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Model Y Standard Range EPA Doc & Battery Energy (54.8kWh)

AlanSubie4Life

Efficiency Obsessed Member
Oct 22, 2018
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San Diego
FWIW, the EPA doc for the 2021 Model Y SR is now available. (Ironically, the vehicle is not?)

(Should have put 2021 in the title of this thread though I guess so far there is only one model year of Y SR...maybe mods can add?)

It shows 54.8kWh available in their full discharge test. So I'd expect perhaps 53.5kWh "Full Pack When New" value in SMT (there's always a scaling factor).

These are probably 2170L cells, but it's not 100% clear. Based on the 2019 Model 3 SR, they might not have to be.

For reference:

2019 Model 3 SR+: 54.5kWh (~52.5kWh FPWN (???) )
2020 Model 3 SR+: 52.6kWh (~52.5kWh FPWN I think)
2021 Model 3 SR+: 54.7kWh (~53.5kWh FPWN I think)


If a YSR owner takes a picture of the battery label, it's probably possible to piece it together circumstantially and determine whether it has the 2170L cells. (Battery Label Procedure for Model 3)

It's possible that information is already known, too. Haven't been following it.
 

AlanSubie4Life

Efficiency Obsessed Member
Oct 22, 2018
9,314
11,146
San Diego
Sorry. This was supposed to be in the Model Y Battery & Charging area...I guess I clicked "back" before posting. Maybe it could be moved there.
 

Mrbrock

Member
Mar 26, 2020
582
310
Napa, CA
I noticed the ranges were changed from EPA (est) to EPA(*) for the SR Y and SR+ 3. Meaning they are testing to EPA standards whereas before it was just estimated based on some in house voodoo. Thanks for the info!

We are having a SR Y delivered next week so I will let you know about the battery situation.
 
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mark95476

Member
Jun 21, 2020
916
484
Bay Area CA
Pop the hood, pull the trim to the 12V battery and look for this highlighted label. My early LR had "74 kWh" on it.

MY_battery_label.jpg


I just got a standard what label do i check?
 

AlanSubie4Life

Efficiency Obsessed Member
Oct 22, 2018
9,314
11,146
San Diego
Pop the hood, pull the trim to the 12V battery and look for this highlighted label. My early LR had "74 kWh" on it.

View attachment 645133

This is not correct. Follow the linked procedure (in first post) above if you want the relevant label. It may not be definitive but easier (no disassembly) and more informative probably than this label.
 
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Mrbrock

Member
Mar 26, 2020
582
310
Napa, CA
FWIW, the EPA doc for the 2021 Model Y SR is now available. (Ironically, the vehicle is not?)

(Should have put 2021 in the title of this thread though I guess so far there is only one model year of Y SR...maybe mods can add?)

It shows 54.8kWh available in their full discharge test. So I'd expect perhaps 53.5kWh "Full Pack When New" value in SMT (there's always a scaling factor).

These are probably 2170L cells, but it's not 100% clear. Based on the 2019 Model 3 SR, they might not have to be.

For reference:

2019 Model 3 SR+: 54.5kWh (~52.5kWh FPWN (???) )
2020 Model 3 SR+: 52.6kWh (~52.5kWh FPWN I think)
2021 Model 3 SR+: 54.7kWh (~53.5kWh FPWN I think)


If a YSR owner takes a picture of the battery label, it's probably possible to piece it together circumstantially and determine whether it has the 2170L cells. (Battery Label Procedure for Model 3)

It's possible that information is already known, too. Haven't been following it.
A262E3CB-3716-4EE2-A99E-1F1392702FC2.jpeg

Anything else? Just had our SR Y delivered last night. Build date 03/31/21.
 

AlanSubie4Life

Efficiency Obsessed Member
Oct 22, 2018
9,314
11,146
San Diego
View attachment 650545
Anything else? Just had our SR Y delivered last night. Build date 03/31/21.
Not much to be determined. Looks like a -T pack rather than -M (or -P). Type TC. Suggests that it may well be the same pack and cells as prior generations. But interpretation of the labels is hard. Here is a sample from (apparently) 2020 Model 3 SR+:
ACEFB627-3C1C-4E24-AE96-BE5AF6A17F1B.jpeg


I don’t see anything that jumps out and says, yes, for sure, those are 2170L cells. So they may have just expanded the range of capacity used on the old cells to go from 52.5 to 53.5kWh. No idea.
 

Mrbrock

Member
Mar 26, 2020
582
310
Napa, CA
Not much to be determined. Looks like a -T pack rather than -M. Type TC. Suggests that it may well be the same pack and cells as prior generations. But interpretation of the labels is hard. Here is a sample from (apparently) 2020 Model 3 SR+:
Well I’ve got a 2020 M3 SR+ so i can give you a definitive picture if there is some doubt to which car the above picture came from.
 

AlanSubie4Life

Efficiency Obsessed Member
Oct 22, 2018
9,314
11,146
San Diego
Well I’ve got a 2020 M3 SR+ so i can give you a definitive picture if there is some doubt to which car the above picture came from.
Would be interesting to compare. Picture is from a eBay listing so there is some small doubt. Clarified above we have seen -M and -P packs (at least) previously. This rev code usually signifies only minor tweaks.
 
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AlanSubie4Life

Efficiency Obsessed Member
Oct 22, 2018
9,314
11,146
San Diego
View attachment 650594
Style RC vs TC on the Y and -M.
Yeah I would say this is inconclusive but if I were forced to guess I would say the cells are the same (or at least very similar nominal capacity) as they’ve always been (2170). But you do have 53.5kWh rather than 52.5kWh available (you can see this in the car of course on the energy screen using the standard method), when new (for the Model Y, as compared to the 2020 Model 3).
 
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AlanSubie4Life

Efficiency Obsessed Member
Oct 22, 2018
9,314
11,146
San Diego
Just to explain the discrepancy vs. the thread title, EPA results nearly always show in excess of what ends up being the nominal max capacity from Energy Consumption calculations. (We need the energy screen picture to confirm that - can’t remember whether that has already been done for Model Y SR.)
 
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AlanSubie4Life

Efficiency Obsessed Member
Oct 22, 2018
9,314
11,146
San Diego
View attachment 650545
Anything else? Just had our SR Y delivered last night. Build date 03/31/21.
You could grab the info from the Energy Screen for capacity: (Capacity = Projected Range*Recent Avg Efficiency / SoC %, taken at a high SoC).

From France, @FredMt, who tracks this, has the following post which suggests your Model Y SR maybe has 2170L cells: Part number and description in French documents

But I'm not sure! Note the part number is not the same (off by one number!), and that's a key difference, obviously. 1104428 vs. 1104429.

It does make sense it would have the 2170L cells, though, as, taking a step back, it would be very hard to get to these energy levels - assuming it is 53.5kWh when full - without a change to the pack chemistry (they don't have any spare capacity on the top or bottom end of the range on the old Model 3 SR+ packs, as far as we can tell). There's a little more discussion recently in the above linked thread.

I don't follow the SR Model Y closely, so I don't know what its constant is, or what the Energy Screen suggests your current capacity is (Projected Range*Recent Avg Efficiency / SoC %, taken at a high SoC). If this comes out at 52.5kWh, then probably the old cells. If 53.5kWh like the new Model 3 SR+, then probably 2170L. See the first post in this thread for the comparison over time.

The ambiguity arises from the EPA results for 2019 Model 3 SR+, 2021 Model 3 SR+, and 2021 Model Y SR, which get 54.5kWh, 54.7kWh, and 54.8kWh, respectively, in EPA tests. And we're reasonably sure the 2021 Model 3 SR+ has the new cells (though maybe the test article did not???).
 
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Mrbrock

Member
Mar 26, 2020
582
310
Napa, CA
You could grab the info from the Energy Screen for capacity: (Capacity = Projected Range*Recent Avg Efficiency / SoC %, taken at a high SoC).

From France, @FredMt, who tracks this, has the following post which suggests your Model Y SR maybe has 2170L cells: Part number and description in French documents

But I'm not sure! Note the part number is not the same (off by one number!), and that's a key difference, obviously. 1104428 vs. 1104429.

It does make sense it would have the 2170L cells, though, as, taking a step back, it would be very hard to get to these energy levels - assuming it is 53.5kWh when full - without a change to the pack chemistry (they don't have any spare capacity on the top or bottom end of the range on the old Model 3 SR+ packs, as far as we can tell). There's a little more discussion recently in the above linked thread.

I don't follow the SR Model Y closely, so I don't know what its constant is, or what the Energy Screen suggests your current capacity is (Projected Range*Recent Avg Efficiency / SoC %, taken at a high SoC). If this comes out at 52.5kWh, then probably the old cells. If 53.5kWh like the new Model 3 SR+, then probably 2170L. See the first post in this thread for the comparison over time.

The ambiguity arises from the EPA results for 2019 Model 3 SR+, 2021 Model 3 SR+, and 2021 Model Y SR, which get 54.5kWh, 54.7kWh, and 54.8kWh, respectively, in EPA tests. And we're reasonably sure the 2021 Model 3 SR+ has the new cells (though maybe the test article did not???).
923988DB-72E5-4E55-8770-C73C91812062.jpeg
25210D99-6C77-45FB-9B27-CDB4B05D5F8C.jpeg

53,369Wh
 
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AlanSubie4Life

Efficiency Obsessed Member
Oct 22, 2018
9,314
11,146
San Diego

Probably 53.5kWh (works out to 53.4kWh) but hard to tell at that low SOC. If you happen to get a chance to do it above 80% (the higher the better but no need for 100%) just post it here just to confirm.

If the 53.5kWh holds, then these are probably 2170L cells (and they may actually have additional capacity still not used- you’d have to see cell voltage at 0% and 100% for that). Details. Maybe down the road they’ll add a couple % to your usable capacity, if so. Hard to say.
 
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Mrbrock

Member
Mar 26, 2020
582
310
Napa, CA
Sorry for being a little dense (like the 2170L) and late to the party if this has been discussed before but the range increases for 2021 are likely due to the switch to the 5% more energy dense 2170L cells? 250 + 5% = 262.5 for the SR+? That would mean a SR Y if made with the old cells (2170C?) would have had a 232 mile range? I can see Elon saying 230 is too short. But 244 is higher than the original SR+ range of 240 so that is why we get this limited unicorn of sorts. Perfect for a city/suburban family hauler.
 
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