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MYLR vs Mach-e vs RAV4 Prime

DayTrippin

Member
Apr 30, 2021
795
813
Park Cities
I'm probably in the minority here, but a PHEV can make a lot of sense for people. I seriously shopped the Toyota prime RAV4 when it came out. It is so much better than the basic hybrid version with the extra power even with the limited for electric range, and made a pretty compelling option for us. It is about as quick as the single motor Y 0-60 and it isn't slow. We ended up buying an RDX instead of the prime as the Toyota dealers were just too greedy price wise and the latest gen's looks aren't as appealing to us. Rav4 just felt cheaper inside than the Acura and while it was quick, it was boring other than in a straight line. So we sacrificed fuel economy to have something more entertaining to drive.

We too had a PHEV C-Max. It really work quite well from my wife. She had to drive 50 miles to work she could charge for free then back home. So it's range was perfectly adequate for her. On a long trip we could go 500 miles on a tank without an issue. Yes, mileage could be better on the highway but in town it was very good. It was a pretty compact package with a high roof, and the auto park worked quite well. I still can't pry it away from my wife after 7 years of driving it.

@xls_ - give your situation, if you can get the Prime at retail, I would probably go with it if you can get it more quickly. Let the Teslas crazy demand settle a bit and see where they go with the next gen MY. You can easily drive your Rav4 for some time and like get out of it for free. Same is likely true for the MY but I suspect you'll get a Prime sooner than the MY. I've owned a ton of Toyotas and they've all been pretty much flawless with fit and finish and reliability. Tesla isn't there yet for everyone but our MYLR was put together very well.

If fun to drive is important to you though, the MY will be a better option. Keep in mind the range will never be what Tesla claims except in a very limited set of circumstances but the performance stats are dead on. Honestly, the MachE shouldn't even be in this conversation. It has a lot of promise but there are a lot of issues that need to be worked out. Maybe the next-gen will be even better than the Y. The Ford dealers are clueless about them and the charging network still sucks.

Trips will not be an issue on the MY even with the less than promised range. If you don't mind the extra money, you won't be disappointed but if cost is a bigger issue, the Rav4 isn't a bad option.
 

jsimon7777

Member
Feb 1, 2018
418
310
Castro Valley
The only, only reasons I'd take a Prime over an EV are:
1. I don't have the money for an EV.
2. I drive long distances semi-regularly.

Otherwise, it's a tossup between the MY and ME.
 
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ItsNotAboutTheMoney

Well-Known Member
Jul 12, 2012
11,054
8,866
Maine
I tried the plug in hybrid approach before with a Ford C-Max and I think you basically get the worst of both worlds, depending on your driving patterns. You'll get all the noise and maintenance of an ICE vehicle, and a very limited EV only mode range. The only appreciable benefits to me would be acquisition costs and unlimited ICE range.

My advice would be to get the Rav4 Hybrid skip the complexity / hassles / limitations of a plugin EV.
The C-Max Energi was a FWD car with 21 miles of rated range, no heat pump and an EV mode 0-60 of 15 seconds.
The RAV4 Prime is an AWD car with 42 miles of rated range, a heat pump and an EV mode 0-60 of 9.2 seconds.

It's like telling somebody not to buy a BEV because you owned a Gen 1 Leaf and you found the range too limiting.

OP said:
Most driving is around the local area, 20-ish miles / day with occasionally 100-ish on the weekend days.

They'd be driving electric a lot unless they live somewhere they have to use full defog a lot.
 

Tha_Ape

Member
Jun 15, 2021
264
188
Washington, DC
I'm probably in the minority here, but a PHEV can make a lot of sense for people.
I'm with you... I have a Prius Prime. It only has 25mi EV range and I still get like 2500mi/tank. Since it takes 87 and gets 50mpg, the gas cost is negligible. The tank is just over 10 gal. Thats why I initially wanted a Rav4 Prime.... I realized I could do 85% of my trips in the Prius with only 25mi range. 42 miles in a Rav4 Prime would easily cover 95% of my trips. To top it all off... the car is lighter so your Wh/mi are lower. Carrying around a ~80kWh battery for the long trip edge case makes the car weigh a lot more. My Prime has a ~9kWh battery. I was getting 170Wh/mi in my Prime. I still use the Prime over my MY if I'm going on a <25mi jaunt. Its more economical and unless I need the space, its more practical... bonus, I dont worry about door dings ;)

I'm happy I have the Tesla, but I have no hate for a Rav4 Prime. It really does make sense for a lot of people.
 

jsimon7777

Member
Feb 1, 2018
418
310
Castro Valley
I'm with you... I have a Prius Prime. It only has 25mi EV range and I still get like 2500mi/tank. Since it takes 87 and gets 50mpg, the gas cost is negligible. The tank is just over 10 gal. Thats why I initially wanted a Rav4 Prime.... I realized I could do 85% of my trips in the Prius with only 25mi range. 42 miles in a Rav4 Prime would easily cover 95% of my trips. To top it all off... the car is lighter so your Wh/mi are lower. Carrying around a ~80kWh battery for the long trip edge case makes the car weigh a lot more. My Prime has a ~9kWh battery. I was getting 170Wh/mi in my Prime. I still use the Prime over my MY if I'm going on a <25mi jaunt. Its more economical and unless I need the space, its more practical... bonus, I dont worry about door dings ;)

I'm happy I have the Tesla, but I have no hate for a Rav4 Prime. It really does make sense for a lot of people.
Still gotta go to the gas station, though. Blech!
 

Corndart

Member
Oct 11, 2021
322
361
Seattle
The C-Max Energi was a FWD car with 21 miles of rated range, no heat pump and an EV mode 0-60 of 15 seconds.
The RAV4 Prime is an AWD car with 42 miles of rated range, a heat pump and an EV mode 0-60 of 9.2 seconds.

It's like telling somebody not to buy a BEV because you owned a Gen 1 Leaf and you found the range too limiting.



They'd be driving electric a lot unless they live somewhere they have to use full defog a lot.
That's a great point in terms of the generational differences. My complaints about the range were fairly specific, overall the car was fine other than it eating 12v batteries every other year and some door trim clips falling off. Those were relatively minor issues.
 

MY-user

MYLR, 5s, OD9/10, EDD 1/09-2/06, 11/27-12/07, 1/21
Sep 15, 2021
179
123
Colorado
:p Haha, love the spirit here!
In all seriousness though, I'm pretty conservative with my money. That's the only reason why I'm in the position to afford a Model Y now. Just want to be reasonably sure I won't regret it.

Thanks for the feedback

I currently drive a 2009 Outback (don't judge - I do like driving) and am looking for a new car. Like at least a few other folks I've narrowed it down to Model Y, Mach-e and the RAV4 Prime.

I've only been able to test drive the Model Y. I was... blown away:cool:👍. The Toyota dealers are difficult to deal with and no Primes in stock, same with the mach-e. I think I prefer the Model Y over the mach-e anyway due to better charging infrastructure and more interior space.

The two main advantages (to me) of the Prime over the Model Y are price ($26K advantage for SE after taxes and rebates) and the fact that it's just like any other ICE car (with pretty good MPG) for road trips. We still have another hybrid car that we're currently using for traveling, so we can always fall back on that should we find the Tesla to be too tedious (I think we'll be fine with the SC network). Our road trips aren't that far or often. I'd say 4-5 times a year we go 400-ish miles each way. Most driving is around the local area, 20-ish miles / day with occasionally 100-ish on the weekend days.

I guess most would probably cross-shop the Model Y with the Prime XSE PP, but even there is still an $18K difference after taxes and rebates.

Has anyone here been deciding between a Prime and the Model Y, then ended up with the Model Y and is now regretting their decision and wished they had gotten the Prime instead?
When I test drove M3 and then MY, I couldn't stop smiling how accommodating those cars were and how "rude" my current CRV felt after the test drive. Get MY and do not look at MSRP only. $/mile both fuel and maintenance are less expensive in MY as well as the resale value. In the end the cost difference might be just a couple of thousand if that but you get superior safety and a lot of pleasure driving.
 

voxel

Bought demo MYLR on 10/18. Traded for Mach-E 11/19
Aug 24, 2021
407
324
Altamonte Springs
You are doing the EXACT comparison I was doing when shopping for a new car. Rav4 Prime was by first pick, but the dealership wanted 11k over MSRP. That pushed me to the full EV market. Ford was looking promising, but I was concerned about the recharge stations. I'm honestly less concerned now than I was a few months ago, but a few months ago I chose Tesla due to the network.

I still get salty when I see a Rav4 Prime though ;) That said, I dont regret my decision. But if Toyota would have had the top-of-the-line Rav4 Prime in stock for MSRP, it would have been a slam dunk for them. I'm just not paying $11k over retail.

Same boat as you but Toyota dealerships are scum. At least be upfront about the markup (many were not) or allow an order system where you can wait for one (current system is more of a dealer allocation system - no guarantees).

Still... the main reason for a PHEV/Prime is the range for road trips... which I hate doing anyhow so I decided to go BEV. I now won't go back to driving an ICE car full time.
 

xls_

“Within spec.”
Oct 13, 2021
11
6
USA
I did put down the deposit for MYLR now. 😮😎 The discussion here has been very good, with a slight bias (expected and understandable) but useful nonetheless.
There was another point that came up during my decision process and that is how much the car stands out and possibly attracts vandalism or thieves. I think the RAV4 ranks lowest and the Mach-e ranks highest of the three. The MY is somewhere in the middle, partially because there are a lot of them where I live (SF Bay Area). My current car (old Subaru) is hard to beat to that category 😄
It wasn’t enough to deter me. The fun-to-drive factor is mostly what won me over. I used to have cars that were much more fun-to-drive, Miata and a heavily modded VW before the Outback.

Anyway I’m looking forward to next April now 😭
 

MY-user

MYLR, 5s, OD9/10, EDD 1/09-2/06, 11/27-12/07, 1/21
Sep 15, 2021
179
123
Colorado
I did put down the deposit for MYLR now. 😮😎 The discussion here has been very good, with a slight bias (expected and understandable) but useful nonetheless.
There was another point that came up during my decision process and that is how much the car stands out and possibly attracts vandalism or thieves. I think the RAV4 ranks lowest and the Mach-e ranks highest of the three. The MY is somewhere in the middle, partially because there are a lot of them where I live (SF Bay Area). My current car (old Subaru) is hard to beat to that category 😄
It wasn’t enough to deter me. The fun-to-drive factor is mostly what won me over. I used to have cars that were much more fun-to-drive, Miata and a heavily modded VW before the Outback.

Anyway I’m looking forward to next April now 😭
Think of it this way, at least with MY you will have a video clip of the vandalism 😅
 

jsimon7777

Member
Feb 1, 2018
418
310
Castro Valley
I did put down the deposit for MYLR now. 😮😎 The discussion here has been very good, with a slight bias (expected and understandable) but useful nonetheless.
There was another point that came up during my decision process and that is how much the car stands out and possibly attracts vandalism or thieves. I think the RAV4 ranks lowest and the Mach-e ranks highest of the three. The MY is somewhere in the middle, partially because there are a lot of them where I live (SF Bay Area). My current car (old Subaru) is hard to beat to that category 😄
It wasn’t enough to deter me. The fun-to-drive factor is mostly what won me over. I used to have cars that were much more fun-to-drive, Miata and a heavily modded VW before the Outback.

Anyway I’m looking forward to next April now 😭
You're going to want to budget for coilovers.
 

xls_

“Within spec.”
Oct 13, 2021
11
6
USA
You're going to want to budget for coilovers.
What makes you say that? Rough ride of the MY? I think I’ll be fine 🤞. Tried to find some rough roads during the test drive and it seemed ok. But there are definitely worse roads around than those that I found.
 

jsimon7777

Member
Feb 1, 2018
418
310
Castro Valley
What makes you say that? Rough ride of the MY? I think I’ll be fine 🤞. Tried to find some rough roads during the test drive and it seemed ok. But there are definitely worse roads around than those that I found.
The suspension is a floppy mess. It gives no confidence when driving quickly. Undersprung. Underdamped. The car flops around on bumps and in turns. Our Subaru Forester is much better. It rolls more, but it controls over bumps far better. The Subaru will lean then take a set and do fine. The MY will lean less but never seems to settle down. It's terribly disappointing. It's not failed suspension like it's broken. Our Forester was much worse when the rear struts died. It's just poorly designed.
 
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Calliope

Member
May 29, 2021
190
102
Toronto, Canada
I switched from a Leaf to a Model Y, and I was unprepared for how helpful the Supercharger network is. Not just for speed (I expected that), but for utility -- there were so many times that L3 chargers were unavailable because they were offline, under repair, or being used, but there seems always to be at least 1 Supercharger available when I get there, even on holiday weekends. That's been more of a relief than I realized it would be. This has been an unexpected benefit of driving a Tesla that is now making me re-think other EVs (for the next few years, at least).
 
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Apprunner

Member
Jul 2, 2019
578
683
So-cal
I switched from a Leaf to a Model Y, and I was unprepared for how helpful the Supercharger network is. Not just for speed (I expected that), but for utility -- there were so many times that L3 chargers were unavailable because they were offline, under repair, or being used, but there seems always to be at least 1 Supercharger available when I get there, even on holiday weekends. That's been more of a relief than I realized it would be. This has been an unexpected benefit of driving a Tesla that is now making me re-think other EVs (for the next few years, at least).

I really admire some of the other EVs coming out like Rivian and the EQS. However, I'm not ready to go with another brand simply due to the Supercharger network. Even in Tesla heavy areas like California, there are a TON of Supercharging stations that are open, wherever i go. Its Tesla's greatest advantage in the market right now.
 
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xls_

“Within spec.”
Oct 13, 2021
11
6
USA
Yeah agreed with the SC network. That and the interior space was what kind of killed the mach-e right out of the gate for me. I do like the mach-e and I'm happy that Tesla has some healthy competition now.

Also, I keep coming to this message board and reading up on "stuff". Sigh.... this is going to be a looong wait until April ⏳
 

kathya

Member
Sep 5, 2021
15
17
NY
We've had our Rav4 Prime for a couple of months now. Still waiting on our MYP as our second car. Personally, we feel the Rav4Prime is awesome. Most of our typical weekly driving uses only electric. However, it is nice to have the gas engine if we wish to go longer. I'll be interested to see which car we grab when we are taking a longer road trip in the future. We "only" paid MSRP for our Rav4 Prime -- to this day we are not sure why the dealer let us pay "only" that much when dealers were selling them for so much more. We needed a car and thought it would be a Tesla. Then, we ran into this crazy long wait for the Tesla. Thus, the Tesla is becoming car #2 (we've been living with one car for the entire pandemic as we were not leaving home often and expect that to change soon). We were eligible for the $7500 rebate on the Rav4Prime also -- so it was a great choice for us.
 

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