Model S 75D Range Anxiety

[MSDadMich]

I just took a trip to Texas... when they say everything is bigger in Texas that applies to the distance between charges too! Get plugshare for sure if you are going off the supercharger network like I was (took a trip to big bend national park). You will need to charge on a level 2 for sure so have a NEMA 14-50 handy and a 110 cord just in case.
FYI, in the summer the range will not be an issue. In the winter, especially this winter when it was below freezing for a long time, charging stops will be a must on any trip.
Personally I don't think a 75D would be any problem in Texas unless you plan to go off the supercharger network. Then, some destinations will be off limits if it's cold outside. IMHO, A 100D buys a lot of security down there.

 

[RogerHScott]

The return trip on Monday was terrible as I pulled into the Falls Creek (Dubois) Superchargers and NONE OF THEM WORKED. Luckily, I got one charger to trickle charge 50 miles in one hour and I left for Bellefonte where again I could not charge in the same slot where I was successful on Friday on my trip out. I moved 2 slots over and luckily was able to get a full charge to make it home. So I called Tesla support who claimed I had a cold battery at Falls Creek but I argue that I had no issues in Hermitage or Bellefonte on the way back. But my concern is what do you do if all the slots don’t charge and you don’t have enough to ak every it to the next charger. I was lucky but may not be so the next time. Also allow at least a 30 percent cushion for cold weather. Not happy as my wife bit off all her nails during this trip.

This is rather similar to a disgruntled thread I plan to post as soon as my little Odyssey is complete. Short version: I was at the SpC in Champagne, IL, it was 5F, and couldn't get more than 10kW/h charge from any of a number of stalls I tried. Called Tesla support, they said the problem was that the chargers themselves (they showed an internal temp of -11C) and I just needed to be patient while they warmed up. I waited, the charge rate dropped. Called again, after much futzing around they concluded the problem was my battery was not heating itself (failure of the cooling pump, which apparently is also used for heating). The fun just continued from there...

You may have been encountering cold chargers; how long did you give them to warm up before either switching to a different stall (which just starts the process over again on the new charger) or giving up?

 

[RogerHScott]

Winter happens every year.

These are our words: Winter is coming

 

[evo2turbo]

Here is my experience from this past weekend.

This past Friday 1/12/18 my wife and I embarked on a weekend trip from Bethlehem, Pa to Cleveland Oh. We started off fully charged with 260 miles and arrived at the Bellefonte charger in State College with 40 miles left on the clock. This is actually 171 road miles. So we were a little concerned that we used so much more for heat etc. We charged it up to 210 miles and took off west on I-80. The next charger we pulled into was in Hermitage Pa 161 miles away but we only had 9 miles left on the car. While there was freezing rain and heavy snow we charged till we had over 200 miles on the clock for our last leg into Cleveland which is 100 miles away. Tha car - a Model S75D handled beautifully in the nasty snow and ice. We arrived with 50 miles on the clock. We stayed for the weekend and charged at the Macedonia supercharger which was unplowed and pretty much full at one point. I have never seen more than 2 other cars in the 3 months I have been supercharging, however that area of Oh is bare of super chargers.
The return trip on Monday was terrible as I pulled into the Falls Creek (Dubois) Superchargers and NONE OF THEM WORKED. Luckily, I got one charger to trickle charge 50 miles in one hour and I left for Bellefonte where again I could not charge in the same slot where I was successful on Friday on my trip out. I moved 2 slots over and luckily was able to get a full charge to make it home. So I called Tesla support who claimed I had a cold battery at Falls Creek but I argue that I had no issues in Hermitage or Bellefonte on the way back. But my concern is what do you do if all the slots don’t charge and you don’t have enough to ak every it to the next charger. I was lucky but may not be so the next time. Also allow at least a 30 percent cushion for cold weather. Not happy as my wife bit off all her nails during this trip.

I live south of Cleveland and my in-laws are from Allentown, so I know I-80 quite well. I drove my P85D out last January and had to go the turnpike because there were no chargers on I-80 at that point. I much prefer I-80, but haven't made the trip in the Tesla since the chargers were finished.

I recommend checking supercharger status on PlugShare before a trip. You'll usually see if there are issues with a charger and be able to make a plan B before you get there. I just charged in Macedonia on Monday and all of the A chargers were offline according to comments on Plugshare. So I charged at 1B with no issues.

In the winter time, you have to add at least 30-40% over normal summer consumption, especially with the frigid temps we've had lately.

Good luck, maybe I'll run into you at the Allentown charger sometime.

 

[jgillispie]

Here is my experience from this past weekend.

The return trip on Monday was terrible as I pulled into the Falls Creek (Dubois) Superchargers and NONE OF THEM WORKED. Luckily, I got one charger to trickle charge 50 miles in one hour and I left for Bellefonte where again I could not charge in the same slot where I was successful on Friday on my trip out. I moved 2 slots over and luckily was able to get a full charge to make it home. So I called Tesla support who claimed I had a cold battery at Falls Creek but I argue that I had no issues in Hermitage or Bellefonte on the way back. But my concern is what do you do if all the slots don’t charge and you don’t have enough to ak every it to the next charger. I was lucky but may not be so the next time. Also allow at least a 30 percent cushion for cold weather. Not happy as my wife bit off all her nails during this trip.

It's pretty easy to tell; the more yellow dashed lines there on are your regen, the colder the battery is. If regen is all yellow dashes you will get basically no charge from a SuC for awhile. It takes my S75D well over an hour of driving with range mode on to heat up to full. Can't remember where I read this but there is apparently a catch-22 where if the battery is too low and also too cold it will never charge.

 

[RogerHScott]

It's pretty easy to tell; the more yellow dashed lines there on are your regen, the colder the battery is. If regen is all yellow dashes you will get basically no charge from a SuC for awhile. It takes my S75D well over an hour of driving with range mode on to heat up to full. Can't remember where I read this but there is apparently a catch-22 where if the battery is too low and also too cold it will never charge.

According to Tesla, below a certain ambient temperature driving does not warm the battery and can actually cool it due to, basically, wind chill effect.

 

[LectricKa.]

FYI as an update I ended up going with a 75D and after owning my 75D for a year I can say that not once did I encounter range anxiety. Now even more so (than when I just bought it) with the increased number of supercharger deployment that took place in 2017 our range anxiety is pretty much gone.

Hi, I'm in kinda the same predicament as you right now. In Michigan, 160 Mile daily commute. Kalamazoo to East Lansing. So that's I94, I69, then I96 or I496 to get to work. The numbers for an EV vs my ICE car is kinda hard to beat on Excel.

I'm 80% convinced on a 75D right now (Used 2015/2016)

Thanks for your and others thoughtful comments. What would you consider "not" doing if you're at work? IE take a 10 mile trip for Lunch? etc?

Also can I ask how much is the Michigan Registration Fees for your 75D is?

 

[jgillispie]

Hi, I'm in kinda the same predicament as you right now. In Michigan, 160 Mile daily commute. Kalamazoo to East Lansing. So that's I94, I69, then I96 or I496 to get to work. The numbers for an EV vs my ICE car is kinda hard to beat on Excel.

I'm 80% convinced on a 75D right now (Used 2015/2016)

Thanks for your and others thoughtful comments. What would you consider "not" doing if you're at work? IE take a 10 mile trip for Lunch? etc?

Also can I ask how much is the Michigan Registration Fees for your 75D is?

What's going to hit you the most is those little trips like lunch when it's really cold. That 10 mile lunch might eat up 20 miles in range because the battery is cold again after the drive into work. 160 mile commute is going to be difficult at 10F and below without a charge somewhere along the way. Perhaps plugging in at work? That would help keep battery warm and give you extra miles. Even if it's just a 110.

 

[s1rk]

Last year while deciding to make my purchase between 75D vs 100D people kept saying "range is king" so I opted for the 100D. I've had no regrets spending more for the bigger battery because I'm a poor planner with a heavy foot. Being in Cali and with the influx of the model 3's I'm seeing stations that are increasingly getting busy, etc.

 

[ucmndd]

Hi, I'm in kinda the same predicament as you right now. In Michigan, 160 Mile daily commute. Kalamazoo to East Lansing. So that's I94, I69, then I96 or I496 to get to work. The numbers for an EV vs my ICE car is kinda hard to beat on Excel.

I'm 80% convinced on a 75D right now (Used 2015/2016)

Thanks for your and others thoughtful comments. What would you consider "not" doing if you're at work? IE take a 10 mile trip for Lunch? etc?

Also can I ask how much is the Michigan Registration Fees for your 75D is?

I do 110 miles a day in sunny California on a RWD 75. I've done 78,000 miles in ~2.5 years. I would strongly caution you against a 160 mile Michigan commute in a 75D.

Main reason is battery longevity. In 78k miles, I've lost about 11% of the original rated range of my 75 (full 100% charge is now ~220 miles). My general duty cycle is 90%-30%. This deeper continuous discharge cycle seems to have exacerbated degradation and range loss in my case. I expect it would be even worse with a longer commute in cold climate, where you'll need to charge higher every night and/or discharge significantly more. A little bit of degradation and some significant cold weather and I think you'll find quickly that the 75D isn't gonna cut it.

You want a 100kwh battery. Seriously.

 

[hqubic]

2018 75D here, I don't think I could get 200 miles on a full charge even here in NorCal this past winter, I would have serious range anxiety if I had to do 160 miles daily commute.

 

[Alset4S]

Hi, I'm in kinda the same predicament as you right now. In Michigan, 160 Mile daily commute. Kalamazoo to East Lansing. So that's I94, I69, then I96 or I496 to get to work. The numbers for an EV vs my ICE car is kinda hard to beat on Excel.

I'm 80% convinced on a 75D right now (Used 2015/2016)

Thanks for your and others thoughtful comments. What would you consider "not" doing if you're at work? IE take a 10 mile trip for Lunch? etc?

Also can I ask how much is the Michigan Registration Fees for your 75D is?

Better route planner says no problem. Leave Kalamazoo with 90% charge and have 13% when you get back. If that's a little too close for you stop in Marshall and charge for 5 minutes that will give you 20%, charge when you return.

Better yet just listen to your car. When you start back to Kalamazoo put in it Nav as the destination. It will tell if you need to charge or if you need to slow down to reach your destination. I've made numerous round trips of 500+, 900+ and 1800 miles and the car has been pretty much spot on each trip. I have zero range anxiety with my 75D.

 

[MIT_S60]

I do 110 miles a day in sunny California on a RWD 75. I've done 78,000 miles in ~2.5 years. I would strongly caution you against a 160 mile Michigan commute in a 75D.

Main reason is battery longevity. In 78k miles, I've lost about 11% of the original rated range of my 75 (full 100% charge is now ~220 miles). My general duty cycle is 90%-30%. This deeper continuous discharge cycle seems to have exacerbated degradation and range loss in my case. I expect it would be even worse with a longer commute in cold climate, where you'll need to charge higher every night and/or discharge significantly more. A little bit of degradation and some significant cold weather and I think you'll find quickly that the 75D isn't gonna cut it.

You want a 100kwh battery. Seriously.

What's your 90%?

 

[ucmndd]

What's your 90%?

90% of 220 I'd imagine.

I don't track it obsessively - I long ago switched the display to percentage and only occasionally flip over to take a look at the miles number when I range charge.

 

[ReddyLeaf]

Hi, I'm in kinda the same predicament as you right now. In Michigan, 160 Mile daily commute. Kalamazoo to East Lansing. So that's I94, I69, then I96 or I496 to get to work. The numbers for an EV vs my ICE car is kinda hard to beat on Excel.

I'm 80% convinced on a 75D right now (Used 2015/2016)

Thanks for your and others thoughtful comments. What would you consider "not" doing if you're at work? IE take a 10 mile trip for Lunch? etc?

Also can I ask how much is the Michigan Registration Fees for your 75D is?

I’m with others on this one. While you can probably always make 160 mi RT in winter, I’d definitely be worried about doing this EVERYDAY as a commute in Michigan, especially 3-5 years from now. I almost used all of my 70D battery on a one-way 100 mi leg (uphill) at 5F. This was a one-time trip, so not a significant problem but I’m guessing that MI has those temperatures many times each winter. If you’re budget constrained and are willing to stop for a quick coffee/snack on route in the worst weather, then ok go for it. Otherwise, consider the big battery or a model 3.

 

[RogerHScott]

Perhaps plugging in at work? That would help keep battery warm and give you extra miles. Even if it's just a 110.

I agree. Even if you can only put it on 110 while you're at work that will allow it to keep warm during the day and maybe gain a little charge, but probably enough to get you over the range anxiety hump. If you can pre-heat the car before heading home at the end of each day that's quite a bit of energy you don't need to use while on the road driving home. One of the joys that those California Tesla owners will mostly never know is getting into your toasty-warm Tesla (that you've remotely pre-heated) on a freezing-cold Midwestern winter day. Not so much in MI, but getting into your pre-cooled Tesla on a sweltering-hot Midwestern summer day doesn't suck, either.

 

[ucmndd]

I still maintain that while this is probably "possible", even perfectly reasonable on most days in most conditions, cycling the battery from 90% to ~13% every day is not going to be a winning strategy for a car you want to keep for a long time as a commuter. Like I said, I've lost 11% going from 90-30% every day in less than 2.5 years.

 

[RogerHScott]

I still maintain that while this is probably "possible", even perfectly reasonable on most days in most conditions, cycling the battery from 90% to ~13% every day is not going to be a winning strategy for a car you want to keep for a long time as a commuter. Like I said, I've lost 11% going from 90-30% every day in less than 2.5 years.

A valid concern, but charging during the day decreases the amplitude of that cycle. And, of course, if he can swing installing a destination charger at his place of work then that changes everything. Btw, your range loss seems significantly larger than typical (even for that behavior) -- I wonder what other factors might be at play?

 

[Tribaltech]

Hi, I'm in kinda the same predicament as you right now. In Michigan, 160 Mile daily commute. Kalamazoo to East Lansing. So that's I94, I69, then I96 or I496 to get to work. The numbers for an EV vs my ICE car is kinda hard to beat on Excel.

I'm 80% convinced on a 75D right now (Used 2015/2016)

Thanks for your and others thoughtful comments. What would you consider "not" doing if you're at work? IE take a 10 mile trip for Lunch? etc?

Also can I ask how much is the Michigan Registration Fees for your 75D is?

Hi there,

The S 75D should be plenty fine for your needs as you have highlighted above. Back when I bought my 75D there weren't many superchargers in Michigan. Now the picture is so much different for the better in that regard. First of all you will have the Marshall supercharger at the junction of 69- and 94 for emergency purposes. Then you have the Lansing supercharger if you again really need to charge. Then heading west back to KZoo you have 2 superchargers in Grand Rapids if things really get hairy. But from experience it has never come to that. As long as you plan a little bit you should be fine. During Spring thru Summer when the temps are above 45 degrees my Tesla gives me phenomenal "mileage" and efficiency. During summers I regularly get a 285 wh/mile mileage. I have gone much lower in usage too but wanted to give you the average number. I regularly beat their EPA number during summer.

During winter make sure you keep a buffer of an extra 20-30 miles of charge especially if you might take 10 mile long lunch break runs. The absolute worst range loss I have seen is once in a while during winters like January negative -20 degree kind of winters where it can eat upto 20-25 miles of range. Perhaps even more so if you are doing multiple start and stops running errands.

That said our Tesla has served us extremely well and range anxiety is non existent especially given their incredible roll out of superchargers all over Michigan.

All of the positives aside I do have to bring you back to reality and point out that we live in this backward state called Michigan. Where, unlike Colorado or California there is NO incentive to adopt green energy or clean vehicles. You don't get crap for putting solar in your house and you certainly get penalized for driving an EV. My Tesla registration fee in the first year was a whopping $625 if I am not mistaken. It went down to like $550 next year and the recent one was like $510 or something. That hurts really bad. I hate living in Michigan for how it continues to act so backward with its policies for green energy/transportation. I hate it.

That said, you will throughly enjoy your Tesla. The Superchargers have made it a no brainer to own and drive a Tesla. Its a car that gives me true joy every friggin day. And driving over daily commutes and road trips when you realize how much gas you did not burn by driving a Tesla feels really really good. ANd feels like you are part of the future.

I hope this helps. Let me know if you have further questions. Congrats on your potential purchase!!

 

[Tribaltech]

Hi there,

The S 75D should be plenty fine for your needs as you have highlighted above. Back when I bought my 75D there weren't many superchargers in Michigan. Now the picture is so much different for the better in that regard. First of all you will have the Marshall supercharger at the junction of 69- and 94 for emergency purposes. Then you have the Lansing supercharger if you again really need to charge. Then heading west back to KZoo you have 2 superchargers in Grand Rapids if things really get hairy. But from experience it has never come to that. As long as you plan a little bit you should be fine. During Spring thru Summer when the temps are above 45 degrees my Tesla gives me phenomenal "mileage" and efficiency. During summers I regularly get a 285 wh/mile mileage. I have gone much lower in usage too but wanted to give you the average number. I regularly beat their EPA number during summer.

During winter make sure you keep a buffer of an extra 20-30 miles of charge especially if you might take 10 mile long lunch break runs. The absolute worst range loss I have seen is once in a while during winters like January negative -20 degree kind of winters where it can eat upto 20-25 miles of range. Perhaps even more so if you are doing multiple start and stops running errands.

That said our Tesla has served us extremely well and range anxiety is non existent especially given their incredible roll out of superchargers all over Michigan.

All of the positives aside I do have to bring you back to reality and point out that we live in this backward state called Michigan. Where, unlike Colorado or California there is NO incentive to adopt green energy or clean vehicles. You don't get crap for putting solar in your house and you certainly get penalized for driving an EV. My Tesla registration fee in the first year was a whopping $625 if I am not mistaken. It went down to like $550 next year and the recent one was like $510 or something. That hurts really bad. I hate living in Michigan for how it continues to act so backward with its policies for green energy/transportation. I hate it.

That said, you will throughly enjoy your Tesla. The Superchargers have made it a no brainer to own and drive a Tesla. Its a car that gives me true joy every friggin day. And driving over daily commutes and road trips when you realize how much gas you did not burn by driving a Tesla feels really really good. ANd feels like you are part of the future.

I hope this helps. Let me know if you have further questions. Congrats on your potential purchase!!

Oh and like others have mentioned try plugging it in at work and or finding public EV charging stations that municipalities provide for free. Download the ChargePoint App as that will tell you location of public EVs that are available for use near your office. You'd be surprised how many chargepoint charging stations are out there.

I have done 160 mile trips in my 75D numerous times. Especially during winters I just take a full charge just to be safe and I have been fine. During summers even if you charge to 200 miles you should be OK. My 75D started with 259 miles on a 100% charge now it gives me 250 miles on a 100% charge. So when buying used try to find out how many charge cycles it has gone through and how much miles it gives as 100% range.

And once again, since its a used 75D it probably comes with free lifetime supercharging. So if you get in a pinch you have access to a few good superchargers on your route now as compared to a few years ago. Hope this helps