the condition before leaving on the 160 miles round trip.

2) Charge to as close as 100% as possible

3) Get the 19 inch rims version for the 75D

4) Get the Weather package if you think it will help with keeping everyone warm in cold weather

5) Carry an extension cord (Either the 14-50 extension cord or a regular 5-15 extension cord from home depot).

6) plug in over night and you will be fine.

I say your 75D can make it through blizzard condition going 75mph if you are only going for 80 miles. Not that you should for safety issues. If you can't make it I'm not sure the 90D would help either. Most likely it is because the road is snowed out. I would even say a 60D would work if you have a 14-50 dryer plug where you are visiting.

 

[NOLA_Mike]

My wife's argument is that getting a rental everytime to go there is still going to be cheaper than paying the extra monthly premium. While that is good in theory but if we have to do it each and every time it would really start to get old very quickly.

In addition to everything else everybody else has already said, once you spend about a week driving the Tesla you are going to be pissed that you have to drive a "rental" (ICE) on your trip and can't take the Tesla.

The Rated Range is achieved on flat terrain, in mild temperatures with no wind, rain or snow at 65 MPH or less. In winter conditions (cold with head or cross winds) driving the speed limit (75 MPH) I allow for about 35-40 extra Rated Miles for every 100 actual miles I need to drive.

Mike

 

[brkaus]

Oops. Yes, if this is round trip with a known destination In the middle. Just spend some money on a 14-50 at the relatives.

RV outdoor 14-50 (includes outlet and waterproof box) - $30

50a breaker - $10

Flex conduit, fittings - $10

#6 wire $15

Electrician - $150 (or so)

Of course, assuming circuit box is outside somewhere.


Given occasional use, it doesn't have to be in the best place, just somewhat accessible and lowest cost.

Can add 30 miles in an hour.

Plus, they will be ready for the future!

Now, if you want the extra range and a bit more performance and money isn't a big concern. Get the 90. The one "I told you so" AVOIDED from the significant other will be well worth the investment! Still, invest in an outlet at their location. You will need it to take everyone there on rides.

 

[Drone Flyer]

Keep in mind the 75D, being a newer battery technology, has a better range than the old 85 kw batteries.
Those batteries were really only 81 kw anyway.
You can go further with a 75D now than with an older 85. Not much further but it is nice to know you do have the equivalent range.
The 75D is the new (old) 85!
You'll do fine on o 75D on a trip you used to take an older 85 on!

 

[whitex]

OP, if the family trip is all that worries you, and you'd rather save money - have you considered saving $18,500 and go with S60D, then spend $200 to install a dryer plug at the family garage? It would give you an added benefit of being able to drive around while visiting family, and if you ever wanted to can upgrade to 75KWh. 60D you can charge to 100% all the time, so for daily driving it's pretty close to 75D. Just a thought.

 

[jelloslug]

I have a 60D and have no issues exceeding the EPA ratings on highway trips. This is with me driving at normal highway speeds with the AC on also.

 

[jchag]

Have a 60D here in California. When I bought it I thought I may need to upgrade to 75. After 3 months of driving Tesla can keep the $9000 upgrade. Now our temperatures are better, but you can always slow down a little to save battery.
My vote is the 75D. Save the money and superchargers are always being added.

 

[Hugh Mannity]

I think someone mentioned it above, there are likely some L2 chargers on your route? Stop for lunch or dinner and plug in you'll get a good top up to do your journey.

Oh I have a 75D and it's estimated range is 410 km, that is 250ish in miles I think.

 

[ev-now]

OP, if the family trip is all that worries you, and you'd rather save money - have you considered saving $18,500 and go with S60D, then spend $200 to install a dryer plug at the family garage? It would give you an added benefit of being able to drive around while visiting family, and if you ever wanted to can upgrade to 75KWh. 60D you can charge to 100% all the time, so for daily driving it's pretty close to 75D. Just a thought.

Was catching up on this thread and amazed nobody had mentioned this until now. Whatever battery you go with, you will surely need to drive around while at the destination.

Given that, 240 charging makes sense, and then my friend the excuse to buy the faster vehicle starts to dissolve pretty quickly. But hey, you can show your wife the many "must get 90" replies!