Model Y vs Mustang Mach E

[SO16]

That is encouraging to hear. No im not just negative but Im an engineer and everything can be made better. No point in a bunch of fanboys getting on here and saying how great everything is when clearly much needs to be improved to stay ahead of the big boys. I LOVE this car. I think its well built, awesome to look at, and basically a 5 seater Lambo Huracan up to about 120 mph except far easier to drive and far quicker from 1 speed to another. When I highlight a glaring issue (and the service center is a glaring issue to all but the diehard fanboys) its just intended to get Tesla to do better in that area. IT should be a simple fix for them. And believe me, Ford and the big boys will be vastly farther ahead in the service arena VERY soon. I realize they arent yet but I would expect them to exploit the poor service Tesla provides after the sale to build consumer confidence in their brand. Im dumbfounded as to why this is even a discussion. Service/Communication has to improve if Tesla has any chance of competing in a few years.

It’s quotes like this:

I guess I don’t get that and think that logic will be the demise of Tesla.

….that are ridiculous. It’s not “fanboism” that is the issue here. Of course every Tesla owner wants wonderful service for everyone and keep everyone happy. Just tired of the “if they don’t fix x, it will be the demise of Tesla!” Nonsense.

 

[Zorg]

I think the model is totally unrealistic. Yes its worked until now. And until now, who exactly was Tesla competing with ? Nobody, exactly. So you didnt have a choice You were forced to buy a car via the internet without much interaction with a real person. Then forced to wait with horrible communication. This is not ideal.

But I agree 1,000% with the "old" way of buying a car, going into the dealer, haggling, and then having those aholes slide in an $899 "undercoating" fee at the last minute. Plenty of ways to beat that system if you are smart : research the car, call them, and have them bring the car to you. Dont ever set foot in a dealership, its a time suck and they are angling for the mercy sale. They can drive you the car. Then send them on their way and communicate the offer via text message only. I dont even allow them to call me. When we arrive on a #, they then are forced to email over the final price sheet. This is where the "Car Care" fee as well as "admin fee" come out. Tell them to yank that sh!t and resend. Repeat as needed until the right car at right price arrives in your driveway, and sign the paperwork on your dining room table.

This is exactly how I have bought vehicles for the past 7 years and exactly how I bought my used 2020 MYP. And yes, those d!cks at Mall of GA Mini absolutely did try to weasel in a $899 car care fee. He told me ALL cars that come into their lot get undercoating and fabric treatment so he had to charge that. LOL. I told him to go F himself as the Tesla as an entirely plastic underbody shell for aero, and if he DID put any damn thing on the seats the deal was also off. There was a slight pause and boom, the $899 car care fee went away ...

So long as you're within driving distance from a Tesla showroom, I disagree (disclaimer, I live 10 miles from the factory). One can go to a showroom, drive the car and ask questions. When we got our X, they let us drive it overnight so that I could see if it fit in our garage. There was zero pressure, and the salesperson was knowledgeable and patient. Again, the only issue I see with Tesla now is the spotty communication, which is due to the fact they haven't hired enough people to cope with the demand volume.

 

[SO16]

ok I appreciate that view. But up until now who was Tesla actually competing with ? The curve goes uphill fast from here. I absolutely want Tesla to succeed but the experience is going to have to dramatically improve. Not sure why you dont get that. But we are on the same team, Im just picking apart flaws to improve the end product.

Ah ….another “the competition is coming”. I think this is year 13 now we have been hearing this.

it’s fine to pick apart flaws. We all agree Tesla has them. But can we stop with the “Tesla is doomed!”…Narrative?

oh…and watch the videos I posted about the MachE. Not all sunshine and rainbows there either.

 

[Dennisis]

ok I appreciate that view. But up until now who was Tesla actually competing with ? The curve goes uphill fast from here. I absolutely want Tesla to succeed but the experience is going to have to dramatically improve. Not sure why you dont get that. But we are on the same team, Im just picking apart flaws to improve the end product.

I do get that they need to improve service and stated so repeatedly. I came from luxury cars and don’t miss the whole service scam, believe me. And I work with engineers daily so frankly I’m surprised you didn’t read the available first hand reports of poor service and communication prior to purchase and weren’t prepared for the possibility - now you seem shocked. As you alluded to earlier, the evidence was posted repeatedly. Add yours to the list.

 

[SO16]

4 years ago, Tesla used to loan Tesla if your car was in service, or would rent you a car. That ended in late 2018, early 2019 if I remember correctly. My best guess is that it won't be coming back, because it probably isn't financially sustainable. The biggest issue with Tesla frankly is the communication. My observation is that everyone is new and that they can't keep up with demand. Elon apparently likes to run a lean operation. That's definitely an area where they will have to improve, because their products won't be way ahead of the pack forever (though the legacy manufacturers have a ways to go).

Last year I got a Tesla loaner. Seems to be hit or miss based on service location.

 

[mark95476]

No one is believing your BS.

It's been "the competition is coming" for the last decade...

ok I appreciate that view. But up until now who was Tesla actually competing with ? The curve goes uphill fast from here. I absolutely want Tesla to succeed but the experience is going to have to dramatically improve. Not sure why you dont get that. But we are on the same team, Im just picking apart flaws to improve the end product.

If it looks like a troll and sounds like a troll.... So much concern trolling and care-bearing.

Notice how trolls always repeat the same message-- It's been "service centers" for a while since it's so vague.

The big boys like Ford being ahead in service.... Let me guess, you've never owned a Ford, right?

That is encouraging to hear. No im not just negative but Im an engineer and everything can be made better. No point in a bunch of fanboys getting on here and saying how great everything is when clearly much needs to be improved to stay ahead of the big boys. I LOVE this car. I think its well built, awesome to look at, and basically a 5 seater Lambo Huracan up to about 120 mph except far easier to drive and far quicker from 1 speed to another. When I highlight a glaring issue (and the service center is a glaring issue to all but the diehard fanboys) its just intended to get Tesla to do better in that area. IT should be a simple fix for them. And believe me, Ford and the big boys will be vastly farther ahead in the service arena VERY soon. I realize they arent yet but I would expect them to exploit the poor service Tesla provides after the sale to build consumer confidence in their brand. Im dumbfounded as to why this is even a discussion. Service/Communication has to improve if Tesla has any chance of competing in a few years.

 

[WADan]

Ah ….another “the competition is coming”. I think this is year 13 now we have been hearing this.

it’s fine to pick apart flaws. We all agree Tesla has them. But can we stop with the “Tesla is doomed!”…Narrative?

oh…and watch the videos I posted about the MachE. Not all sunshine and rainbows there either.

Walmart was supposed to eat Amazon‘s lunch some 20 years ago. Hahaha.
The real competition for Tesla is not going to be the big boys, but another startup Rivian.

 

[cusetownusa]

I guess I don’t get that and think that logic will be the demise of Tesla. Ford and other large auto makers have dealerships on every corner. Yes it sounds like Right now these dealers are clueless how to service their new EV but that will quickly change. The infrastructure is there whereas for Tesla it isnt.

when my Durango r/t needed service I could call, usually take it in either same day or within 2 days, they would give me a bitchin loaner jeep rubicon and then call me back when it was ready. Yes the service office smelled like farts and dirty socks and I felt sorry for rhe 1 lady that had to work in that disgusting office with a bunch of fat guys all day. But the service experience was still far better than Tesla where I have to wait a month ? Then they give me a free 1 way uber ? Are u serous ? Just hope it doesn’t need fixing that often which doesn’t seem to be the case from this forum. Tesla better step it up here regarding service. People
Get very upset spending big $$ and not getting treated right after the sale.

I don’t have a tesla so I can’t comment on that but your dealership experience is nothing like what I have experienced in 25 years of car ownership. I have had to get my car serviced many times over the years and I never was given a loaner let alone a bitchen rubicon.

 

[PorthosJon]

Wow, this has veered off topic. But my comment here (having my wife who doesn't particularly like the Model 3, and would prefer the Bolt) is that she doesn't want to deal with stealerships either. They are a pretty worthless middle-grifter that doesn't really add any value to the sale. She almost scared a sales person to trading us off by telling him that she just wanted to to drive the car and see how it handled, if he made any sales pitches, she was going to leave. The guy stammered and then replied "of course I wouldn't do that". When we got back with the car she brought the key fob inside and the guy asked how she liked the car (Hyundai Ioniq), she told him what a piece of crap she thought it was. He actually had the stupidity to try to sell her on it anyway and just said "nope" and turned around and walked out.

Not to mention (for all those talking about having a convenient dealership) that if you look closely at Chevy and Ford's statements, not every dealer who sells an EV model can service an EV model (and definitely not every tech). Also the "bangin'" loaner will inevitably be an ICE vehicle, and I can say that as long as I schedule carefully at my SC, I can still get a loaner without an issue (not that I've been in there but once since pickup, and that was a 1 hour fix on a mis-aligned door that was clipping the other door and caused a small 2mm paint chip).

 

[a2t2]

Whoa settle down guys .. not intending to be a troll on this thread. Read what Im writing : I absolutely LOVE my 2020 MYP. Are we clear on that ? Im not sent here from some Ford Mach E forum lol. Settle down and pay attn.

Ive owned and dealt with service from Ford, GM, Dodge, Jeep and VW - all within the past several years. I buy and sell cars frequently. I love cars, esp awesome cars like my Tesla, so stop going on with the Im calling your baby ugly bs...

As a consumer coming from competing brands, Im telling you that the text-message-only-holyier-than-thou Tesla service model sucks. It wont win over many consumers who actually do have viable alternatives. Up till now, nobody had a viable alternative to Tesla. All that is changing. Do you get that or do you still just think Im hurling rocks ?

My used Tesla buying experience has nothing to do with Tesla. It is a reflection the legacy dealer buying experience. Im aware you CAN go into a Tesla showroom and you CAN drive the vehicles and talk to extremely informed non-greasy sales reps. I did that and I was impressed. I just didnt want to wait until 2022 and I found a really nice 2020 model.

My issue stems from the car I bought (used but under warranty) needing some minor issues addressed, and the general dicky attitude Ive received from my Service center in Alpharetta. Absolutely NO phone number to call (which they answer), text only via the app, they reply when they feel like it, service dates are a month out, and no loaner offered, just a 1 way uber. That is in stark contrast to when I owed the other makes listed above. All got me in almost immediately and provided decent loaners, sometimes EXCEPTIONAL loaners (GM gave me a $75K Silverado, Dodge/Jeep baller Rubicons). Would they do that if I had bought a $5K beater that was 15 yrs old ? No, I had bought $50K cars (about $20K LESS EXPENSIVE than Tesla). And I was treated correctly for that.

Please read this. The existing service mentality from Tesla had better change before Ford and the others get their sh1t together. The legacy makes all can improve service quick since they have the infrastructure in place already, Tesla does not. So pay attention, Im telling you this is a big deal when you are competing for shoppers that now DO have alternatives to Tesla. I hope nothing about this makes you think I dont love my Tesla, I just think for them to remain viable, they will need to improve in certain areas. Service is a no brainer, this should be simple for them to knock out of the park but they dont seem all that concerned. Which is concerning.

Also comparing what Tesla's success in what it HAS done to what Tesla WILL HAVE TO DO to remain successful are VERY different discussions. They had no competition in the past, of course they would be successful. The Atlanta Braves would also win the pennant every year if they didnt play anyone ..

 

[jcanoe]

My experience with my 2017 Chevrolet Volt may not be typical. Over the four years I owned my Volt I had to have the Volt serviced 4X where I had to leave the vehicle with the service department. Each time I was provided with a 2016 to 2018 Volt loaner vehicle. (I believe that GM paid for the Volt loaner vehicle.)

Tesla will hopefully improve their customer service by building more service centers and having more loaner vehicles. I would like to see Tesla have concierge level service in their major markets, cities. This would include arranged drop off of a loaner vehicle while your Tesla vehicle is being serviced. I would not expect this service to be free.

 

[a2t2]

My experience with my 2017 Chevrolet Volt may not be typical. Over the four years I owned my Volt I had to have the Volt serviced 4X where I had to leave the vehicle with the service department. Each time I was provided with a 2016 to 2018 Volt loaner vehicle. (I believe that GM paid for the Volt loaner vehicle.)

Tesla will hopefully improve their customer service by building more service centers and having more loaner vehicles. I would like to see Tesla have concierge level service in their major markets, cities. This would include arranged drop off of a loaner vehicle while your Tesla vehicle is being serviced. I would not expect this service to be free.

Boom. Exactly this but I think the drop off service SHOULD be free. you troll ... lol

 

[73Bruin]

My experience with 4 different Toyota dealerships in Southern California (over 40 years of owning Toyotas) is that they view the service center as one of the main the profit centers for dealership along with parts sales. I have never been offered a loaner car even when repairs take overnight. If the issue is not straight forward scheduled maintenance, they have no problem exaggerating the cause to maximize their service revenue.

Dealers don't want EVs because they will cut into this revenue stream.

 

[SO16]

The existing service mentality from Tesla had better change before Ford and the others get their sh1t together.

After a century of Ford being in business and a 3 time Ford owner here, I’m not counting on them getting their “sh!t” together anytime soon. But we can dream.

 

[pt19713]

That is encouraging to hear. No im not just negative but Im an engineer and everything can be made better. No point in a bunch of fanboys getting on here and saying how great everything is when clearly much needs to be improved to stay ahead of the big boys. I LOVE this car. I think its well built, awesome to look at, and basically a 5 seater Lambo Huracan up to about 120 mph except far easier to drive and far quicker from 1 speed to another. When I highlight a glaring issue (and the service center is a glaring issue to all but the diehard fanboys) its just intended to get Tesla to do better in that area. IT should be a simple fix for them. And believe me, Ford and the big boys will be vastly farther ahead in the service arena VERY soon. I realize they arent yet but I would expect them to exploit the poor service Tesla provides after the sale to build consumer confidence in their brand. Im dumbfounded as to why this is even a discussion. Service/Communication has to improve if Tesla has any chance of competing in a few years.

Once you get over the initial issues, you most likely won't see the service center much. It's just dealing with them initially that's frustrating, even if they're located near by.

 

[a2t2]

My experience with 4 different Toyota dealerships in Southern California (over 40 years of owning Toyotas) is that they view the service center as one of the main the profit centers for dealership along with parts sales. I have never been offered a loaner car even when repairs take overnight. If the issue is not straight forward scheduled maintenance, they have no problem exaggerating the cause to maximize their service revenue.

Dealers don't want EVs because they will cut into this revenue stream.

Well the loaner situation depends on what you bought from Toyota. If you bought cheap cars, used, then yeah they prob wouldnt give you a free loaner. If it was a $45 ish + car still under factory warranty and they didnt give you a loaner for an overnight visit, then you chose to work with a subpar dealership.

I think the service revenue stream will still be there for EV market, but I get what you are saying = likely not to the extent as they were used to with ICE vehicles as there is just less to fix. So they could expand and offer "upgrades" like installing performance suspension kits, interior / exterior mods that sort of thing. Theres plenty of ways Tesla can make $$ on service but right now it seems they are merely trying to generate revenue from the initial sales alone and putting zero effort into post sale service. Thats a dangerous model on such pricey vehicles.

 

[a2t2]

After a century of Ford being in business and a 3 time Ford owner here, I’m not counting on them getting their “sh!t” together anytime soon. But we can dream.

Ha .. I can relate to that as well. But Tesla is forcing everyone to reinvent their business.

 

[Zorg]

Again, service is the dealers' primary source of profits. I have no idea how dealers survive in a pure EV world. Remember, Tesla makes its money off of sales, and breaks even on service.

 

[a2t2]

Continue to copy Tesla - Charge $20K over build cost and bilk $ out of paying customers for software/hardware upgrades and monthly subscriptions...like i said they will all need to reinvent their business models.

 

[Zorg]

Continue to copy Tesla - Charge $20K over build cost and bilk $ out of paying customers for software/hardware upgrades and monthly subscriptions...like i said they will all need to reinvent their business models.

Except that none of that will flow to the dealers. Dealerships are smart and there's a valid reason why they hate the transition to EVs. The current cost structure will simply not work in an EV world. My best guess is that dealerships will have to close/downsize, and will push those useless overly expensive warranties even harder.