MX 0-60 Increases! (75D and 100D)

[TJtv]

More as a statement of fact than anything else, but Jaguar has decided to put the charge port on the front left fender.

Therfore a typical Supercharger bay is physically incompatible.

Any chance JLR and Tesla could come to a commercial agreement to use the Network are beyond optimistic

Nonsense, a Jaguar could pull front first into a space and use the supercharger that is in the space directly next to it - it's definitely not physically incompatible. I agree that it's not the optimal use of parking spaces, but there's nothing physically preventing it from happening.

 

[rltsx]

Two things:

1. Tesla's tactics are DECEITFUL, period. The timing to the changes they make to their existing lineup is purely financial, without regard to their existing customers. Some commented that "oh if you don't like innovation go buy something else..." WTF are you smoking? Like anyone buys a 6 figure futuristic car because they DON'T like innovation? Every manufacture aims to innovate, all the time. They have to. Difference being most manufactures are upfront about the WHEN and WHAT changes they make to their lineup. As a consumer, I know if I buy a Porsche 911s at the end of 2015, I will get a 991.1 with an n/a 6, but if I waited another month or two, I would get a 991.2 with a turbo 6. I am a happy customer either way because I got to choose what I wanted. There is no scenario where I come home with my 991.1 and learn next day that 991.2 will be out in dealership next week. Tesla is only getting away with this because they have no competition at the moment.

2. FIRST WORLD PROBLEMS (somehow saying that always makes me feel better).

 

[smac]

@vandacca for sure better reliability wouldn't go a miss, but again personally I can't remember the last time I used a SpC, and my CHAdeMO adaptor is still sat brand new in box.

The 200 mile range has made this possible, not the Supercharger network.

The biggest time saver Tesla could implement for me would be adding a service centre in my city, as it stands 3hrs round trip on the annual service is let's just say less than ideal. Where before I could ask a work colleague nicely to take a slight detour to pick me up on the way into the office via "xyz dealership", now it's a half a day out of the office

Please bear in mind I'm not saying it's unfixable, but just another data point to add in to the mix when thinking about the reasons someone may chose one of another manufacturers products.

 

[smac]

Nonsense, a Jaguar could pull front first into a space and use the supercharger that is in the space directly next to it - it's definitely not physically incompatible. I agree that it's not the optimal use of parking spaces, but there's nothing physically preventing it from happening.

A+ for pedantry. I should have said "certain not typical".

But let's say Jaguar were allowed to use the Supercharger system (never going to happen) if they had put the charge port front right it wouldn't be an issue. But as it stands, they could use the cable from an adjacent bay, in effect taking up two bays,. Still not be able to access certain corner bays, and certain standalone single bays would also not work.

TBH If manufacturers / regulators had any sense, they'd not only specify the size of the "physical envelope" of vehicle charge ports, but also agree the location. (And Tesla's inlet location does make sense)

 

[vandacca]

Two things:

1. Tesla's tactics are DECEITFUL, period. The timing to the changes they make to their existing lineup is purely financial, without regard to their existing customers. Some commented that "oh if you don't like innovation go buy something else..." WTF are you smoking? Like anyone buys a 6 figure futuristic car because they DON'T like innovation? Every manufacture aims to innovate, all the time. They have to. Difference being most manufactures are upfront about the WHEN and WHAT changes they make to their lineup. As a consumer, I know if I buy a Porsche 911s at the end of 2015, I will get a 991.1 with an n/a 6, but if I waited another month or two, I would get a 991.2 with a turbo 6. I am a happy customer either way because I got to choose what I wanted. There is no scenario where I come home with my 991.1 and learn next day that 991.2 will be out in dealership next week. Tesla is only getting away with this because they have no competition at the moment.

IMHO, calling Tesla's tactics "deceitful" is a little over the top. I find that perception is vastly different depending on which side of the fence you are looking from. Tesla's tactics (for better or worse) are due to their constant improvement process. Sure, customers get the latest and greatest sooner, but it also keeps new customers on the side-lines longer, as they're trying to time their entry just right. So Tesla ends up getting this big pool of potential customers who aren't helping their bottom line. These "tactics" are used to help shove some of those customers out of the pool and into a Tesla.

Some of us may not like it, but it's a necessary evil. A healthy Tesla/TSLA means a more stable and successful Tesla which leads to more superchargers, stores and SC.

2. FIRST WORLD PROBLEMS (somehow saying that always makes me feel better).

LOL

 

[dragonxt]

Confirmed my VIN with an owner specialist. He said I should have it, then came back and said tough luck...

Obsolete 6 Days after Delivery. It was fun while it lasted...

 

[verygreen]

I agree that Tesla needs to address reliability, since spending all that time at the SC is ruining the whole experience of self-reliance. Oddly, giving great loaners is one way of helping until they can get reliability up there.

I think you are on to something here.
If they gave me X P100D while fixing my X, I would not mind it as much that they had it for 40+ days. As is I was getting S85 from 2013 and doing a lemon claim instead. People that say top specced cars used as loaners make no sense missing this facet right here.
It's not just "they might like it more and buy it" (the advertised benefit). It's also "Tesla cars quality is still subpar, having superior loaners makes owners less grumpy, leading to fewer buybacks and improving profits that way" (I imagine buybacks are expensive).

Hopefully by the time they make me another X both the quality improves and they have X loaners in my service center (of which they have zero at the moment).

 

[outie]

They gave me a near equivalent loaner X60D san premium pkg and I was totally fine with them keeping my car for 2+ weeks. So if I could get a P100DL then even better. They can keep the car as long as they want!

 

[Spin Echo]

Confirmed my VIN with an owner specialist. He said I should have it, then came back and said tough luck...

Obsolete 6 Days after Delivery. It was fun while it lasted...

Hey DragonXT,

I may be feeling the same pain. I took delivery of my Model X 75D on June 29, 2017 and didn't even need the car until the end of the summer. I specifically asked two sales reps if Tesla had any forthcoming significant improvements, and they said negative, so I said why not get the X a few months earlier? Now I see that it's better to wait as long as you can given Tesla's mid year rolling updates. So I called my delivery specialist and he said I'm in luck, and that my Model X 75D's 0-60 performance can indeed be upgraded through firmware to the 4.9 sec. No need to even come to the service center. BUT there is no known ETA for this. I am skeptical. How did your Tesla adviser come to his/her conclusion about your X NOT being eligible for this firmware upgrade? Was it the specific manufacture date being before June 19? Also, how on earth will I really know the firmware update shaved 1.1 seconds off my X? In the end, it makes a small difference to me, but potentially a huge difference to the buyer of my car down the road.

 

[T3xrr]

Hey DragonXT,

I may be feeling the same pain. I took delivery of my Model X 75D on June 29, 2017 and didn't even need the car until the end of the summer. I specifically asked two sales reps if Tesla had any forthcoming significant improvements, and they said negative, so I said why not get the X a few months earlier? Now I see that it's better to wait as long as you can given Tesla's mid year rolling updates. So I called my delivery specialist and he said I'm in luck, and that my Model X 75D's 0-60 performance can indeed be upgraded through firmware to the 4.9 sec. No need to even come to the service center. BUT there is no known ETA for this. I am skeptical. How did your Tesla adviser come to his/her conclusion about your X NOT being eligible for this firmware upgrade? Was it the specific manufacture date being before June 19? Also, how on earth will I really know the firmware update shaved 1.1 seconds off my X? In the end, it makes a small difference to me, but potentially a huge difference to the buyer of my car down the road.

That's a really good point. Is there something in the car that shows the speed increase of 0-60?

 

[outie]

That's funny. Maybe if EM tweeted if you have firmware xxx you are already 1 second faster and no one would have noticed.

 

[Spin Echo]

That's a really good point. Is there something in the car that shows the speed increase of 0-60?

I tend to doubt it. Right now, I think there is too much speculation going on about whether performance can actually be improved or not on recently purchased Model X's via future firmware updates. We may just have to be patient and see what Tesla releases in the way of options for us and how such improvements can be documented for a particular vehicle.

 

[vandacca]

BTW, I'm just bitter with the old-school automotive industry. I've been waiting for a decent EV since my university days 30 years ago. Kept being promised that they were around the corner and I even had a chance to see an EV1 up close once.

And here is follow-up to my bitterness. Toyota's North American CEO said: "At gas at less than $2 a gallon, no [I'm not worried]... I think [the Model 3] is going to be great but today less than half of one percent of the industry are pure electric vehicles." More of such quotes at the above link. Or go to teslamondo.com for a comprehensive list.

Doesn't sound like the big automotive companies are sincerely moving to EVs. Just lip service to put enough doubt into consumer's mind to keep them on the side-lines from buying a EV.

And this is one of the main reasons why I think Tesla won't have true competition for 5-10 years.

 

[smac]

Getting somewhat back on topic.

Do we think Tesla will implement a switchable sports mode. This is more applicable to the RWD S 75, whose specs now match the old P85 in 0-60. My experience is that in some ways the original 85 was actually more pleasant to drive over the P85 when you were just running errands.

I'm sure you'd get used to it, but whenever I had a loaner P85, I'd find I was spinning up the rear tires when pulling out of junctions in heavy rain. The old RWD 85 was plenty fast enough 99% of the time, but had better pedal modulation at low speeds. Being able to go back to that throttle map and not be forced into the more aggressive P85 map would actually be a useful feature.

 

[AnxietyRanger]

Who is the competition in ~1 year? Or even ~2-3 years? More to come on why I don't think they'll have competition below...

Audi and Jaguar on the premium level in ~1 year. On the volume level, at least Volkswagen in ~2-3 years.

 

[AnxietyRanger]

IMHO, calling Tesla's tactics "deceitful" is a little over the top. I find that perception is vastly different depending on which side of the fence you are looking from. Tesla's tactics (for better or worse) are due to their constant improvement process. Sure, customers get the latest and greatest sooner, but it also keeps new customers on the side-lines longer, as they're trying to time their entry just right. So Tesla ends up getting this big pool of potential customers who aren't helping their bottom line. These "tactics" are used to help shove some of those customers out of the pool and into a Tesla.

Some of us may not like it, but it's a necessary evil. A healthy Tesla/TSLA means a more stable and successful Tesla which leads to more superchargers, stores and SC.

@rltsx is right, though. Automotive manufacturers on average are surprisingly open about their future products and roadmaps. Sometimes years ahead.

The issues with planning and timing a car purchase are almost completely unique to Tesla that changes products multiple times every quarter and usually in secret (unless a reverse discount / lever is needed by pre-announcing a negative future change, though even that can be rolled back without consideration - e.g. free Supercharging). The move to change performance 1 day after previous quarter close (and in Tesla manner massive delivery push) is certainly deceitful, as was giving and taking away free Supercharging perk two quarters in a row, even if one accepts certain such deceit normal in sales and business. It is still intentional misleading of the customer to push sales.

Indeed, something many may have expected from their dealerships, but are now getting from Tesla on a global scale.

Buying an iPhone from the secretive Apple is tons easier than buying a Tesla, from this perspective.

 

[AnxietyRanger]

And here is follow-up to my bitterness. Toyota's North American CEO said: "At gas at less than $2 a gallon, no [I'm not worried]... I think [the Model 3] is going to be great but today less than half of one percent of the industry are pure electric vehicles." More of such quotes at the above link. Or go to teslamondo.com for a comprehensive list.

Doesn't sound like the big automotive companies are sincerely moving to EVs. Just lip service to put enough doubt into consumer's mind to keep them on the side-lines from buying a EV.

And this is one of the main reasons why I think Tesla won't have true competition for 5-10 years.

The thing is, Audi's North American CEO is obviously plain wrong. And the Musk-Have advertisement is purely idiotic. (Got us talking, though, so maybe not?)

But none of that matters. The German Volkswagen/Audi/Porsche juggernaut has been convinced and they are moving. Some offspring of Detroit at the U.S. sales office is irrelevant, though the Dieselgate in the U.S. helped.

Mind you, I am not saying Tesla has too much to worry about here. I expect Model 3 to succeed. But I do think we will have plenty of large-battery BEVs to choose from in short order. There is room for many.

Some will be left behind, but it definitely won't be Volkswagen/Audi/Porsche. And no, just like I said on this forum back then... the Dieselgate did not kill them - there was never any danger of that.

Nevermind what their hired hands in marketing say, what matters is what their engineers have been tasked to do. We do owe big thanks to Tesla for that. I don't think they would have committed without it.

And unlike Tesla, when these guys put out a schedule of real production intent, they do get the product done on that schedule. What has been lacking so far has been the commitment to do that... They are committed now.

 

[MXWing]

If a Model X made in August can be made better/more featured than a Model X created in July, Tesla should just hold back improvements/innovations so some owner who took delivery in June can feel better?

The second that Musk announces something like "All cars ordered starting on Jan 1st 2018 will have Generation 1 HUD. All cars ordered starting on Jun 1st will have Generation 2 HUD"

is the same second I

- Sell all my shares
- Close all my LEAPS
- Sell as many calls and buy as many puts as I can
- Empty out my kids piggy banks to scramble for a few more dollars so I can buy a few more puts.
- Sell my X ASAP because there won't be a company around to support it in a year.

How some people here can achieve the financial wherewithal to purchase a Tesla with the lack of common sense is maddening.

also - first world problems. The car you have today is still the same car you purchased. Your neighbor's better car does not make your car any worse.

I'm setting up a donation plate for AP1 owners who missed AP2 by 63 days. Anyone chipping in? No? I didn't think so.

Why 63 days and why not 64 days? Because well, I think people 63 days out deserve relief and 64 days out should be plain SOL.

 

[MXWing]

After grinning ear to ear driving home from the SC with my uncorked 2016 Model X it made me think of this thread and all the crow people should be eating.

Tesla owed us NOTHING. We got the cars we agreed to purchase.

Nice reverse 'uncertainty' factor. You never know what Tesla can/will do for you post purchase.

 

[MikeInFL]

Just a quick update. MX 75D 1/4 time with updated performance is 13.2 @ 101 mph.