Model Y Perf or BMW X3M?

WiseOwl · Mar 22, 2021

Hi There

I had owned 3 BMW 3 series sedan in succession between 2001 and 2019. When I compared a Tesla 3 to a new BMW 3 series, I discovered that the Tesla was safer, faster acceleration, and more economical as we had solar power and our country has free fast charging stations, similar to USA. Those were the three most important factors when I am looking for a new car. So it was a no brainer. We cannot buy a Tesla Y yet, so you have more choice.

jjrandorin · Mar 22, 2021

So, I likely should read this entire thread before responding....

With that being said, my and my wifes current vehicles are VERY close to the ones the OP is considering, so I feel I have a fairly good perspective on this.

My own vehicle is a model 3 performance (2018 not a model Y performance, but very close). My wifes current vehicle is a 2019 X3 M40 (not an X3 M but very close). As a "BMW family" for more than 15 years, with my wife and I driving only leased BMWs during that time, I am very familiar with BMWs.

As someone who bought my model 3 performance at the end of 2018 I have 2 years in that vehicle.

My wifes BMW we ordered (as we did our last 3 each BMWs) and it has almost every option. She loves that vehicle. Its very nice inside, very solid, nice door thunk when you close the doors, and feels like a proper "mass market luxury" vehicle. I say "mass market luxury" as in BMW X3s, 3/4 series, Similar Audis, Similar Mercedes. She loves that car, and I used to like driving it too until I got my model 3 performance. Her car is fast. Not model 3P fast, but its very fast for a midsize SUV. It has adaptable suspension, etc.

I only drive her car when I need to, now. I like driving my model 3P much (much much) better. Its not a luxury car though, not even close. Thats fine, I dont mind that. its "good enough" in the quality department. Certainly not luxury (not close to the X3 we ordered at all), but not nearly as bad as you read here on TMC while will have everyone feeling like the car is about to fall apart before you drive it home.

Even though the "luxury" is clearly lacking in the model 3p, the driving experience is certainly not. I dont think the Y drives quite as good as the 3, just like an X3 doesnt drive as good as an M3 (the real one, the one you are talking about from BMW). I happen to think that the model 3P drives better than an M3, once you get past the lack of engine sound.

Now that I have had a model 3P for a couple years, I dont see how I could go back to any ICE vehicle as a daily driver. My wifes X3 lease is up the beginning of next year, and we need to decide what to do. She loves this car, so we may buy it off lease, even though thats generally a bad idea for BMWs. I was hoping that by that time, BMW would have something comparable (or someone else would) but no one is yet anywhere near close to teslas combination of battery efficiency and driving experience.

One final thing. OP, you are comparing the wrong two cars. You should be comparing the Model Y to an X4 because thats a much closer comparison to body shape, etc... so you should be looking at an X4M, not an X3M as comparable vehicles. My wife hates the "bubble look" of "lifted cars" like the model Y or the X4/X6, so I am kind of stuck until there are SUV shaped vehicles she likes, that are full electric, from a company I dont mind owning an EV from. Right now thats Tesla... and..... /shrug..

lol

Douyon1 · Mar 22, 2021

I'm a 2020 model X performance owner. I like you loved my ice cars, especially my AMG Mercedes, and Bentley. I can honestly say I love the X. It is a fun car to drive handles great, and beats the two aforementioned vehicles off the line all day.
I look forward to the updates, as in my experience they keep getting better and better, making the car that much more fun to drive.
And winter driving and handling in the snow is amazing, even with stock conti tires.
I hope Bentley is paying attention, as I would like to purchase a electric version. I considered the Porsche Tycan, and was hyped about getting one. I figured I would give the X to my wife and get the Turbo S Tycan. Well that changed after owning the X. I went back to Porshe, test drove the Tycan again. (love the ride, and speed) very similar to Tesla with regard to regenerative breaking and instant speed. Very stable in turns. Once your past that it feels like a boring ice car with regard to the interior. It's nice and modern, but the porshe interior and screens and dash are boaring.
The doors don't open when I approach the vehicle, and when I press the brake, the door did not auto-close. I also can not open and close the passenger and rear doors from the driver's seat with a touch of a button.
It's the little things that impress me, I guess.

Go for the EV. YOU WILL NOT BE SORRY.

WiseOwl · Mar 22, 2021

Well what do want in a car ? Everyone is different. We were looking at safety, economy, and fast acceleration for emergency overtaking vehicles.

We had owned 3 BMW 3 series cars in a row, so when we were ready to buy a new one, we looked at a new BMW 320 and a Tesla 3 which was similar in price here.

We thought that the Tesla 3 was faster in acceleration, safer in collisions, and more economical, as we had solar power,and our country had free fast charging for EVs in all major cities. So it won all three conditions that we were looking for. We called it a No Brainer.

Since we had owned the Tesla for 18 months now, there has been no servicing, costs very little to run, and since Tesla is the only car that has updates without calling into a service center, we are more than pleased. People are all going to have to buy an EV within the next few years so it’s also another NO Brainer to buy one now.

Just to finish, the CEO of the Audi Motor company has publicly stated that Tesla is 2 years ahead of everyone in EV technology. Enough said, and another No Brainer.

Douyon1 · Mar 22, 2021

I agree, I miss carplay as well and hope that apple and Tesla learn how to play nice one day.
As for navigation, If tesla could integrate with Waze, their nav system would be great. I run Waze on my phone speaker while using the tesla nav, which is good, but it could be better if it were social.

Catbiscuits · Mar 22, 2021

I have a 2017 Model S 70D that replaced my 2011 BMW 335xi with Dinan Stage 2 and M Sport package as well as a 2020 Model Y AWD long-range with performance boost that replaces my wife's 2006 530xi. The Teslas are far superior vehicles.

The downside, as stated, is some of the interior fittings. Some, but not all. No question that the steering wheel and seats were nicer in the BMWs than in the Teslas, but the dash in the BMWs is fugly. I hated the round bumpouts that protruded from the dash. I hated the stupid screens and their brain-damaged interfaces. Teslas is a technology company and it gets the screen-based interface right, or if not right, at least a lot better. I still get a kick out of being able to easily navigate to where I want go via Google Maps.

Both Teslas ride much better than either of my BMWs. No more BMW explosions! God I hated those. Mind you, the Model S has an air suspension (like heaven compared to the BMWs) and I don't have the performance rims on the Y and those would likely made the ride worse. The ride on the Model Y is still firm, but better than either of our BMWs. The Model Y has better steering than any other car I've owned except maybe one of our old Saab 900s (one had terrible, scary steering, one was tight and fun). The BMWs were always disappointing in that regard, ultimate driving machine my ass.

We have full self-driving on both. When I want to have fun, I have fun. I won't floor either car with any other family members in it since they get pissed. The rest of the time, I can use self-driving on the highway, which is super restful.

One big difference between an X3/X5 and a Model Y is that the Y has a low center of gravity due to the batteries being at the bottom of the chassis. The X series can do aggressive maneuvers, but you can feel the computer strain to meet them (I've rented both for weeks at a time). Dan Neil called the X5 a "Formula 1 forklift." The Y is the first SUV I've ever driven that feels good to drive. Neil has a glowing—and accurate—review in the WSJ from last year about it's driveability.

I live in an area that, five years ago, was dominated by BMWs. Now it's dominated by Teslas. I talked to a friend who went through the same journey as me (in his case an X1 to a Model 3) and he agreed that he's much happier.

Oh! I've had one service request in a year of owning both cars, a stuck tailgate on the Model S. I literally have had nothing to do to the cars otherwise, no oil, no windshield wiper fluid (what??), no antifreeze, nothing. I've had a little bodywork, but that's only because of dumb issues with our garage doors hitting parked cars (it has been fixed and won't happen again) and a hitch-mounted trailer rack we didn't extend far enough, but nothing that could be blamed on the cars.

Eric9610 · Mar 22, 2021

The buying experience alone is worth going with Tesla. Everything else is just added value! The software updates are so amazing and as others have stated it keeps making the car feel new!

I have owned at least 1 of every German luxury / performance brand and will always own a Tesla for daily driving.

tom.leisgang · Mar 22, 2021

Well, l have 2 P-cars and my modelY perf acceleration is unbelievable. The induction motor is instantaneous torque. Mine came with Pirelli P-zero’s as well so handling is pretty fair. It’s a nice ride.

PederM3 · Mar 22, 2021

I am a Model 3 owner. Similar to the Y but lower and sportier. Had a highly modded and tuned BmW 535i before with over 500 hp. What people here don’t mention much is the driving dynamics of Teslas. The computer reads wheel traction to 4 corners and controls torque in milliseconds. Means insane road holding with torque vectoring. It’s impossible to cause slides or lose grip. It’s how the car accelerates so fast. Makes it so safe to drive too. Absolute magic.

Scottlerner · Mar 22, 2021

I have had a 3 and two 5s over my 40 years of driving; still have two of them with over 60 years and 600,000 miles combined. Did anyone mention the exorbitant BMW repair costs?

However great BMWs were, they are now dinosaurs. The gas engine versions anyway.

The Tesla EV has redefined the driving experience. There are new skills to adopt, and old habits to lose, but these cars are the future of driving. I got a Y since it’s easier for this old guy to get in and out of, but I thought each model was a kick to drive. All the fun of an M5 with no gas bills and no regular maintenance costs. What’s not to love?

drkkalra · Mar 22, 2021

Please consider ride quality. MY sucks. If that doesn’t matter to you (short commute) or prefer stiff ride, then MY is a great car

osiso · Mar 22, 2021

Looking at the total cost of ownership calculator at keemut, for your (assuming you're in NJ and drive around 15,000 miles), the Y is hands down a better choice of vehicle.

ThePlankeEye · Mar 22, 2021

I see you are a “black and white” type of person. The OP has a long history with the BMW M3. They are moving away from the M3 because of the hideous beaver grill (who blames them for that...wow). The OP obviously loves a sedan. The Giulia QV should be considered as an alternative path.

Ugene · Mar 22, 2021

So, what story are you going to tell tomorrow? You got another BMW? Or you ordered your car from your phone and they delivered it to your house in a week or two? ;-)

I am one valuing driving experience and being able to drive the way I want without attracting attention. I got a grey Model 3 Performance and it works fairly well. I put an aftermarket suspension and now it handles more like a Porche than a BMW, or an Audi S4 I still have. I also value that I can put my road bike in the back or my skis and still enjoy my drive to a ski resort. I do take multi-day road trips to the mountains, the coast, the wine country in WA and OR. I love driving a good handling car on those side roads.

Let me add some points that I hope you'll find complementary to what others wrote.

The track mode in Model 3 Performance can be very entertaining as you can manually change front-rear torque and turn down the stability control gradually. I use 70% rear 30% front for max efficiency when playing.

I gave rides to a few folks. Whatever they heard about the interior or quality issues they forgot as soon as we started moving. A couple of them came back home and ordered a Tesla. One of them didn't even care that the Tesla's entertainment unit and the main screen went dark and rebooted during the drive to the airport.

My drive to a ski resort and picking up my buddies on the way (they all vote for riding in the Tesla even though they own Audis - a Q5 and roughly as fast tuned S4 as the Tesla is) is 180 miles roundtrip. That uses 80-85% of the battery. I consider this a max range given that I need some extra electrons in case I am stuck in a wintery traffic for a few hours. I can go somewhat further in the summer when there are no big elevation changes but whatever they tell you about the range ... is going to be a learning experience.

I got a popular aftermarket sports suspension kit (coilovers) for ~$2.5K + $1K installation and tuning. To tell you the truth, to get it to handle decently, I needed to crank it to be too stiff, especially for people riding on the back seat. There are lots of people here that will tell you that these coilovers are a win-win but I get a feeling they either have an agenda or don't know better. Thankfully, my wife is not spoiled by soft suspensions. Nowadays, there are more choices for aftermarket suspensions; maybe if I dropped $5K+ ...

Over the air updates are super cool. Though, it looks like Tesla, like other companies, employs some genius engineers and some ... the opposite of genius. Aside from long trips I use the autopilot less than in the beginning (end of 2018). Some updates (I recall after trying to recognize stationary objects on the road) added what folks call phantom braking. At some point the car stopped changing lanes on autopilot as confidently and started aborting lane changes right and left; and it lasted for a long while, not till the next update. Recently the autopilot stopped being useful in a slow stop and go traffic as the car started constantly oscillating right and left within the lane. WTF!!!

You think you are getting a fast car getting a Performance? At slow to medium speeds - Yes. Fast ICE cars cars are better at highway passing and high speed maneuvers .. given you keep them in sport or downshift manually in time. Now if your battery getting to half charge the car will not feel as fast. It will not be really better than non-performance AWD. And when your battery dips below 20% your reflexes on how fast you can speed up will need considerable adjustment. And those sporty ICEs are still as much fun with a nearly empty gas tank.

On the other hand, my sporty ICE with a V8 has to wait until I push it harder for 5-10 minutes until the engine is at good temperature. And the Tesla is ready to go max speed right out of the garage. And without my neighbors turning their heads and looking with suspicion because the V8 spooled to 3K RPMs.

So, it is not black and white but I do still like my choice after almost 2 1/2 years. YMMV.

RaezoR · Mar 23, 2021

How much will servicing be on the BMW? Tesla doesn't have servicing any more (except coolant / brakes after 6 & 2 years) I saved 1.000's of $$$ with my M3P

Buttybach · Mar 23, 2021

I run a 12 yr old Mercedes alongside my Tesla and agree with points made above about realizing how filling up with Diesel is now a messsy annoyance compared with plugging in at home every three or four nights. Same with long journey fill ups - so much nicer to plug your car in and then go for a coffee then simply return, unplug and drive off (in case you do not know the billing is done automatically to your credit card). Much nicer than going to the pumps, wait with nozzle in hand for 5 mins and then go and pay the cashier.

In truth build quality is acceptable in most new cars these days, Tesla included. It hardly matters in a 4 yrs time frame but I am yet to see if the Tesla will hold up anything like as well as the Merc over ten plus yrs - I somehow doubt it.

Having had BMWs, a Porsche and Mercedes I know from multiple bad experiences that their service intervals and dealers are out to fleece you. I cannot stanbd their arrogance either. Amazing how often your brakes and discs need replacing - unless you ask for them to leave the old parts in the car. Porsche once charged me £600 for a service but when I went to the car the battery was dead and it wouldn't start. Tesla , so far, seem much more honest. I have caught BMW's local dealer out in blatant lies on two occasions - both with severe safety implications.

So IMHO and on my evidence Tesla is better on servicing and convenience. The Mechanics and car bodies will last longer than most people need. You should buy a BMW only if you like using your micrometer to check the panel gaps each week.

D0cR0berts · Mar 23, 2021

I went from a 2015 328i (not M anything) which I loved (bought the car after the lease). I loved the way it handled, power delivery, quick steering, looks, etc. But I'd had BMWs since about 2008 (my first was an E46) and I was looking for a change. Mercedes? Maybe. Audi? Probably not. I then test drove a MYLR and the acceleration was incredible and it left quite an impression. So much instant power, and honestly, the tightness of the suspension and steering feel reminded me a lot of my BMWs. I'm about a month into owning my own MYLR and I love it.

Yes, the ride is firm (even firmer than a BMW but not by much), The purchase process and service are more 'startup-y'...you're definitely not dealing with 20+ year veterans of the same BMW dealership who've sold your entire family cars, but they're friendly, efficient and so-far pretty honest and their love of these cars and the company mission is obvious.

Example story of what I mean:

When I ordered my MYLR, i also ordered a charger for my garage. After ordering online, I realized I mistakenly ordered the 8ft cable rather than the 18ft cable version. I called the phone numbers, my purchase advisor, sent emails to support trying to get my order changed to an 18' one. After far too long, I finally got in touch with someone in sales and their advice was: "Honestly, I know this doesn't sound great but your best option is to order the 18' and then return the 8' when you get it. Ordering and returns work well, but changing an order seems to be really difficult." Ahhhh okaaaaay....kinda lame, but okay....and he was right! They both arrived in 3-4 days and doing a return was very easy and painless. Getting a service appointment for a minor thing was similarly simple and painless.

Point is, tons of passion and things work out- but no one is your best friend guiding you through any purchase or (any of the many expensive service) processes like at BMW.

bwestlak · Mar 23, 2021

I would just say that if you buy any TESLA you, like 95% of TESLA owners, will never go back to a BMW. Can the same be said about BMW?

roseng · Mar 23, 2021

I've been driving BMWs since the 70s. I started 2020 with 3 BMWs, now down to one (my E64 650i) and before long it will be zero.

Wife's 2019 E530 Lemon Law after 9 months, 30 days in the shop with constant serious electronics and software issues. Daughters E83 X3 Trans going at 140k miles, and my pretty boat anchor the 650i cabrio. I love the E series body but it is feeling long in the tooth.

I'm fed up with the cost and constant needing something fixed or maintained. it's like a treadmill.

I bought a Tesla Model 3 just 1 year ago for my wife. She put 19k mile on it the first year. They are far from a perfect car company but for me Zero issues the first year. Also zero gas cost, zero stops to fill up and our electric rates drop with an EV ownership so literally no cost to run the car. Gas here in SoCal is about $4.00/gal. so that is a big deal. Very seriously looking at the Model Y for myself.

The speed and feel are very different than BMW, both good and bad, but I like it more every day. Teslas have issues, but IMHO if you go the EV route and Tesla you'll wonder why you didn't do it sooner.

GeorgeC1 · Mar 23, 2021

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