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Model Y - Gigafactory Texas Production

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It looks like your screwed if 4680 cells go bad. There is no fixing a Structural pack, all you can do is replace it.
That is pretty much true of all Tesla packs. There are some serviceable parts under the "penthouse" cover, but if any cell goes bad in any Tesla pack your only choice is to replace the entire pack. (Well Elon mentioned in the past that you might be able to replace all of the battery modules in a Model 3 pack, just keeping the electronics and enclosure, but I doubt that will make a huge cost difference.)

Yeah - I was a little shocked, but this seems to lead in the direction that the only servicing of 4860 packs will be total-pack-replacement. Maybe Tesla itself will take packs back for recycling of cells into new/refurb packs.

Yes, Tesla recycles failed packs. Though they have said that there isn't enough failed packs to do much yet.
 
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Yes we do know. It’s 680ish cells with two rows of foam. It’s a MY AWD. It is established what’s inside the pack as far as cells. If it was anything else (i.e. the mythical software unlockable full 4680 pack), Tesla would likely be asking them to keep that quiet.
How keep that quiet? They'll be wrecked cars any day now and anybody and everybody will see the battery packs. There are no secrets once you sell a product.
 
That is pretty much true of all Tesla packs. There are some serviceable parts under the "penthouse" cover, but if any cell goes bad in any Tesla pack your only choice is to replace the entire pack. (Well Elon mentioned in the past that you might be able to replace all of the battery modules in a Model 3 pack, just keeping the electronics and enclosure, but I doubt that will make a huge cost difference.)

I have seen some of the Rich rebuilds where he was replacing modules in the battery packs to fix them for a great savings over new. Opening the packs didn't destroy the covers .

I am not surprised by the foam. but those tac welds kind of put the nail in trying to reuse it. You can tell they were bending that back and forth for quite some time to free it.
 
Yeah - I was a little shocked, but this seems to lead in the direction that the only servicing of 4860 packs will be total-pack-replacement. Maybe Tesla itself will take packs back for recycling of cells into new/refurb packs.
I would expect them to end up in Robo's, for sure. Maybe replacement packs, Semi's, and CT's.
It's very early days; current pack life is excellent and I expect these to be excellent as well.
The risk of failure/pack replacement is also mitigated by how much parallel circuitry is in the packs, such that individual cells (at 4.2V) matter less.

And that foam is just expansion foam. Who's to say it couldn't be diagnosed and individual cells or arrays be serviced, and new foam sprayed on.
Wait for the Munro teardown.
 
That's the standard way to measure charge rate though.


I see ~240-250 miles when doing strictly highway (70-80 mph). It looks like he was estimating about the same. Maybe the newer ones with the 82 kwh are different, though. Mine is the 75.
Replying to a really old post here, but this seems really low. Is this due to battery degradation or is your Wh/mi higher than you expected? I get 290-300 miles on a full charge with my MYP, averaging 272 Wh/mi over the last 5000 miles.
 
I would expect them to end up in Robo's, for sure. Maybe replacement packs, Semi's, and CT's.
It's very early days; current pack life is excellent and I expect these to be excellent as well.
The risk of failure/pack replacement is also mitigated by how much parallel circuitry is in the packs, such that individual cells (at 4.2V) matter less.

And that foam is just expansion foam. Who's to say it couldn't be diagnosed and individual cells or arrays be serviced, and new foam sprayed on.
Wait for the Munro teardown.

That cover is destroyed , they would need to replace the foam and have a new top to the cover that can be tack welded between the batteries back to the origional pack, there is just no way that will be done.
 
Why would they re-build perfectly serviceable cells when refurb packs are totally something Tesla already does for 2170
They don't refurb packs like you think they do. A refurb pack normally only has electronic, cooling, or cabling repairs. If even a single cell fails you have to recycle all of the modules, you can't replace the cell, or the module it is in, and have the pack still work for very long. (Every cell/module has to be perfectly matched/balanced to the rest of the cells/modules in the pack.)
 
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No company is going to ask an someone who bought a vehicle in the wild to be quiet about anything. Munro doesn't work for Tesla, this is no NDA situation.
If the Batteries are not as efficient as they were touting on battery day the pack could very well be full, nothing mystical about it just less efficient.

In any case, in the Munro video they are expecting to see between 800 to 850 cells in that AWD pack so like I said, no one knows...
There might not be an NDA but there could be something In an order/purchasing agreement that says something about buying a vehicle for the sole purpose of deconstructing and exposing the intellectual property secrets. Munro is doing something similar with the 4680 cells they are selling. Purchasing one is agreeing to never use it as a battery, strictly as an observation piece only.

And why do you keep perpetuating the MY AWD 800-850 cell full pack myth? The MY AWD DOES NOT HAVE a full 4680 pack. It has 15% less than a full pack. It is missing 2 full rows of cells.

How keep that quiet? They'll be wrecked cars any day now and anybody and everybody will see the battery packs. There are no secrets once you sell a product.
Just because a car is wrecked doesn’t mean the battery with be opened. Sure there will be whole packs for sale but that doesn’t mean people will open them to look inside. It takes a lot to open one and once you have, its no longer sellable/usable.

They don't refurb packs like you think they do. A refurb pack normally only has electronic, cooling, or cabling repairs. If even a single cell fails you have to recycle all of the modules, you can't replace the cell, or the module it is in, and have the pack still work for very long. (Every cell/module has to be perfectly matched/balanced to the rest of the cells/modules in the pack.)
So once a cell is made, Tesla has to test each one and match 650 together? For every module and every pack?

The 4680 structural battery pack was designed to accommodate up to approximately 960 cells, according to multiple reports from some time ago. So, if the MY AWD is actually using less then 700 cells, then there is a lot of room for a much higher capacity version. It will be interesting to see how many cells Austin built MY-LR models (i.e., with 330 mi. EPA range) will have, and how much more the pack can be expanded for a future even longer range model.
Austin built LR MY use 2170 cells. Same as Fremont. That is known.

And your “lot of room” is only 2 rows of cells. 15% roughly. And 15% more cells won’t get you 15% more range so a “full pack” 4680 LR IF it was ever made will have less than 330 mile range. This has been discussed many times previously. Amd there will not be room for pack expansion beyond the 800-850 cell “full pack”. Putting in more cells would require a pack amd car redesign. Something that would be a long way out if ever.

Hopefully all the hype buyers will realize Battery Day was a lot of hope with not a lot of substance. Everyone dreams of making something the best it can be but it rarely happens out of the gate. 4680 has a lot of work to be done to get close to the hype.
 
So once a cell is made, Tesla has to test each one and match 650 together? For every module and every pack?
Yes. But in theory every brand new cell should match. It is as they are used their characteristics change. But every cell in a pack is put under the same usage pattern so they age/change the same. No two packs get used exactly the same way so it is highly unlikely that you could find a perfectly matched module to transplant into a pack. (@wk057 has tried to make transplants work, and they just don't work long term. @Recell, that also does Model S pack repairs/replacements (with a good warranty), agrees that you can't snip a cell or replace a module and get a long term fix.)

I have seen Gruber Motors, the company that burns vehicles (maybe when things get tough?), and Rich Rebuilds say that you can replace modules. But the vehicle that Rich Rebuilds replaced a module in for a YouTuber failed again shortly after. (It shut down when there was still ~50 miles of range left.) I haven't seen anyone that got a Gruber Motor repair ever report back in after they said they had the repair done. (Though wk057 has said that he has had to replace packs that Gruber Motors "fixed".)
 
Replying to a really old post here, but this seems really low. Is this due to battery degradation or is your Wh/mi higher than you expected? I get 290-300 miles on a full charge with my MYP, averaging 272 Wh/mi over the last 5000 miles.
That would be shockingly high for highway driving. Abrp estimates even lower for me by default. I get close to your numbers in more city driving in fair weather. My lifetime average is around 270 wh/mile if I recall correctly.

I do have ~5% degradation.
 
Replying to a really old post here, but this seems really low. Is this due to battery degradation or is your Wh/mi higher than you expected? I get 290-300 miles on a full charge with my MYP, averaging 272 Wh/mi over the last 5000 miles.
272 wh/mi on a MYP seems pretty low. On my M3P I'm averaging about 320 wh/mi. Sure I don't exactly drive slow.. but I also didn't buy a performance model to drive slow.
 
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What ? you mean quoting Munroe ? is perpetuating a myth ? Lol... I needed that....
If Munro is quoting that, then they missed the last 4 months of Model Y news. Hard to believe they wouldn’t be in the know having been at all of the factory shindigs and getting an up close look at everything we have seen pictures of, including the pack with 2 rows of cells missing.

I apologize if you were just quoting them. Thought you were one of the “it’s going to be unlockable in the future” types.

I hope Munro is playing this up so they can be “surprised” when it is only 680 cells total.