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Model S versus Leaf???

Discussion in 'Electric Vehicles' started by Kevin Sharpe, Oct 6, 2011.

  1. Kevin Sharpe

    Kevin Sharpe Active Member

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    well, given that the Leaf will be able to travel much further than the Model S and at a fraction of the price why is that not a competitive problem for Tesla?
     
  2. qwk

    qwk Model S P2681

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    Probably because the leaf is ugly, not powerfull and is not a luxury car, so different market segment.
     
  3. Norbert

    Norbert TSLA will win

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    I do like Nissan for building the Leaf and starting with fast charging networks, and expect both to be successful. However when forced to compare, I'd say Tesla's vision is (so far) more appealing, and I'd expect it to be at least as successful, even if it takes a bit more time for a still small company to get towards building a mainstream car.
     
  4. Kevin Sharpe

    Kevin Sharpe Active Member

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    most of the people I know who are interested in the Model S need a car that can replace their ICE... without a fast charging network the Model S will be a expensive second car both here and in mainland Europe. As CHAdeMO gets established the Leaf becomes more viable for many.
     
  5. qwk

    qwk Model S P2681

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    It may be so in Europe(unresolved Tesla charging problems), but here in the US, the people that want a better EV could probably stretch and get the base Model S, while you won't have too many that can afford an S settle for the Leaf(unless thay absolutely cannot wait).
     
  6. TEG

    TEG TMC Moderator

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    Lower price point (and a car that fits in my puny garage) overrode those shortcomings.
    I had high hopes for CHAdeMO so it could be my only car, but for now I have to keep a backup ICE car (parked for long periods in an awkward place) for longer trips. Hopefully (for Leaf owners) the CHAdeMO rollout happens so we can get rid of the backup ICE vehicle. I will probably trade the Leaf in on something better in a few years. It is a comfortable (dare I say almost luxurious) car, but the looks and short range make me hope to upgrade it to something better when the opportunity presents itself.
     
  7. TEG

    TEG TMC Moderator

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    I ran into a bunch of Leaf buyers that said the Leaf was a stretch, and an S would be too much for them. Leaf is priced more to be a mainstream vehicle, but the short range will probably limit just how many people are willing to ultimately buy them. Ubiquitous CHAdeMO could certainly help, but will it happen? It has to not only be in lots of places, but also be available and reliable.
     
  8. vfx

    vfx Well-Known Member

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    The new Infiniti is a better comparison. $47K 130 miles

    I bet half of the you Tube hits on the Model S drives are from car competitors. Heck you know theya re sourcing these pages since TMC is a one stop information source on what Telsa is doing.

    And the Infiniti guys must have looked at this event and are in a mad scramble of meetings this week.
     
  9. qwk

    qwk Model S P2681

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    I totally agree. I think the original point was that the Leaf wouldn't steal too many customers from the S unless they just absolutely couldn't wait. As for myself, I would consider the Leaf if the Model S wasn't coming soon, but the measly range and looks just put me off...
     
  10. qwk

    qwk Model S P2681

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    Infinity is going to have a hard time matching the S on range and features for the price and making a profit at the same time...
     
  11. gg_got_a_tesla

    gg_got_a_tesla Model S: VIN P65513, Model 3 Res Holder

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    Personally, I'd have gone for the Leaf had it not been for the range. My < 60 mile daily commute (and 3-person family) would have been okay with the Leaf but, the fairly frequent 100-125 mile weekend trips were the problem. I don't find anything wrong with the Leaf's looks - in Red (sorta' like the S's Signature Red), it looks quite good!

    I did earn some good karma by reserving a Leaf last year and using my reservation to have one of my coworkers pickup one a few weeks ago! But, I can see the range anxiety in him though given that our employer hasn't emerged from the Stone Age in terms of installing a charging station :(
     
  12. Mycroft

    Mycroft Life happens

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    I trust Infinity's 130 mile range as much as I trust the Leaf's 100. At least the Infinity would get you a true 100 miles though.
     
  13. W.Petefish

    W.Petefish Active Member

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    I think all of the car makers got a kick to the crotch this past weekend. I.e. they were just told bluntly that they are not measuring up, keeping up, or going electric enough for the next generations of cars.

    As for me it is a no-contest. I'd get the Model S and wait on it, even if it was a full year away.
     
  14. jkirkebo

    jkirkebo Model S P85+ VIN 14420 EU

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    I have a Leaf on order (delivery imminent) and might replace it with a Model S later. I have no problem affording it, but I'm not very interested in luxury features (I prefer cloth interior and manual seats for example) or performance (the Leaf is plenty fast for me). What interests me in the Model S is the longer range, excellent storage capacity, ride quality (air suspension) and things like class-leading traction control and battery technology.

    I have no problem with the Leafs looks. I think it looks very good in white actually.

    But a longer range EV is of no use to me if I can't recharge it faster than 3.6kW on the road. So I'm on the fence until the CHAdeMO debacle is sorted out.

    Now, it they would just offer a hitch too, I could get a Model S and also keep the Leaf, getting rid of the VW Touran TDI instead. That would be really nice...
     
  15. Mycroft

    Mycroft Life happens

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    Your best bet is probably to run the Leaf and Touran until the Model X is out. That guy will come with the drive and the hitch.
     
  16. jkirkebo

    jkirkebo Model S P85+ VIN 14420 EU

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    Yeah, only problem is that I don't want a SUV. They're generally overweight, tall cars with little interior space compared to the huge exterior. About the opposite of the Touran actually. But maybe Tesla will manage to build a nice one ?

    The Bluestar would probably be a closer match to what I need. Or maybe the Leaf "2.0" in 2015...
     
  17. AnOutsider

    AnOutsider S532 # XS27

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    I actually thought your leaf looked quite handsome in the lot

    yeah, but once Tesla shows it can be done, they MIGHT be able to build out and to scale quicker than Tesla and with more established names + dealer infrastructure. That is, unless, they didn't take EVs seriously at ALL and don't have at least one side project going that they can get to market quickly.

    I think the Model X will be pretty roomy, but as for SUVs... I think you may mean crossovers, and yeah, those are typically cars made taller, so the interior space doesn't change much except in height. I find a sporty crossover fun to drive though.
     
  18. TEG

    TEG TMC Moderator

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    It "ain't no Tesla".
    Plus those front bug-eye headlights bother me. But the LED light they put out is great.

    The back hatch looks kind-of nice from some angles.
     
  19. AnOutsider

    AnOutsider S532 # XS27

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    Headlights are weird, hatch is nice, size is nice (much taller than the versa hatch that was also there). Don't think I'd own one (even with a 300 mile pack), but it's not fugly.
     
  20. Kevin Sharpe

    Kevin Sharpe Active Member

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    Once the Leaf has a 7kW charger and an extensive UK network of CHAdeMO has been built then we will seriously consider buying several for our business. While I much prefer the Model S styling and features I believe the Leaf will be able to travel the length and breadth of the UK easily whereas the Model S will struggle without a Tesla Fast Charge Network.
     

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