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Model Y P vs Rivian R1S

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Personally I prefer the R1S in virtually every way over the Model Y P, except for lack of charging infrastructure, which is a big deal. We don't travel much but superchargers are a necessity when you do. The larger size (but still garage-able, unlike the colossal hummer or F150) is a benefit for us.

I have a reservation in on a R1S. I don't think Rivian has ever raised their product prices, so it's yet to be seen if they'll honor your price when you ordered even if their pricing goes up. I have a hard time seeing how they deliver this product at only $10k more than the model Y P when it has so much more inherent production cost (50% bigger battery, twice the motors, air suspension, etc). If they honor reservation pricing, could even be a flipping opportunity when they deliver in ~2 years (and I have no doubt they eventually will).
 
If the new EV incentives pass and the $69,000 SUV cap is included, doesn’t that change a lot of the economics and purchase finances?

Suddenly the Model Y is $8,000 less and the Rivian $8,000 more.
Absolutely, that changes things, the r1s isn't as compelling.
R1s would be a better value if the other one passes ($80k) for suv, or nothing gets passed (current rivian would qualify for 7.5k tax credit)
 
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Absolutely, that changes things, the r1s isn't as compelling.
R1s would be a better value if the other one passes ($80k) for suv, or nothing gets passed (current rivian would qualify for 7.5k tax credit)
I can’t help but think it would be immensely frustrating to have a low-reservation number R1T on order and watching the deadline for eligibility for the incentive slowly creeping up along with the potential for a big price increase. While the base truck isn’t over the limit, I expect founders edition plus just a few options gets you over the 80k limit Quickly.
 
some things would be an easy fix and they should be able to accommodate, let's say you want upgraded rims, roof racks, or whatever physical options, can do that paperwork after the purchase to keep it under $80k. Not sure how they're going to handle if it's an upgraded color, lol
 
For me it's an "and" vs. an "or". The Model Y is here and now and real, can do a ton of things really well, but can't truly replace the utility of my Range Rover Sport. I love the utility of the Rivian, but it is almost vaporware right now.
If the new EV incentives pass and the $69,000 SUV cap is included, doesn’t that change a lot of the economics and purchase finances?

Suddenly the Model Y is $8,000 less and the Rivian $8,000 more.
It’s $80,000 cap, unless some new news came out today?
 
So I was planning to get a Model Y Performance for my wife, then I went down the rabbit hole of looking into Rivian R1S. Now I am conflicted.. The reviews of the R1T are very good so far

Model Y Performance
  • Smaller / easier to park / less storage
  • runs 11's in the 1/4
  • More efficient than Rivian
  • Supercharger network
  • 303 mi Range
  • $64.990 ($74,990 w/ FSD)
  • 3,500lb towing - but I don't plan to tow anything heavier than that
  • Styling very close to my Model 3 - I'm not excited to have twin cars
  • Tesla FSD will be WAY better
  • Delivery time in months

Rivian R1S
  • Larger / harder to park / more storage
  • Slightly quicker 0-60 and 1/4mile than MYP based on motor trend article
  • Terrible efficiency
  • Fast charging network is terrible and $$$
  • 316 mi range (edmunds "real world test" showed 317, thats great)
  • $77,300 - $7,500 tax credit = $69,800 (with the upgraded wheels)
  • 7 seat option is FREE upgrade
  • 11,000lbs towing - overkill for me but nice
  • 4 motors - very cool!
  • Interior quality getting rave reviews and looks nice too
  • Risk of issues as Rivian goes through learning curve (service, quality, etc...)
  • Delivery time 1 year+


This comparison was way closer than I thought it would be, I don't need the extra off road or towing capability, but I am most surprised by how close the prices are. I am leaning towards the Rivian. I am extremely impressed with what they have done.

Please help convince me one way or the other...


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The real world range is pointless if you’re also considering the towing and hauling variables. Just wanted to point that out.
 
The Rivian R1S is more of a competitor in the full size SUV market, not the compact SUV. So it should be compared to the Model X, not Y. Now saying that, I would no doubt choose the Rivian over the X if I were shopping for a full size, 3 row SUV. The Rivian starts at ~$35k less than the X. You could load the Rivian up with everything, including a roof top tent and still be $20k less than the X.
I understand you don't get the falcon wing doors and Super Charger network, but saving $35K is a very compelling reason to give those up.
 
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The Rivian R1S is more of a competitor in the full size SUV market, not the compact SUV. So it should be compared to the Model X, not Y. Now saying that, I would no doubt choose the Rivian over the X if I were shopping for a full size, 3 row SUV. The Rivian starts at ~$35k less than the X. You could load the Rivian up with everything, including a roof top tent and still be $20k less than the X.
I understand you don't get the falcon wing doors and Super Charger network, but saving $35K is a very compelling reason to give those up.

This exactly...Unless the Model X price comes down, the R1S seems like the clear choice. Especially if Tesla opens up the Supercharger network. This obviously assumes that the R1S turns out as great as some of the early reviews suggest and they are able to mass produce them. Lack of service centers near me is a concern though as it is with getting a Tesla.
 
This exactly...Unless the Model X price comes down, the R1S seems like the clear choice. Especially if Tesla opens up the Supercharger network. This obviously assumes that the R1S turns out as great as some of the early reviews suggest and they are able to mass produce them. Lack of service centers near me is a concern though as it is with getting a Tesla.
If the R1S pans out, I can't see how the Model X could still compete in the same class at $105K. Tesla would have to drastically cut the price as it doesn't offer anything superior enough to justify the price difference. It seems like a lose-lose for Tesla with this. If they lower the price to stay competitive with the R1S, they will piss off all of the owners who paid $105K+. If they don't lower the price, they won't be selling many Xs.


Falcon wing doors are not an advantage to the X...I would much rather not have them on it. And the yoke is a major downside as well.
I agree, the falcon wing doors are overly engineered and just add unnecessary failure points to the car. The yoke shouldn't be mandatory on a family car, let alone a full size SUV.
 
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The Rivian R1S is more of a competitor in the full size SUV market, not the compact SUV. So it should be compared to the Model X, not Y. Now saying that, I would no doubt choose the Rivian over the X if I were shopping for a full size, 3 row SUV. The Rivian starts at ~$35k less than the X. You could load the Rivian up with everything, including a roof top tent and still be $20k less than the X.
I understand you don't get the falcon wing doors and Super Charger network, but saving $35K is a very compelling reason to give those up.
And not be able travel too far. Great choice.
 
When is that killer SUV coming? Exactly. No one really knows.

Right, I have an R1S pre-order I highly doubt it would be available to me until 2024 at the earliest, assuming I don't cancel the order by then. Also not sure I would want it unless Tesla opens up the Supercharger network or the public charging dramatically improves by then. Plus by 2024+, the Model X price could be significantly lower than it is now which would sway me back to the Model X.
 
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And not be able travel too far. Great choice.
Ahhh...Teslas biggest fanboy has made an appearance @WhiteWi.

The Rivian is EPA estimated at 316 miles while the X, with 7 seats is rated at 347 miles. Is paying more than $1,000 per EPA estimated mile worth buying the X for? Only you can make that decision.

The R1S has estimated deliveries in January 2022. The Model X is November 2022. Both are estimated, so as usual they can change.

I'm not saying the X is a bad vehicle and I'm not saying the R1S is a great vehicle. But if you have comparable vehicles in the same class, one is $35K more than the other. It's fair to say that the one that costs $35K better be a hell of a lot better or it won't sell as well.

Oh yeah, I forgot the R1S has quad motors for the $35K less too.

True EV fans should embrace competition, it will just push Tesla to be better and bring their prices down. I'm not sure why any consumer would hate that.