Model S and Pacemakers

[green1]

Great work! Out of curiosity, did you try the devices on the back seat (above the chargers) while charging? The writeup only mentions being near the cables, I'd expect more EM from the charger itself than the cable (except when supercharging)

That said, I'm not surprised it was no issue.

 

[Twiddler]

Great work! Out of curiosity, did you try the devices on the back seat (above the chargers) while charging? The writeup only mentions being near the cables, I'd expect more EM from the charger itself than the cable (except when supercharging)

That said, I'm not surprised it was no issue.

Yep - I have a battery of 20+ items (I made a log to input the time at each position so that I would know what to go back to in case I had a finding) that were performed while the devices were in all positions, including adjusting the climate control to extremes, raising and lowering suspension, opening/closing door handles, taking calls, max acceleration and regen, moving seats (when applicable) and plugging in in all configurations. Also, when I plugged in, I would wait until the charging got up to 40A (when using the NEMA 14-50) in all position, and also repeated this in each position at low (~20%) and high (~90%) SOC. I did the same at the supercharger - unplugging and repositioning for each test position and waiting until I was at my max charge rate prior to reposition. I even tested in both the trunk and smuggling compartment (where the jump seats would go) and in the front portion of the frunk and back within the "microwave." When in the back seat, I first buckled the devices upright for a more physiologic position (see picture - this was the front passenger, but repeated for the back seats) and also on the rear floor.

 

[brianman]

Impressive. Thanks for sharing with us.

 

[Geezer]

Thanks for sharing your study. I plan to share this with my EP doc!

 

[Chris TX]

Mmmm... Jello.

But seriously, awesome work that just confirms what we all thought.


SCIENCE!

 

[SteveS0353]

Thanks for sharing the result of your testing, and all the best for inclusion in HRS proceedings.

I may attend HRS next May in San Francisco, so please let us know if your paper will be included in the scientific sessions (a meeting opportunity?).

 

[ilovemycoffee]

Great study! I'm looking forward to your next paper, "Morbidy related to Ludicrous-mode induced tachycardia"

 

[Edison]

I had my 6 y/o spinal cord stimulator reprogramed last week.
Diving my wife's P85D seems to shut it off.
Is this possible?
My stim device looks like a cardiac pacemaker (at least it looks like those I saw 12 years ago when I was still passing gas)
My stim is a Boston Scientific device

 

[dsm363]

I had my 6 y/o spinal cord stimulator reprogramed last week.
Diving my wife's P85D seems to shut it off.
Is this possible?
My stim device looks like a cardiac pacemaker (at least it looks like those I saw 12 years ago when I was still passing gas)
My stim is a Boston Scientific device

I would think that is highly unlikely to be related to the Model S. Probably worth calling Boston Scientific and they might be able to look into it.

 

[ecarfan]

I had my 6 y/o spinal cord stimulator reprogramed last week.
Diving my wife's P85D seems to shut it off.
Is this possible?
My stim device looks like a cardiac pacemaker (at least it looks like those I saw 12 years ago when I was still passing gas)
My stim is a Boston Scientific device

I assume you are a retired anesthesiologist. I suggest that you have your neurosurgeon contact Boston Scientific and ask them for data on EMF fields interacting with their spinal cord stimulators, if they have such data. The EMF field intensity in the Tesla cabin has been measured and posted about on TMC. It's very low and comparable to ICE vehicles so it seems unlikely to be an issue. I don't know what else a Tesla could do to cause the issue you describe.

 

[Edison]

It's an annoyance, not a real problem. Anti-theft magnetic portals also shut it off. It is not very high-tech, the controller talks to the implant by an early version of Bluetooth, the controller itself is programmed via infra-red, like an old Palm Pilot.

 

[Kandiru]

Wow, Tesla is now a population control tool.

 

[SteveS0353]

I had my 6 y/o spinal cord stimulator reprogramed last week.
Diving my wife's P85D seems to shut it off.
Is this possible?
My stim device looks like a cardiac pacemaker (at least it looks like those I saw 12 years ago when I was still passing gas)
My stim is a Boston Scientific device

It's an annoyance, not a real problem. Anti-theft magnetic portals also shut it off. It is not very high-tech, the controller talks to the implant by an early version of Bluetooth, the controller itself is programmed via infra-red, like an old Palm Pilot.

I don't think it's related to the Model S. One TMC member performed a wide ranging study (reported here) which indicates that Model S is a pretty clean EMI environment. Modern implantable stimulators are designed very carefully to filter all sorts of radiation sources, but older devices could be susceptible to some environments.

 

[bonnie]

My wife and I recently purchased a new MS70 and we love it! I just learned this week, during a visit to my cardiologist, that I need to get a pacemaker. I checked the Tesla Owner's Manual and discovered a warning about possible interference between the keyless antennas and pacemakers. Ouch! I have tried to uncover more detailed information from Tesla (main office, service dept, sales), but no one has encountered this issue before. Are there any Tesla owners out there with pacemakers? What have been your experiences? Should I worry? Do I need to take preventive measures? I can't believe I'm the first one to face this issue.

As mentioned by @Chris TX, pacemakers are required to meet immunity standards (EMI), and provide test data to FDA as part of the submission/approval process.

There are certain devices, such as cell phones/microwaves/metal detectors, that used to potentially impact pacemakers if too close - but newer pacemakers are required to meet more stringent EMI standards - meaning that the manufacturer needs to be able to demonstrate that the pacemaker is not negatively impacted by these things.

Any pacemaker currently on the market is required to meet the new-ish standard. Personally, I wouldn't worry about it. But if you're at all concerned, make it a practice not to put your key card (or phone, for that matter) in proximity to your pacemaker (like a shirt pocket). Just a little distance will reduce any possibility substantially.

 

[bonnie]

I had my 6 y/o spinal cord stimulator reprogramed last week.
Diving my wife's P85D seems to shut it off.
Is this possible?
My stim device looks like a cardiac pacemaker (at least it looks like those I saw 12 years ago when I was still passing gas)
My stim is a Boston Scientific device

I assume you are a retired anesthesiologist. I suggest that you have your neurosurgeon contact Boston Scientific and ask them for data on EMF fields interacting with their spinal cord stimulators, if they have such data. The EMF field intensity in the Tesla cabin has been measured and posted about on TMC. It's very low and comparable to ICE vehicles so it seems unlikely to be an issue. I don't know what else a Tesla could do to cause the issue you describe.

Boston Scientific, like every medical device manufacturer, is required to investigate any negative claim suspected to be related to device performance & keep records of that. You should directly call Boston Scientific & ask to speak to someone in the quality group that handles customer complaints. They'l look into it and are also required to respond to you - most companies try to get that done within 30 days, but not always possible. Companies take these calls seriously, as does FDA. (In fact, if they don't respond, FDA has the MedWatch program where you can report a suspected issue to them directly.)

 

[Ande]

My wife was one of the youngest to get peacemaker (git is at age of 15, (she is now 33,))
So due to her internal wiring, she is still on the "old" devices. (second pacemaker now, "Meditronic Sensia")
We never even thought about that, the warning it's most likely due to the ridiculous cost a medical trail would amount to.