My experience at the Jaguar and Audi Dealerships today for their EVs

[SO16]

Today I stopped by the jaguar dealership to look at the ipace and at the Audi dealership to look at the Etron.

I first walked into the jaguar dealership and sat in the new ipace to check out the interior and exterior. I like the exterior but I was NOT impressed with the interior. I found the seats very uncomfortable compared to my 2017 Tesla MS. It didn’t even seem like the interior was “premium” in any way. I’d take the MS interior way over this. Too many little screens. I then spoke to a sales rep. Older gentleman and I was telling him that I like the looks of the exterior of the ipace and thought it was great more manufacturers are brining on electrics. His response “well, we’re being forced to.” I thought, oh here we go. He then went on to say “for a commuter car, they’re great. But for any long distance destinations, you are hopscotching around. They need to have at least 400 miles of range.” I thought to myself, once they reach 400, this guy would then just move the goal posts and say they need 500. He then went on to say how he knew a Tesla owner who got stranded on the side of the road due to miscalculation of his charge. This “salesman” was anti-selling the EV so much that if I was only slightly knowledgeable on EVs, I’d never want to look at another one again. I then said Tesla does now get 370 miles of range and his response was, “only in the summer.” The guy wasn’t wrong, but he certainly made the “range problem” seem much worse than it was. He kept coming up with straw man situations how like he couldn’t drive to Indianapolis (260 miles) and back in one day in an EV really easily. I have driven my Tesla out of state many times. True you can’t do cannonball run style trips but I still prefer to have more convenience the rest of the year. The salesman just ignored my comment.

Needless to say, I was NOT impressed with (Dave) at that Jaguar dealership nor the ipace interior.

I then went over to the Audi dealership and spoke to Chris. Night and day difference in sales reps. I thought the etron had a nicer interior and definitely felt well made. Seats felt better compared to the ipace but I still prefer my MS seats. I also still prefer my MS interior over the etron with the layout, screen and functionality. But I do feel that the eTron interior was better built. Didn’t care much for the exterior. Trunk space was okay but they did at least have a spare. Chris was definitely all for EVs and excited for them.

Still felt best to get back to my car.

All I can say is that having to rely on dealerships for selling a product can definitely be hit or miss. I’m glad Tesla doesn’t have that issue. Tesla just needs to get much better with their communication. They are lacking in that area. I lost a potential MX referral because of how poor the communication was between the sales staff and this buyer was. When I purchased my MS in late 2016, I had a really good experience with Tesla. Maybe that too is hit or miss.

 

[wipster]

Today I stopped by the jaguar dealership to look at the ipace and at the Audi dealership to look at the Etron.

I first walked into the jaguar dealership and sat in the new ipace to check out the interior and exterior. I like the exterior but I was NOT impressed with the interior. I found the seats very uncomfortable compared to my 2017 Tesla MS. It didn’t even seem like the interior was “premium” in any way. I’d take the MS interior way over this. Too many little screens. I then spoke to a sales rep. Older gentleman and I was telling him that I like the looks of the exterior of the ipace and thought it was great more manufacturers are brining on electrics. His response “well, we’re being forced to.” I thought, oh here we go. He then went on to say “for a commuter car, they’re great. But for any long distance destinations, you are hopscotching around. They need to have at least 400 miles of range.” I thought to myself, once they reach 400, this guy would then just move the goal posts and say they need 500. He then went on to say how he knew a Tesla owner who got stranded on the side of the road due to miscalculation of his charge. This “salesman” was anti-selling the EV so much that if I was only slightly knowledgeable on EVs, I’d never want to look at another one again. I then said Tesla does now get 370 miles of range and his response was, “only in the summer.” The guy wasn’t wrong, but he certainly made the “range problem” seem much worse than it was. He kept coming up with straw man situations how like he couldn’t drive to Indianapolis (260 miles) and back in one day in an EV really easily. I have driven my Tesla out of state many times. True you can’t do cannonball run style trips but I still prefer to have more convenience the rest of the year. The salesman just ignored my comment.

Needless to say, I was NOT impressed with (Dave) at that Jaguar dealership nor the ipace interior.

I then went over to the Audi dealership and spoke to Chris. Night and day difference in sales reps. I thought the etron had a nicer interior and definitely felt well made. Seats felt better compared to the ipace but I still prefer my MS seats. I also still prefer my MS interior over the etron with the layout, screen and functionality. But I do feel that the eTron interior was better built. Didn’t care much for the exterior. Trunk space was okay but they did at least have a spare. Chris was definitely all for EVs and excited for them.

Still felt best to get back to my car.

All I can say is that having to rely on dealerships for selling a product can definitely be hit or miss. I’m glad Tesla doesn’t have that issue. Tesla just needs to get much better with their communication. They are lacking in that area. I lost a potential MX referral because of how poor the communication was between the sales staff and this buyer was. When I purchased my MS in late 2016, I had a really good experience with Tesla. Maybe that too is hit or miss.

Thanks for the take of the different dealerships. My guess is most would be like the Jag dealer than the Audi. The OEM's are going to need to incentivise their dealerships differently if they want to sell their BEV's, not to mention build better cars. Methinks we've just begun to see recalls, especially without OTA SW updates.

 

[Unpilot]

That's funny I am getting ready to drive home from Indy tonight. It will be a 266 Mile Rd trip and I will make it just fine.

My car has been sitting at airport for 5 days as well.

 

[BrokerDon]

We saw a Jaguar i-Pace in front of Costco in Fountain Valley, CA this afternoon. VERY unimpressed, especially when I saw the sticker price !!! We could buy a nice Model S for what they posted. NO COMPARISON in size and usability. Plus it's only rated at 76MPGe vs. 90 MPGe that our 4 year old Ludicrous 2015 Model S P85 which would leave the i-Pace in it's dust. Definitely a "compliance car" IMHO.

 

[MrABRanch]

Did some mock-ups of how I wish the E-tron removed that hideous oversized kid toy looking from grill, with something sleeker.

From this

A couple variations:





Of if you insist on a grill:

 

[Ashleysteadman]

Very interesting experience you had - it seems that the “old school” dealers still haven’t got their heads around selling electric cars! Here in Australia the i-Pace is more expensive than an equivalent/better Tesla Model S/X - I welcome more EV competition but I’m really struggling to see who’s going to buy one of these things!!

 

[Magellan55]

One reason why Jaguar is only moving 200 i-Paces a month in the US...

 

[ion]

That jaguar “salesman” really did his homework on limitations of EV. Makes you wonder why? Was it his personal preference or was it directed by corporate?

 

[Merrill]

I still think dealers have not changed their thinking from BEV’s are just compliance cars to someday they will be the only vehicle you will be able to purchase. Probably the younger salesman will understand, also it would be interesting to know what their factory cost is vs retail sales price. If the profit is not as good as an ICE that is also motivation to do a negative sell.

 

[jj88]

We went to the Penske Jag dealer. Being tourists, I mentioned our Tesla. Of course he liked the iPace better, but he was knowledgeable and knew the car well. Even for an old fart like me, in his 60's! It was a nice car. But twice as much? And the seats were... odd. He mentioned they were vegan. That's when I mentioned my T3. He was a lot more knowledgeable than the Leaf and Kia dealers we visited! He didn't try to sell me the car, but he stayed with us for 20 minutes, and showed us the whole car. I was impressed.
But I'm guessing Roger demands perfection.
(and funny - at each dealership, they all mentioned Roger had been in the day before. I asked each one - 'Is he friendlier than he appears on TV?' The RR lady said she's just shaken his hand. When I asked the Bentley guy, he asked what the first lady said. That was funny! But at each place, they all agreed he was a nice guy. I'm guessing he doesn't tolerate mistakes too often...)

 

[Chasingmars]

I had very similar experiences with Honda (looking at the Clarity PHEV), Nissan, Kia and Hyundai inquiring about their BEVs and such before deciding on the Tesla... They (except Nissan who was luke-warm and told me all about the 6 month wait to get one) were universally uninformed and uninterested in selling those cars, the Hyundai rep tried to steer me to the Hybrid version, the Kia just said we don't have any yet and don't know when they will, and the Honda guy just about treated me like he was wasting his time.

The Dealers know their bread is buttered on maintenance expenses and margins, and the BEV's have little of either for the big players.

 

[milleron]

. . . I’m really struggling to see who’s going to buy one of these things!!

Pretty easy answer: those with more money than brains who are willing to pay the premium price and take a significantly inferior car just for the Jaguar and Audi badges on the front.
As soon as we heard about the unconscionably bad e-tron energy efficiency, I guessed that they will sell the cars for which they had reservations after which demand will slow to a trickle. Those who predicted that Tesla would be in trouble once the "Big Boys" got into the EV game were laughingly naïve. It's back to the drawing board for Audi and minimal sales for I-pace, not only because their product is inferior but mainly because their sales people are trying to dissuade customers from buying them!

 

[Target]

I haven't looked at the maintenance schedule on the iPace or eTron but the Chevy Bolt will cost their dealers future maintenance dollars compared to selling a gas car. The Bolt requires nothing but tire rotations and cabin air filter changes until 100K miles. Unless it breaks mine won't see the dealer for many years. Consider how much profit comes from service, especially at an Audi and Jaguar dealership, and you can see why the dealerships may not be excited to sell an EV compared to a gas car.

On the Tesla sales communication level, my understanding is that when they tried to close all the stores at the beginning of the year, they also removed all bonus / commission from the sales staff. This means that the sales force that exists today is likely working for a flat salary/hourly wage and has no incentive to delight customers. For the Model 3 that probably doesn't matter right now as there is still quite a bit of demand, but for the S and X, it has likely had a significant impact, and could be the big reason behind the Q1 19 drop in S/X sales. If my experience in buying my used Model S last month is anything at all what it is like buying a new S/X I can't imagine very many are being bought. They are effectively anti-selling their own products right now.

I know they are trying to keep costs under control, but taking all incentives away from the sales force is rarely a good way to accomplish that. All the good people leave for other brands. If you are lucky those people don't take your clients with them, but don't bet on that.

 

[MichaelP90DL]

Did some mock-ups of how I wish the E-tron removed that hideous oversized kid toy looking from grill, with something sleeker.

From this
View attachment 419431
A couple variations:
View attachment 419435

View attachment 419434

View attachment 419436
Of if you insist on a grill:
View attachment 419437

Very cool!

 

[AlexanderAF]

His response “well, we’re being forced to.”

Dealer eyes your attention over to the back where Al Gore has a sniper rifle trained on him

 

[Rich A.]

My sense is that Jaguar is currently attempting to limit the number of iPace BEVs sold, due to a limited supply but also due to limited profit. Unless you make it abundantly clear to the salesperson that you really, really, want an iPace and nothing else, they're probably going to steer you towards something with a tailpipe.

 

[SOULPEDL]

I still think dealers have not changed their thinking from BEV’s are just compliance cars to someday they will be the only vehicle you will be able to purchase. Probably the younger salesman will understand, also it would be interesting to know what their factory cost is vs retail sales price. If the profit is not as good as an ICE that is also motivation to do a negative sell.

And so this is how we have the auto industry generating (poor) sales data to further the low demand narrative against the EV market (and Tesla recently). So was that the plan? To intentionally limit sales to demonstrate market weakness the past 20 years, or were they screwed from the start because they lacked the motivation?

So could these competitors raise the EV sticker prices and get the salesforce promoting EV? Maybe 15 yrs back when there were the die hard customers and fewer choices. GM had that going already. Too late now without buyers considering a Tesla for only a bit more (or less now?).

IMHO, what started out as a ploy to kill EVs, only backfired for their market positioning, Engineering Designs, and IP. It's really hard to catch up now, meanwhile their shareholders still enjoy the ICE sales profits. And their thinking is still short-term and only now trying to change direction because ICE has terminal cancer.

Doom on you. (image from Ice Age movie)

 

[pvazquez03]

I've visited many dealerships and most of the employees don't know much about what they are selling. Unfortunetly i had the same experience at the Tesla site, but I was able to assist them with their customers many times when I visited them, lol.

 

[BOBTHEJOCKEY]

And so this is how we have the auto industry generating (poor) sales data to further the low demand narrative against the EV market (and Tesla recently). So was that the plan? To intentionally limit sales to demonstrate market weakness the past 20 years, or were they screwed from the start because they lacked the motivation?

So could these competitors raise the EV sticker prices and get the salesforce promoting EV? Maybe 15 yrs back when there were the die hard customers and fewer choices. GM had that going already. Too late now without buyers considering a Tesla for only a bit more (or less now?).

IMHO, what started out as a ploy to kill EVs, only backfired for their market positioning, Engineering Designs, and IP. It's really hard to catch up now, meanwhile their shareholders still enjoy the ICE sales profits. And their thinking is still short-term and only now trying to change direction because ICE has terminal cancer.

Doom on you. (image from Ice Age movie)

They make ZERO profits on any of BEV's they sell. I read somewhere that GM actually LOOSES money on each CHEVY BOLT they sell. 50% of car dealerships profit comes from car repairs that are non existent with electric cars. The dealerships will be destroyed and there is no way out. It's actually rather sad. It's the ultimate revenge of the Electric Car. Either the ICE car becomes extinct or WE ALL DO.

 

[Chasingmars]

soooo... I was thinking the other day making one of my last visits to my local gas station that when electric cars take 5-10 times as long to "fill up" there won't be enough room at "corner gas" stations for them to have enough stalls to stay in business... but now the answer becomes clear... they can just move into all the soon to be bankrupt car dealerships that will have lots of room for charging bays!