Model S range and interior update imminent?

[Uncle Paul]

Tesla has been good at springing improvements with little notice. When they feel ready to improve some aspect they just go ahead and release it. Almost impossible to predict when and what they will improve next.

The last 75 kw upgrade in performance came out of nowhere. Not predicted on the forums.

Never saw a car company that was as quick to make significant upgrades to their product line as Tesla.

 

[TurboBear]

I currently drive a Cadillac ELR. Despite all the shortcomings of the ELR drivetrain and pricing of the car, they hit the ball out of the park when it came to the interior. It's fit and finish, ambiance, sound system, and comfort have surpassed any BMW or Mercedes I've ever been in. I am planning to get a Model S later this year. The Tesla is definitely sleeker than my ELR on the inside and not as posh, but it is a more minimalistic luxury all around. I don't think the Tesla designers were ever going for the opulent feel that you get in many luxury cars. That being said, the interior is luxurious enough for me.

I sold my ELR to buy a Model S in March. The only thing I miss vs. the Model S is the slightly better seat comfort on the Caddy.

 

[Model S M.D.]

I have to admit, based on all of the feedback on the Model 3, it really does feel like the next generation Tesla, regardless of what Elon says. The Model 3 is just a totally different car. The HAVE to update the S/X interior soon. Can't wait to see/drive the Model 3 in person.

 

[iffatall]

There is more to a car than the size of the gas tank. My F150 goes 400 miles between fillups, does that make it better than the large battery Model 3?

That's an unfair comparison. Battery is one of the most significant chunk in the price of an EV. The gas tank is not, in an ICE. Also, charging infra is not ubiquitous enough to make one as carefree about range of an EV, as they are about tank size in an ICE, although, you may argue that is my opinion.

That said, I do still believe there is more to the price gap between MS and M3 than just the range.

 

[whttiger25]

The Model S is a much bigger car with 2x the cargo space. The fact that it has a hatchback also makes much of that space far more accessible. As an example, I can throw two bikes in the back of my model S and only have to take one front wheel off of one of the bikesm and still have lots of room more more stuff. It's also faster to 60mph by a full second.

Anyone who wants to compare the S and 3 purely on a range basis is missing the point. It's not all about a luxury interior, it's also about the overall utility of the car.

That being said, Tesla would be wise to add more fit and finish to the S interior to continue to justify the higher price in other ways. I am happy with my car and the price i paid, but I would like to see the company excel.

 

[Sunshine State]

The Model S is a much bigger car with 2x the cargo space. The fact that it has a hatchback also makes much of that space far more accessible. As an example, I can throw two bikes in the back of my model S and only have to take one front wheel off of one of the bikesm and still have lots of room more more stuff. It's also faster to 60mph by a full second.

Anyone who wants to compare the S and 3 purely on a range basis is missing the point. It's not all about a luxury interior, it's also about the overall utility of the car.

That being said, Tesla would be wise to add more fit and finish to the S interior to continue to justify the higher price in other ways. I am happy with my car and the price i paid, but I would like to see the company excel.

I am very impressed with my Model S interior usefulness compared to my Model X interior rear volume utilization. I'm very surprised the 3 didn't get the rear hatch configuration as it seems unbeatable in a sedan. Everyone wants to compare the value of the Model 3 to the 3 series BMW but the 3 isn't a true volume car compared to vehicles such as the Camry or Accord. If the Model 3 is to be an exercise in sustainable transport and become a true volume car those should be the pricing, range and build quality targets.

 

[eyespii]

The Model S is a much bigger car with 2x the cargo space. The fact that it has a hatchback also makes much of that space far more accessible. As an example, I can throw two bikes in the back of my model S and only have to take one front wheel off of one of the bikesm and still have lots of room more more stuff. It's also faster to 60mph by a full second.

Anyone who wants to compare the S and 3 purely on a range basis is missing the point. It's not all about a luxury interior, it's also about the overall utility of the car.

That being said, Tesla would be wise to add more fit and finish to the S interior to continue to justify the higher price in other ways. I am happy with my car and the price i paid, but I would like to see the company excel.

The S does seem like it’d be more utilitarian then the 3, but no one buys the RS7/CLS over the A4/C300 ‘cause of the hatch. They buy the premium sedans cause they have the money, and they can. And when you’re dropping twice the cash, you want something more to show for it than a hatchback and a 1-sec diff in 0-60 times.

 

[Destiny1701]

comparing the M 3 and the S is sure apples and oranges, but only from a car-class PoV. To a person that is the market to buy an EV both are considered equally. Most people do not care about AWD. That's way down the list of why someone would buy one car over the other. People want a really good EV. The vast majority of people do not care about the slightly higher performance of the Model S.

That's the reason why upper class cars sell in such small numbers compared to normal ones. The number of people that can afford such a car is very limited and it's hard to come up with features that justify double the price. The Model S was an exception that attracted people that would otherwise not buy such an expensive car. Now this unique situation is gone and Tesla has to make the Model S worth it's price. Being the only awesome EV used to be enough.

Interesting.
I don't agree entirely with awd being way down the list. The MS only now comes in D format other then the 75? If the market didn't want it, why continually offer it? Also living up in Toronto, I can assume anyone from the northern states and Canada definitely appreciates AWD as a necessity not an option.

I agree performance wise. Only the select few are in for the sheer acceleration as with any car model today with performance versions being a small % of production. Vast majority only require the middle of the pack vehicle with decent options.

As for buying an EV solely for the drivetrain without considering other lifestyle choices, ie. roominess, finish, features etc, then most would just by a leaf, bolt/volt and be done with it there is definitely something to be said for those who will not compromise their comforts while looking for an EV. MS needs to improve now dramatically or yes it will cease to keep up and eventually fizzle out in its current form. It needs a compete refresh I'd say.

If I were looking now between the S and 3, I'd probably not consider the 3 for the smaller luggage space. Having said that, the almighty dollar always comes into play!

 

[Sunshine State]

The S does seem like it’d be more utilitarian then the 3, but no one buys the RS7/CLS over the A4/C300 ‘cause of the hatch. They buy the premium sedans cause they have the money, and they can. And when you’re dropping twice the cash, you want something more to show for it than a hatchback and a 1-sec diff in 0-60 times.

The RS7 has a hatch the CLS has a trunk. I know two people that bought the Audis A7 over the CLS because of the versatility of the hatch. Both of those are very nice cars with incredible interior style and quality. If I had to get an ice car to replace my Model S the A7 would have similar usefulness. The A7/S7 and CLS should be the bench marks for interior updates that Tesla should shoot for when the S and X can be upgraded. The Model 3 price point couldn't justify an interior like those but the new C class would be a lofty target to shoot for. A Tesla with a Mercedes interior would be an awesome car!

 

[Spidy]

Anyone who wants to compare the S and 3 purely on a range basis is missing the point. It's not all about a luxury interior, it's also about the overall utility of the car.

The difference between a sedan and station wagon version of a car is usually less than 5k. A 5-Series station wagon with more utility costs less than a 6-Series GT.

Utility is great and can be a selling point, but a lot of people buying a Model S probably also have another can and if the wife drives a SUV a Model 3 will be good enough as commuter car.

 

[David99]

I think we all agree the Model S needs significant improvements to justify the much higher price. The current Model S doesn't offer much premium over the Model 3. Tesla isn't figuring this out only now. They knew all along and I'm pretty sure there will be a new generation Model S soon.

 

[AmpedRealtor]

What about the "production hell" with Model 3? Does Tesla also want to redo S at the same time?

Maybe that's why it's "production hell" - because they'll be producing two new vehicle platforms at once. He's just not telling us the other half of the story... yet.

 

[Tummy]

From this historic interviews I've seen Elon and Franz von Holzhausen, they designed the Model S to be a $50k car initially. For $50k, the interior stacks up very well with competition in 2012/2013 like the E class or 5 series. The reality is that they needed to sell it for much more, but didn't have the ability or didn't prioritize the interior.

Performance is an easy and profitable thing for them to turn up. Luxury buyers pay absurd amount of money to go from a standard Mercedes to an AMG model with only 1 second 0-60 difference.

 

[eyespii]

The RS7 has a hatch the CLS has a trunk. I know two people that bought the Audis A7 over the CLS because of the versatility of the hatch. Both of those are very nice cars with incredible interior style and quality. If I had to get an ice car to replace my Model S the A7 would have similar usefulness. The A7/S7 and CLS should be the bench marks for interior updates that Tesla should shoot for when the S and X can be upgraded. The Model 3 price point couldn't justify an interior like those but the new C class would be a lofty target to shoot for. A Tesla with a Mercedes interior would be an awesome car!

Oh oops - didn't know the CLS wasn't a hatch.

 

[cab]

Even though the Bolt and Model 3 have gotten all the press in recent weeks/months, I'm also interested in what we'll likely start seeing from the Germans late next year. I mean, I could live with an all electric next gen BMW 3 series optioned the way I'd like for in town driving and maybe pair that up with a Swedish Volvo XC60 T8 (short local trips would still be electric and I get the gas engine for out of town trips)...hardly the worst combo. Our Model S is certainly cool, but honestly...take away the big screen and I'm not sure the interior is as nice as my mother's new Accord with leather.

 

[Mike K]

Even though the Bolt and Model 3 have gotten all the press in recent weeks/months, I'm also interested in what we'll likely start seeing from the Germans late next year. I mean, I could live with an all electric next gen BMW 3 series optioned the way I'd like for in town driving and maybe pair that up with a Swedish Volvo XC60 T8 (short local trips would still be electric and I get the gas engine for out of town trips)...hardly the worst combo. Our Model S is certainly cool, but honestly...take away the big screen and I'm not sure the interior is as nice as my mother's new Accord with leather.

I'd love an all electric 5 series. I just sat in a base model 5 series and the interior is markedly better than my S, pleather seats and all. An interior refresh is all Tesla needs to do to get my money in the form of an S over a 3. I'm dying to see what they get out of the Volvo guy.

 

[idleuser]

The fact that we're having these conversation speaks volume about the Model S being less desirable after the final specs of the Model 3's and price. Tesla needs to upgrade and I'm willing to bet the production numbers for the S will fall below expectation in Q1. Especially after the free supercharging and tax credit dwindles.

 

[FlatSix911]

The fact that we're having these conversation speaks volume about the Model S being less desirable after the final specs of the Model 3's and price. Tesla needs to upgrade and I'm willing to bet the production numbers for the S will fall below expectation in Q1. Especially after the free supercharging and tax credit dwindles.

I suspect that free Supercharging will be extended to all Model S/X in 2018 ... a key market differentiator with the Model 3

 

[Burnt Toast]

The standard new E class interior is not much different than the Designo other than color, genuine leather, and cross stitching but the standard has the same great build quality. The Tesla is electric and that is its advantage. Very few will waste their time to argue the S has a competitive interior.

There is very little similarities between a stock E class interior and the Designo interior. I was at the new E class launch last year, when they had stock E200s with the basic interior. I was shocked at how basic and poor it was. The leather was stiff and nasty, the dash was a slab of hard touch plastic, only the touches (speakers, interior LEDs) seemed to be of a high standard. It wasn't until you sat in a $170k E400 with a Designo interior until you got soft touch plastic, a leather lined dash, nappa leather seats and the luxury that everyone seems to think is standard.

 

[Sunshine State]

There is very little similarities between a stock E class interior and the Designo interior. I was at the new E class launch last year, when they had stock E200s with the basic interior. I was shocked at how basic and poor it was. The leather was stiff and nasty, the dash was a slab of hard touch plastic, only the touches (speakers, interior LEDs) seemed to be of a high standard. It wasn't until you sat in a $170k E400 with a Designo interior until you got soft touch plastic, a leather lined dash, nappa leather seats and the luxury that everyone seems to think is standard.

In the US all the E class cars get nice interiors. They must have different trim level cars for different markets.