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My mate's car coming soon, which wall charger should he buy?

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...but not for family members.
I worry about the kids driving an under powered valueless 20 year old hatchback. I don't want them getting ideas about the Tesla!
On our car (2014 Model S) the only ways of opening the charge port are the phone, the Fob, from in the car itself, or with a Tesla charger. Actually, before I learnt that you could use the fob I often did it from the screen when I parked
 
then if internet down / whatever it will start

Not going to lie, I've not read the whole thread as my missus is talking to me about her work and I'm supposed to be listening!

I work in 'cloud native transformation' - helping legacy enterprises do software and cloud stuff like it's the 21st century, and not like they're running a 1870's cotton mill or 1950's mass production line.

I am deeply skeptical of most companies' ability to do internet-of-things well. I have delivered training courses to people that work on critical national infrastructure for water processing plants and... Well, let's just say that I really hope that no state-level actor ever decides to try hacking that kind of system. Because we'll all be doomed.

To put it in more relatable context, Energenie is a brand I've bought once and never again. You can't control their power sockets without their servers being online. I have also worked with some utility companies that offer EV charging points, and let me say that it is absolutely no surprise to me that these things are so glitchy.

I love things like Philips Hue and Flic, where it's all local to my home network. But so many companies that produce physical devices have no idea how to build software properly, and will right-royally screw it up. I realise this is all very negative and unsubstantiated, so to try and end on an actionable note I'd just encourage people to exercise caution and to read reviews/check downtime of services that physical devices connect to, to avoid wasting your cash on something made by dinosaurs from last century. Treat anyone that comes from a "physical first, software second" mindset with extreme caution.
 
I am deeply sceptical of most companies' ability to do internet-of-things well

Me too ... I've been a programmer for 45 years and I have respect for a tiny number of products.

In early 2000's I built eCommerce - even then we had clients with 100's of high street stores and Click and Collect long before that was commonplace. And then our clients moved the projects from IT department to Marketing and all the emphasis moved from usability and QA/UAT before rollout to "pixel perfect" and usability was horrendous and that meant that most issues were only raised after systems went live ... which were, by then, emergency. I gave up on eCommerce at that point! but the legacy is that almost everywhere I shop online I am disappointed ...

Change products-per-page from 20 to ALL. Navigate to a different category ... its back to 20 products per page again?

There are a huge number of sites that do that, must all be using the same rubbish underlying engine. And no one has found it necessary to improve that, nor to QA it ... Ho!Hum!
 
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He is thinking Anderson, for aesthetics on outside of his (period property) house. He has 3-phase supply and plans for PV

Do you wish you had bought a different Wall Charger?
Yes wish I just got a simple one, my Anderson unit already failed and had to be replaced, I won't be happy when it happens out of warranty, I am sure chargers should be more reliable.

Then the app isn't always reliable with either downtime or just deleting my schedule a few times, being able to schedule it to only charge during the octopus period is the best part.

Change products-per-page from 20 to ALL. Navigate to a different category ... its back to 20 products per page again?

There are a huge number of sites that do that, must all be using the same rubbish underlying engine. And no one has found it necessary to improve that, nor to QA it ... Ho!Hum!
Yes that's common but not something that would even be hard to program in, the problem is many people just want quick results rather than fine tune something let alone more advanced things
 
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I am referring to the Anderson App
I had the same issues of schedules disappearing in the app also - I spoke to Octopus about this who were helpful researching problem and released new code to the Andersen charging unit.

Even though the schedules were disappearing from the app, the problem for me was actually diagnosed as the wifi connection dropping to the Andersen unit, which was in turn somehow then erasing the schedules which were then relayed back to the app as missing.

So whilst it looked like the app was at fault, for me it was actually the Andersen unit itself.

As I say this has now been fixed.
 
We’ve got a black Hypervolt. To be fair other than needing a modification to the charging cable to work around the locking mechanism issues with the model 3 (well known issue with the Hypervolt) it’s been rock solid.
 
I had the same issues of schedules disappearing in the app also - I spoke to Octopus about this who were helpful researching problem and released new code to the Andersen charging unit.

Even though the schedules were disappearing from the app, the problem for me was actually diagnosed as the wifi connection dropping to the Andersen unit, which was in turn somehow then erasing the schedules which were then relayed back to the app as missing.

So whilst it looked like the app was at fault, for me it was actually the Andersen unit itself.

As I say this has now been fixed.
I assume you mean Anderson not Octopus as the scheduling for the charger isn’t anything to do with Octopus unless you are referring to their intelligent tariff or something else

I don’t know why they disappear as No idea where or how that data is stored, I assume it’s in the ‘cloud’ as you have to login but it’s all bizarre to me how Anderson operate the software/hardware link, hence the issues
 
I assume you mean Anderson not Octopus as the scheduling for the charger isn’t anything to do with Octopus unless you are referring to their intelligent tariff or something else

I don’t know why they disappear as No idea where or how that data is stored, I assume it’s in the ‘cloud’ as you have to login but it’s all bizarre to me how Anderson operate the software/hardware link, hence the issues
I'm afraid anything that depends on the vagaries of the internet is always going to introduce an element of doubt for me. Timing controlled within the car's systems or within the charge point's system are likely to be more dependable. Even if the charger company's servers are perfectly reliable there's plenty that can interrupt communications... from your own flaky router and wifi signal to the car ... to network meltdown of your ISP ... to whatever!
 
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I chose the Andersen for the aesthetics. Just about every other charger that I looked at looked a bit naff and not something that I wanted on the front of my house, especially with the cables draped everywhere. Most look cheap and plasticky and many have the scourge of bright LEDs like a gamer's PC. If your parking spot is out of sight then this is less of an issue. The Zappi, for all it's cleverness, looks like a plastic urinal stuck to the front of a house to me. The Andersen is hands-down the best looking unit available.


Good points about the Andersen:
It's UK made and built very solidly.
You have a choice of front and side panel colours and materials.
The cables are hidden inside the unit.
It works well with battery and solar installations- a CT clamp allows it to see when power is being exported and divert that to the car battery. This is dead easy to retrofit too though don't go to Andersen for the CT clamp- they charge £100. Look in the installation manual off their website for the solar modification and they actually list the part number for the clamp which costs about £32 from RS Components. Add in a bit of Ethernet cable and you are there.

Bad Points:
In 18 months of ownership the app servers went offline twice, once for a weekend, which meant that you couldn't change schedules. The charger still worked though.
Like all IoT devices if Andersen went bust then you might lose the app functionality if the servers were switched off.
The Konnect+ app can be slow to respond. Changing the ratio of solar power/grid power seems very slow and flaky and usually takes a couple of jabs to get it to respond.
The Schedule disappeared a couple of times. Inputting them again takes less than a minute though.
They do not release their API so third-parties can't interface into it. Only an issue if you like tinkering though, really.
 
I have a Gen 2 Tesla. It is great for the Tesla, I can plug it in stop/start charging and vary the charge rate on the app.

I've also got a SyncEV charger - switch it in basic mode, and it is OK for the Tesla. Now that the company have fixed their App software, I use it on our Smart car to vary the charge from 6A to 32A.

I don't think they are the best chargers, but they work very well for me and I'm happy with both.
 
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What is the benefit of an APP for the charger or scenarios where it is useful? (Apart from diverting Solar or something more sophisticated like that)

Seems to me:

Tesla: Plug the car in. It will charge on schedule (car is set to start charging at the start of Off Peak period).

If I want to charge the car I can just open the Tesla APP and START CHARGE.

Whereas I am assuming that with a charger with an APP I might also have to open the Charger APP and initiate a charge there too (e.g. if it is in some other mode such as "Only if Solar PV starts exporting")
The Apps let you vary the charge current and stop/start charging wherever you are.
 
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I'd agree with @Zakalwe 's write-up on the Andersen, very happy with it. I only consider recommending it or an EO mini pro for where cost is a priority over aesthetics.

I am running the Andersen as a dumb charger just now tho. CT clamp on its way so will be enabling the solar features soon. Will see how that goes.
 
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The Apps let you vary the charge current and stop/start charging wherever you are.

Thanks. I do that from the car APP though - is there something that the Charger APP adds that is "better/more"?

My cars are scheduled to start charge (if at HOME) at start of Off Peak. So if they are plugged in, and below Charge Limit, they will charge overnight.

My main charger is Tesla, secondary is Zappi.

I use car APP to start charge when there is excess PV - already plugged in so Start Charge is all it needs.

I have a lot of PV panels, I'm not happy with the rate that the PowerWalls charge when I have full sun, so want to charge the car gently (which can be 32 AMPS!) to feather the PowerWall charge rate.

I then have a Zappi if anything starts to be exported that will start up. Car has to be expecting to charge though (its normal mode is scheduled (at the car end) to charge at start of Off Peak)

On a really sunny day even with one car charging at 32AMPs I will still export - so Zappi will deal with that.

My uncertainty is whether this "internet of things" is useful for something like a car charger ... given that it may fail periodically and/or company go out of business. I wonder if dumb charger is sufficient, and drive the car from an API of some sort instead.
 
My uncertainty is whether this "internet of things" is useful for something like a car charger ... given that it may fail periodically and/or company go out of business. I wonder if dumb charger is sufficient, and drive the car from an API of some sort instead.
I don't think the smart chargers add much at the moment beyond being able to leverage solar if you have that. I think the theory is that if they offer a standardised control system the grid could use them to help manage load a bit. Able to offer cheap power to get some excess wind soaked up, request to not charge at peak time, or control rolling overnight slots to balance things out.

The problem is, no power companies have anywhere near the back end systems to be able to support any of this, and it will be decades until the bigger incumbents refresh their stuff enough to even start. Octopus have a trial running, but it only works with a specific charger, and Tesla have their super generous tariff (in association with Octopus I think), but you need solar and a powerwall for that.

The charger manufacturers need to open up their API's a little, like Tesla does. That would enable enthusiasts to take control and start linking something like agile to their charger, or any other logic they wanted. In the mean time we are all paying for 'smart' chargers (which are really just little ardrino's and Pi Zeros - I can see your wifi ID on my network Mr Andersen), but largely not exceeding the capabilities of a dumb charger + the car.

Perhaps other cars are less flexible than ours so controlling via the charger is more important for them?
 
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The charger manufacturers need to open up their API's a little, like Tesla does. That would enable enthusiasts to take control

Hmmm ... I'm still mentally struggling with why controlling the charger is better than controlling the car.

At the very least the Charger is going to have to be able to ask the Car for its VIN so as to know which family member car it is ... or a visitor ... and have a database of cars and their requirements

How much juice does the visitor need? What a palaver - Visitor just needs to set that for/from their car ...

Where is Car-#1 going tomorrow and how much juice does it need?

From charger's viewpoint that needs a conversation with Charger-#2 to see if it is plugged into any other car and what that car's requirements are.

I'm reckoning all that will be easier from the Car's APP
  • set Car-#1 to "Must have 100% by 6AM"
  • set Car-#2 to its default
Where "default" might be something like "Need minimum 50% by end off Off Peak, fill it up if excess Solar or Electricity generation is curtailed and Price goes negative :) "

Perhaps other cars are less flexible than ours so controlling via the charger is more important for them?

Yes, that's a good point. (I dunno know the answer ... but I reckon that if Tesla has it, some others add it, then all manufactures will come under pressure to add it)

The TesalFi bloke hasn't added other brands yet (that I'm aware of). He has years of experience, and it would be a great cash-cow for him (I think it was a pay-my-way-through-Uni thing ... probably turned into a retire-when-I-leave-Uni thing!!)

I can't find any APPs for PowerWall - everything I've found is DIY / Boy's-Own

My day-job takes far too much of my time, and I think I'm well past the age of disassembling the Basic interpreter to add some keywords of my own ... so not sure I'd be any use in this field. But I'm going to have to do something soon ... can't be fagged to wait up until start of Off Peak to manually alter RESERVE and then fiddle with car charge rate during the day to balance it with PV output / PowerWall charge rate (and weather forecast, that I am using, is a lousy indicator of likely cloud density)

Perhaps I should sponsor a University Student Project ...