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MPP compression rod and control arm bearings.

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The majority of all vehicle owners of any car type are not "car people," it's not unique to Teslas, nor is it because the majority of Tesla owners are "Techies" who you denigrate as idiots that only know what they read on the internet. It's because almost everyone buys a car just to get from point A to B.

Even 90% of Corvettes, Porsches, Ferraris, Camaros, M/AMG's, etc are bought by people that will never modify them, never track them, and just like them because they look fast and give you a little kick when you put your foot down 50% on the throttle getting on an entrance ramp.

The Model 3 isn't even sold into this market. It's a BMW 3 series competitor, so of course the "majority" of buyers aren't car people. You think Tesla could sell 1M cars a year if they only built cars for "Car people"?

Plus, "Techies" have been a huge boon for car culture. They designed Teslas. They made the internet, and without that, imagine how hard it would be for a company like MPP to find customers. And who would have bought Teslas from 2012-2018 when the cars were $100K and nobody was sure they would survive as a company? How's Rimac doing selling only performance electrics to car people?

The irony of posting "they don't understand much beyond the blurbs of tech specs on the internet that they read somewhere." on a Tesla forum on the internet that is discussing performance parts for your Tesla.... :rolleyes:

You just typed out multiple paragraphs to solidify my statement. Thanks.
 
Would Compression Rod Inserts and FLCA Bushings still notably improve feel on, say, an LR model with basic 235/45R18s? Or, does one need pretty performance-oriented wheels and tires to get a worthwhile benefit?
@Lindenwood The wheels are perfectly fine, but yes you should upgrade the tires if you're still on the Michelin Primacy MXM4 tires that the Model 3 usually comes with. They're very energy efficient but terrible for performance, with poor road feel, mushy cornering, and poor grip dry or wet. They will be a weak link for handling until you replace them with tires that perform better.

The 18" size is perfectly fine though. On my M3P I'm running 245/45R18 summer performance tires on 18x8.5" wheels (same size as your aero wheels). The car feels and handles excellent. It grips better and handles WAY better than a fully stock M3P too despite the smaller wheels / taller sidewalls.

(My car doesn't grip like a car setup for track use, but I'm not doing any track days in this car. It has good grip and excellent handling now for my street driving.)
 
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Did my first ever AutoX today (on what was apparently an uncommonly large course at 12 acres). I think I will be addicted for sure.

I was honestly surprised how much of an understeering tendency it had, especially on larger sweeping turns with relatively constant throttle, even with as much as 75/25 rear handling bias. Separately, am also pretty sure I could feel the car unsettle under max braking (I.e ABS kicking in), especially on turn-in.

If I am understanding everything right, Compression Rod Inserts and LCA bushings would improve both of these areas, correct?

Also, I asked about getting stickier tires because I do notice a difference in overall grip between my all-seasons and the original summer tires. They did pretty well today (1.1g laterally), but they were screaming the whole time, and almost everyone who beat me was running at least summer tires, if not dedicated race tires. I ran a 70.6 for 19th place out of 50, and 12th place ran a 69.1.

186503C7-711D-440C-A4F5-9096F5FAA69A.jpeg
45CFE4A5-57E3-4348-BE1C-7C5E45E5D57E.jpeg
 
Did my first ever AutoX today (on what was apparently an uncommonly large course at 12 acres). I think I will be addicted for sure.

I was honestly surprised how much of an understeering tendency it had, especially on larger sweeping turns with relatively constant throttle, even with as much as 75/25 rear handling bias. Separately, am also pretty sure I could feel the car unsettle under max braking (I.e ABS kicking in), especially on turn-in.

If I am understanding everything right, Compression Rod Inserts and LCA bushings would improve both of these areas, correct?

Also, I asked about getting stickier tires because I do notice a difference in overall grip between my all-seasons and the original summer tires. They did pretty well today (1.1g laterally), but they were screaming the whole time, and almost everyone who beat me was running at least summer tires, if not dedicated race tires. I ran a 70.6 for 19th place out of 50, and 12th place ran a 69.1.

View attachment 815635View attachment 815636
Tag this guy when you need to ask a track setup question @MasterC17
 
I was honestly surprised how much of an understeering tendency it had, especially on larger sweeping turns with relatively constant throttle, even with as much as 75/25 rear handling bias. Separately, am also pretty sure I could feel the car unsettle under max braking (I.e ABS kicking in), especially on turn-in.

If I am understanding everything right, Compression Rod Inserts and LCA bushings would improve both of these areas, correct?
Getting off-topic, but:
1. What wheel/tires/tire-pressures are you running?
2. What alignment are you running?
3. What suspension and other mods are you running?
 
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Did my first ever AutoX today (on what was apparently an uncommonly large course at 12 acres). I think I will be addicted for sure.

I was honestly surprised how much of an understeering tendency it had, especially on larger sweeping turns with relatively constant throttle, even with as much as 75/25 rear handling bias. Separately, am also pretty sure I could feel the car unsettle under max braking (I.e ABS kicking in), especially on turn-in.

If I am understanding everything right, Compression Rod Inserts and LCA bushings would improve both of these areas, correct?

Also, I asked about getting stickier tires because I do notice a difference in overall grip between my all-seasons and the original summer tires. They did pretty well today (1.1g laterally), but they were screaming the whole time, and almost everyone who beat me was running at least summer tires, if not dedicated race tires. I ran a 70.6 for 19th place out of 50, and 12th place ran a 69.1.

View attachment 815635View attachment 815636
Give us your current mods, alignment and damper settings, and whether or not you monitored and adjusted tire pressures can tell us more what the next step is.
 
-255/35R20 Vredestein Hypertracs on the stock wheels.
-5mm front and 15mm rear spacers
-H&R coils on otherwise stock suspension

-I talked to some of the race sponsors who basically all run street pressures, so they said I didn’t really adjust down from 42PSI cold (though, I checked about 90 minutes after my last run and they were all at 47 PSI, So I think they probably peaked higher because I forgot to let air out before subsequent runs).

297AB139-69EB-4CF3-86B6-2AA5EB3DAAE0.jpeg


(And yes I have read MasterC17’s Track Prep thread…a few times!)
 
-255/35R20 Vredestein Hypertracs on the stock wheels.
-5mm front and 15mm rear spacers
-H&R coils on otherwise stock suspension

-I talked to some of the race sponsors who basically all run street pressures, so they said I didn’t really adjust down from 42PSI cold (though, I checked about 90 minutes after my last run and they were all at 47 PSI, So I think they probably peaked higher because I forgot to let air out before subsequent runs).



(And yes I have read MasterC17’s Track Prep thread…a few times!)
We have a thread dedicated to autox.

I doubt compression rods could do much to fix the understeer. They affect the dynamics during transition states, but cannot do much in steady state cornering.
You need more front camber, and your rear spacer being much wider is knee-capping you as well. Remove it for autox events (but keep the front one).
 
I was honestly surprised how much of an understeering tendency it had, especially on larger sweeping turns with relatively constant throttle, even with as much as 75/25 rear handling bias. Separately, am also pretty sure I could feel the car unsettle under max braking (I.e ABS kicking in), especially on turn-in.

If I am understanding everything right, Compression Rod Inserts and LCA bushings would improve both of these areas, correct?

Do not buy handling mods after your first AutoX. You have a ton to learn before they will be of any real help.
FYI, handling bias is only doing anything when you are really on the power. It will do nothing for understeer when long sweepers. Understeer in these conditions is generally just "going too fast for your tires."
 
Handling balance I would leave at 50/50 or go to 45F/55R if you really want to rear bias it slightly. The car runs full power F/R in a straightish line anyway and AutoX has a lot of different inputs so the transition can do some weird stuff.

But yeah join us in the AutoX thread lol
 
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-255/35R20 Vredestein Hypertracs on the stock wheels.
-5mm front and 15mm rear spacers
-H&R coils on otherwise stock suspension

-I talked to some of the race sponsors who basically all run street pressures, so they said I didn’t really adjust down from 42PSI cold (though, I checked about 90 minutes after my last run and they were all at 47 PSI, So I think they probably peaked higher because I forgot to let air out before subsequent runs).

View attachment 815675

(And yes I have read MasterC17’s Track Prep thread…a few times!)

Ok, so I think you have several contributing factors going on here. Your front camber is definitely low. I would get FUCA's to fix that. Your rear toe-in is causing understeer. Set that to 0 as a baseline. Your tires are part of the problem. I know they're a bit on the expensive side, but the PS4S is a superb all-around street tire that still performs well at AutoX. Finally, 47 for tire pressure is WAY too high. Max you should be at when hot is probably 38psi on a street tire. If you don't want to spend too much $ on this, fixing the alignment and tire pressures will still go a long way.

The bushings are great, but FUCA's and Coilovers should come first IMO.
 
-255/35R20 Vredestein Hypertracs on the stock wheels.
-5mm front and 15mm rear spacers
-H&R coils on otherwise stock suspension

-I talked to some of the race sponsors who basically all run street pressures, so they said I didn’t really adjust down from 42PSI cold (though, I checked about 90 minutes after my last run and they were all at 47 PSI, So I think they probably peaked higher because I forgot to let air out before subsequent runs).

View attachment 815675

(And yes I have read MasterC17’s Track Prep thread…a few times!)
More front negative camber and lower your tire pressures(You will need to monitor the roll over and adjust as needed). Get summer tires or a dedicated set of autocross wheels and tires.
 
Thank you guys so much!

FUCAs are in the cart.

I’d already been working myself up to buying the MPP Coilovers anyways, and will go ahead and grab some now (digging deeper into whether I should go Comforts or Sport).

Would I have sufficient stock adjustment to zero out toe and maintain decent rear camber for what I expect will be only 2-3 more autocross events this year (there are no tracks that I know of within hundreds of miles, so doubt I’ll get to a road coarse before next spring / summer) or will I need camber (and/or toe??) arms as well?

Funny how this for-fun $40 Autocross experiment is turning into $4000-5000 worth of parts 24 hours later :p . I am reminded of this sticker on the wing the FTD car yesterday…

0E1B86D9-85AE-4EBE-AB02-055E37B27F3F.jpeg


@MasterC17
@MountainPass
 
Thank you guys so much!

FUCAs are in the cart.

I’d already been working myself up to buying the MPP Coilovers anyways, and will go ahead and grab some now (digging deeper into whether I should go Comforts or Sport).

Would I have sufficient stock adjustment to zero out toe and maintain decent rear camber for what I expect will be only 2-3 more autocross events this year (there are no tracks that I know of within hundreds of miles, so doubt I’ll get to a road coarse before next spring / summer) or will I need camber (and/or toe??) arms as well?

Funny how this for-fun $40 Autocross experiment is turning into $4000-5000 worth of parts 24 hours later :p . I am reminded of this sticker on the wing the FTD car yesterday…

View attachment 815839

@MasterC17
@MountainPass

I would say this - you can dial in the understeer even further with adjustable coilovers. So, the Sport's are worth the upgrade over the Comfort's for that alone.

Having said that, you don't need to do everything at once, so you could keep the rear toe and camber arms stock for now. The big advantage to those arms is the ease of adjustability. Whereas with the stock toe adjusters you need to visit an alignment shop every time. So, long term it may be cheaper to just do them now. More rear camber certainly will help, but ~1.5 isn't bad. I hope that makes the decision easier!
 
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I would say this - you can dial in the understeer even further with adjustable coilovers. So, the Sport's are worth the upgrade over the Comfort's for that alone.

Having said that, you don't need to do everything at once, so you could keep the rear toe and camber arms stock for now. The big advantage to those arms is the ease of adjustability. Whereas with the stock toe adjusters you need to visit an alignment shop every time. So, long term it may be cheaper to just do them now. More rear camber certainly will help, but ~1.5 isn't bad. I hope that makes the decision easier!
Thank you! I might have a glass of wine and just go for it…

And I guess since I have your attention for a bit…


Specifically for the Coilovers, I think realistically I’ll do maybe a few hundred miles a year where I truly care about maximizing handling and lateral grip (between the occasional twisty road, AutoX, or the even rarer road course). Conversely, I’ll see 15-20k per year of daily driving, road trips, etc, where the MPP Comforts will obviously shine.

Quoting you from almost 3 years ago…
One point I want to make; while the stock suspension sits high and is a little soft, aftermarket coilovers will not make you drastically faster. I shaved about 2 seconds on a 3.27 mile course (VIR). To be frank, I was rather impressed with the well-balanced stock suspension. My point being you can run fast times on stock struts (i.e. you don’t have to spend thousands on coilovers).
And…

If you are not driving competitively I wouldn’t hesitate to recommend the MPP Coilovers (I installed the Comfort’s on my wife’s car).

Do you still feel that way? And, we’re you speaking of the non-adjustable Comforts at that point? My impression is the Comfort Adjustables have enough range to crank them toward the stiffer end for adequate stiffness on the track (I.e. better than coils on stock dampers), and back down for an also-plusher-than-stock daily ride. Is that accurate?
 
Finally, 47 for tire pressure is WAY too high. Max you should be at when hot is probably 38psi on a street tire.
I generally agree, but I will say that once in the summer on PS4S's, before I had FUCAs, I had to run this kind of pressure to limit roll over and shoulder chunking. I also tend to run 42-ish in the rain.

Whereas with the stock toe adjusters you need to visit an alignment shop every time.
If you really get into the sport, it's worth it to learn how to do your own alignments, and it's pretty rewarding. Tons of pages out there on how to create a good setup for cheap.
 
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I generally agree, but I will say that once in the summer on PS4S's, before I had FUCAs, I had to run this kind of pressure to limit roll over and shoulder chunking. I also tend to run 42-ish in the rain.


If you really get into the sport, it's worth it to learn how to do your own alignments, and it's pretty rewarding. Tons of pages out there on how to create a good setup for cheap.
For the PS4S I found they liked 36psi in my complety stock dry setup, but they rolled and started chunking at the base of the treadblock. Not where I'm used to seeing it. Fingers crossed I'll have FUCAs in 2 weeks.