Model S Not Ready For Commercial Use Prime Time. Can I afford to own this car?

[Gizmotoy]

Well, that's labor costs you're including. I want to know the price for an actual refurbed unit. I'd love to see the invoice when the car is returned from service.

Well, yes, clearly. Is there some assumption he's getting the labor for free?

I'd be surprised if they used a refurb part for out of warranty work. Sometimes OEMs use refurbs while in warranty to cut costs, but rarely do the same after expiration.

Either way, I agree the part cost would be interesting to learn.

 

[ckessel]

I feel bad for the OP. Aside from the expense, he's out the use of the car which is how they make their living. And he's been out that use several times. That's expensive.

Gas cars have a hell of a lot more moving parts, but the technology has gotten so refined it's typically incredibly reliable. Tesla (and EVs in general) needs to not just have great service, they need their cars to blow gas cars away in terms of reliability.

 

[apacheguy]

OP says estimate was "to replace". That would typically be parts and labor. So, we do not know part price, or if that estimate assumed new or refurbished.

Yes, we do. It should be on the invoice. They bill parts and labor separately.

 

[tomas]

Yes, we do. It should be on the invoice. They bill parts and labor separately.

My point was that people acting as if part price was $3300 are assuming estimate included no labor, which I doubt. True, repair invoices are itemized, but who knows if estimate was? When/if OP posts invoice, then we would know.

 

[rcc]

I did not get the extended warranty. We usually put about 100K miles each year on a Lincoln Towncar. So i guessed that i would be out of even the extended warranty pretty quick. But we only put 50K miles on in the first year. I also thought that most of the serious problems would be covered by the drivetrain warranty or the battery would be the problem but had a long warranty by itself.

That would be a reasonable assumption if you were buying a car from an established auto manufacturer with a track record of turning out high quality mid or high volume vehicles.

What we had in this case though was a startup company with a no track record of anything but boutique assembly, totally new car, totally new production line. In a case like that, the extended warranty seemed like a reasonable decision. Heck, the only reason I bought the car at all was because they'd hired industry manufacturing veterans from big companies like Ford.

And yes, after a test drive, I bought stock too .

 

[ckessel]

Warranties are a function of both time and miles, so if you're vastly under on one of them you lose a decent chunk of the warranty value. Some of the items that fail have little or nothing to do with miles driven. For example, if you're putting 100k a year on a car, you're probably not opening and closing the sun roof nearly as many times as someone that puts 100k miles on over 8 years.

I can fully understand not getting the extended warranty in that situation.

 

[Electric700]

Pmacafee, can Tesla just repair the charger, especially for over $3,000? We might just be talking about a $3 wire that needs to be replaced. Tesla should use this as an opportunity to improve their design so that these types of failures can be prevented. Also, contact [email protected].

 

[skboston]

There is no possible way that the charger costs so much money including labor, parts are just another way of making money and Tesla and it's approved body shops are no different, opinion I've formed over the topics I've read on these forums.
$2000+ for a charger sounds a bit steep, perhaps there are people our here that have made their own chargers I'm sure, so they can chime in on the subject of cost. I met a Canadian guy on an electric motorcycle couple weeks ago that had replaced the 1kW charger on his bike with a 13kW charger built on his own to charge the fast on the road, I should have asked him how much it costed him to put it together.
You can't possibly convince me that it would take 10 hours of labor to replace the charger(assuming $100 per hour labor rate and $2000 cost for a charger), Tesla is well designed vehicle with fairly easy to reach components and I'm sure the access to the charger won't be hard, but I could be wrong, really have no clue where it is, just my thought.

 

[Gizmotoy]

You can't possibly convince me that it would take 10 hours of labor to replace the charger(assuming $100 per hour labor rate and $2000 cost for a charger), Tesla is well designed vehicle with fairly easy to reach components and I'm sure the access to the charger won't be hard, but I could be wrong, really have no clue where it is, just my thought.

The chargers are relatively easy to access under the rear seats. The seats are kind of a pain to remove, but not 10 hours worth.

 

[Pmacafee]

Pmacafee, can Tesla just repair the charger, especially for over $3,000? We might just be talking about a $3 wire that needs to be replaced. Tesla should use this as an opportunity to improve their design so that these types of failures can be prevented. Also, contact [email protected].

Good point. If Musk says the drive unit problems came down to a single wire, then maybe the same for the charge unit.

About contacting ownership, tell me more about this.
-P

 

[skboston]

@Gizmotoy

Thanks! You learn new things everyday.

Essentially the charger should be something similar to what the HPWC looks inside, control board, fuse and solid wire connectors, maybe it's an issue that could be repaired, but Tesla so far insists of replacing everything that breaks, so I'd be pleasantly surprised if the SC takes the unit out and try to find out what's wrong with it and if something simple, just repair and put back on.

 

[Chris TX]

The chargers are relatively easy to access under the rear seats. The seats are kind of a pain to remove, but not 10 hours worth.

Keep in mind these things are water cooled. When you R&R then, you're opening up the cooling system and they might need to drain it and refill. It's not just pop the seat up and swap.

 

[Canuck]

Will you continue to use the car in your business when you get it back from service?

 

[skboston]

I tried doing a search to find out if the on-board chargers are liquid cooled or not, but couldn't find anything definitive. If they are liquid cooled, then things might be a bit more sophisticated, but still not ~10 hours worth.

 

[islandbayy]

Keep in mind these things are water cooled. When you R&R then, you're opening up the cooling system and they might need to drain it and refill. It's not just pop the seat up and swap.

The cooling system has a automatic bleed function. Tech plugs laptop in, tells the car to bleed the system, and the car does. Takes about 30 minutes. If the coolant level gets low during this time, tech tops coolant off.

- - - Updated - - -

I tried doing a search to find out if the on-board chargers are liquid cooled or not, but couldn't find anything definitive. If they are liquid cooled, then things might be a bit more sophisticated, but still not ~10 hours worth.

They are Liquid Cooled. I've seen them in person.

 

[Pmacafee]

Will you continue to use the car in your business when you get it back from service?

In the process of Shopping the car 2 years ago, and then driving the Model S, I have become a huge fan of electric cars, and the future of EVs. I and all my drivers certified to drive the Model S absolutely love the car. Man passengers do too. Others still prefer the roomier soft ride of a Lincoln Towncar while they are still around. I will have to see how much we are upside down on our lease and make a business decision for our company. Maybe we are just a little too early in adopting these vehicles for the rigors of commercial use.

 

[ckessel]

Out of curiosity, why did you lease a car that you'd put so many miles on? A lease usually has penalties for excess mileage and with your usage you would be way, way beyond normal.

 

[SarahsDad]

280 rated miles is certainly on the high side even for a new car but OP says he got a "rebuilt" battery just 4 wks ago. So essentially new.

 

[Electric700]

Good point. If Musk says the drive unit problems came down to a single wire, then maybe the same for the charge unit.

About contacting ownership, tell me more about this.
-P

That e-mail address is good to report suggestions and issues that you're having. So, you can put in an e-mail to [email protected] this charger problem that you're having and request the unit be repaired (e.g. let's say hypothetically that all it requires is a $3 wire replacement). Also I'd mention that this is not the first issue you're having in a little over one year since you got the car new.

I hope it works out in your favor!

 

[tomas]

That e-mail address is good to report suggestions and issues that you're having. So, you can put in an e-mail to [email protected] this charger problem that you're having and request the unit be repaired (e.g. let's say hypothetically that all it requires is a $3 wire replacement). Also I'd mention that this is not the first issue you're having in a little over one year since you got the car new.

I hope it works out in your favor!

I'd add that ownership@ has recently kicked emails to local service center and response comes from them. Not sure how to play this. If service center has been less than helpful then it might make sense to mention in email. Of course they may send that along too!