Purchased this car and it’s on its way. I called Tesla to confirm via VIN if this is a stealth or performance model 3. For some reason he wasn’t able to make sure of it so I’m left wondering what it is. The previous owner modified the car. The tires are 19 inch sport wheels, the calipers are silver, and it has non Tesla rims. It has track mode enabled as well. The details on the Tesla website also state these have 19 inch sport wheels. But the customer service guy asked me if the visual of the car on the display had red calipers or not and I said yes. He then stated that this was a P3D+. But wouldn’t a P3D+ have 20 inch wheels listed on the vehicle description online? Can you guys help me confirm whether this is a performance or stealth please?
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Need help identifying if it’s a P3D- or P3D+
- Thread starter givemeFSD
- Start date
Purchased this car and it’s on its way. I called Tesla to confirm via VIN if this is a stealth or performance model 3. For some reason he wasn’t able to make sure of it so I’m left wondering what it is. The previous owner modified the car. The tires are 19 inch sport wheels, the calipers are silver, and it has non Tesla rims. It has track mode enabled as well. The details on the Tesla website also state these have 19 inch sport wheels. But the customer service guy asked me if the visual of the car on the display had red calipers or not and I said yes. He then stated that this was a P3D+. But wouldn’t a P3D+ have 20 inch wheels listed on the vehicle description online? Can you guys help me confirm whether this is a performance or stealth please?
fluxcapacitor
Banned
This looks like the performance to me but downgraded to 19 inch wheels. The red caliper should indicate its a performance for sure
Unless the previous owner took off the performance brakes, silver calipers indicate that the car was not delivered with the performance package brakes. The pic of the car in the display doesnt matter for this, I dont think.
There isnt any way to see this by vin. The other items beside the brakes in the performance pack (pedals, spoiler, etc) are all visual (some would argue the brakes are visual as well, but thats a different discussion).
While its possible, I havent read of anyone taking OFF the performance brakes, so silver brakes = stealth, to me.
I dont have a stealth though, so I dont know if the car graphic on those changes with wheel choice.
There isnt any way to see this by vin. The other items beside the brakes in the performance pack (pedals, spoiler, etc) are all visual (some would argue the brakes are visual as well, but thats a different discussion).
While its possible, I havent read of anyone taking OFF the performance brakes, so silver brakes = stealth, to me.
I dont have a stealth though, so I dont know if the car graphic on those changes with wheel choice.
I am thinking the calipers were painted from red to silver. The previous owner wanted a more black on black design on his car from what I could see. Rims are black, brake caliper is darker, and both the line and dual motor stamp on the back were painted black.
They definitely could be painted, if they went for that look. I dont think you will be able to tell... and since its all cosmetic anyway on a car someone took some time to modify, it likely wouldnt matter much.
There isnt any difference in functionality between a stealth and a model 3 performance with the performance package. The "p3d" stuff is forum speak, tesla never called these cars anything like that.
Its:
Tesla model 3 Performance
And
Tesla Model 3 Performance with performane upgrade Package.
In any case, you may need to wait till you get the car, but at least you know 100% its a performance vehicle.
CarlThompson
Member
Telling us the build date / year of the car might help! If I recall correctly there was only a stealth option until July 2020.
And if I recall correctly stealth cars did not get track mode. So if your car has it that would suggest it was originally sold with the performance upgrades.
EDIT: Some Googling tells me that the stealth did in fact get track mode so my memory failed.
And if I recall correctly stealth cars did not get track mode. So if your car has it that would suggest it was originally sold with the performance upgrades.
EDIT: Some Googling tells me that the stealth did in fact get track mode so my memory failed.
GreenHokie
Member
My guess is the OP bought a Performance without the Upgrade Package (aka Stealth).
Tesla’s Upgrade Package came with larger brake calipers, which were also a different shape than those supplied on the Performance models without the Upgrade Package. See photos from below. The first photo shows the rear calipers that come with the Upgrade Package. The second photo shows the rear calipers on Performance models without the Upgrade Package.
So, take a closer look at your rear brake calipers and you‘ll have the answer…
By the way, having red calipers on your visualization screen does not necessarily mean that the vehicle was supplied with the Upgrade Package. I am proof of that. My Stealth came with the standard silver colored brake calipers. However, they show up as red on my visualization screen. I did paint my calipers red, but never informed Tesla. Maybe they are spying on me!!
Tesla’s Upgrade Package came with larger brake calipers, which were also a different shape than those supplied on the Performance models without the Upgrade Package. See photos from below. The first photo shows the rear calipers that come with the Upgrade Package. The second photo shows the rear calipers on Performance models without the Upgrade Package.
So, take a closer look at your rear brake calipers and you‘ll have the answer…
By the way, having red calipers on your visualization screen does not necessarily mean that the vehicle was supplied with the Upgrade Package. I am proof of that. My Stealth came with the standard silver colored brake calipers. However, they show up as red on my visualization screen. I did paint my calipers red, but never informed Tesla. Maybe they are spying on me!!
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The M3P PUP brakes are actually an upgrade, it's not just a paint job. Better calipers and rotors, and I'm sure the pads are different too. There was a clear pedal feel difference even on my quick test drives, and I've read the PUP brakes hold up to hard driving / high heat better. I'm pretty sure the PUP always included this brake upgrade, it was never red paint on the base calipers. Btw Tesla is adamant the PUP rear spoiler is functional too, they're speed-limiting new M3Ps built without it (due to parts shortage).
Don't get me wrong, selling extra cost red paint on the exact same brakes is absolutely something Tesla would do - they used to have that exact option for the S, $500 for red painted calipers instead of black. Same exact brakes.
I believe the M3P PUP brakes were always a true upgrade though.
Of course repainting calipers is not unusual, neither are big brake kits with new calipers among track day enthusiasts and such. So no matter what brakes you're expecting, verify the actual parts, don't assume anything from the paint color. Treat this like buying any used car that might have been modded...
I'm with @GreenHokie, very likely this is a "stealth" M3P without the PUP. If so and they promised the PUP (besides the wheels which they clearly disclosed), I would insist on either a discount (only you're okay without the PUP!) or undoing the whole sale.
Don't get me wrong, selling extra cost red paint on the exact same brakes is absolutely something Tesla would do - they used to have that exact option for the S, $500 for red painted calipers instead of black. Same exact brakes.
I believe the M3P PUP brakes were always a true upgrade though.Of course repainting calipers is not unusual, neither are big brake kits with new calipers among track day enthusiasts and such. So no matter what brakes you're expecting, verify the actual parts, don't assume anything from the paint color. Treat this like buying any used car that might have been modded...
I'm with @GreenHokie, very likely this is a "stealth" M3P without the PUP. If so and they promised the PUP (besides the wheels which they clearly disclosed), I would insist on either a discount (only you're okay without the PUP!) or undoing the whole sale.
That is a stealth. The track mode, “long range all wheel drive performance”, dual motor with redline in the software, red calipers in the digital rendering(based on VIN) are all indicators it is a performance. The 19 inch listing in the official Tesla description indicates it’s a stealth. Your own visual cues would be the brake calipers being gray. Enjoy your stealth!
It was listed as a long range model. I saw the red underline under the dual motor visual and thought the dealership had no clue it was a performance. Turns out I had no clue I was being sold a stealth instead. I thought I was getting a good deal at 53k. 2019 model with 14k miles. Not so sure anymore. The only good thing about is the FSD that comes with it so I guess it’s not terrible. Thoughts?The M3P PUP brakes are actually an upgrade, it's not just a paint job. Better calipers and rotors, and I'm sure the pads are different too. There was a clear pedal feel difference even on my quick test drives, and I've read the PUP brakes hold up to hard driving / high heat better. I'm pretty sure the PUP always included this brake upgrade, it was never red paint on the base calipers. Btw Tesla is adamant the PUP rear spoiler is functional too, they're speed-limiting new M3Ps built without it (due to parts shortage).
Don't get me wrong, selling extra cost red paint on the exact same brakes is absolutely something Tesla would do - they used to have that exact option for the S, $500 for red painted calipers instead of black. Same exact brakes.
Of course repainting calipers is not unusual, neither are big brake kits with new calipers among track day enthusiasts and such. So no matter what brakes you're expecting, verify the actual parts, don't assume anything from the paint color. Treat this like buying any used car that might have been modded...
I'm with @GreenHokie, very likely this is a "stealth" M3P without the PUP. If so and they promised the PUP (besides the wheels which they clearly disclosed), I would insist on either a discount (only you're okay without the PUP!) or undoing the whole sale.
CarlThompson
Member
You did buy a Performance. A stealth IS a Performance. Your car has the same power as any other Performance. Just with different brakes and wheels, and without a spoiler or lowered suspension. You can add those things if you like but personally I like the idea of having performance power without people knowing it!
Yep it's stealth. My stealth shows red calipers on the screen so I just assume for simplicity, Tesla has 1 image for performance regardless of which performance model it is.
I actually prefer this over the full performance just because I won't be tracking/autocrossing it and like being able to use the 18" aero wheels with hubcaps. At first I laughed that I would never use them, but on a long road trip where you're charging multiple times, I figured having it on does add up. So I use them on those trips.
As @CarlThompson stated, you have a performance car, just without a few items. But you can still put it in track mode, you can change it to RWD for drift, etc.
I actually prefer this over the full performance just because I won't be tracking/autocrossing it and like being able to use the 18" aero wheels with hubcaps. At first I laughed that I would never use them, but on a long road trip where you're charging multiple times, I figured having it on does add up. So I use them on those trips.
As @CarlThompson stated, you have a performance car, just without a few items. But you can still put it in track mode, you can change it to RWD for drift, etc.
Im not sure what you are asking here. "Stealth instead?" "The only good thing about it?".
Since you ask for thoughts, I will say that, in general, the MOST DESIRABLE model 3 performance is the stealth one. You can put on whatever wheels / tires you want (no issues with a strange lip preventing certain tires), you get all the speed of a performance, the same track mode, the same everything else, but no visual indication the car is any different from any other model 3.
The only physical difference is the brakes, and people who actually track the car many times change that out anyway.
Not having a spoiler or something would take you from thinking you got a good deal to "meh"?
I say this as a person who has a model 3 performance with performance package I bought new. I dont track my car and admit fully that I liked the visual bits and was willing to put up with the inconvenience of the 20 inch rims because I wanted the car to look different. with that being said, the best deal tesla ever offered was the model 3 stealth when it was only 2k more than a LR AWD.
You got the same deal you thought you got (most likely), a performance model 3 for whatever you paid, that someone dumped some money into with aftermarket parts.
Agreed 100%, stealth performance is a real M3P.
Spoiler should be cheap and trivial to put on if you want it (I haven't checked / confirmed that though). Tesla says it matters at very high speeds. Are they truthful? Don't know. Probably. If you drive 100+ mph might as well get the spoiler. Otherwise, doubt you'll feel any difference in normal highway driving, more for looks.
Metal pedals...whatever. I've had cars with and without. They look cooler when I'm car shopping. Then I buy the car and never notice them again.
The wheels...no functional benefit to the 20s besides that they came with performance summer tires. I took my 20s off with under 1000 miles on them, to downsize to 18s for less fragility and better ride on rough roads. So I basically paid for two whole sets of wheels+tires, wasting my original 20s. To some people the 20s have value for the looks, nothing wrong with that. To others like me, tire sidewall with the 20s is too short and the wheels are too fragile, they would break on the roads in my area (I know from experience).
The PUP suspension difference is extremely minimal. If you like your cars low, PUP springs won't be low enough for you anyways. And there is no appreciable performance benefit to the PUP springs. 99.99% of the reason M3P PUP gets better handling numbers in magazine test than LR / Stealth is the tires, that's all.
That leaves the brakes. The brakes are legit better. But do they matter on an EV? Well they feel better. Autocrossers and track day enthusiasts report better heat handling, and I believe that holds true even if you switch both to high temp rated pads + fluid (standard practice for track duty in almost any car). HOWEVER....M3P is an EV! You should be doing 99% of your street braking with regen or you're getting s*** for efficiency/range. Even when I'm really tearing up a twisty mountain road, I'm in Track Mode with regen cranked up extra high, still doing most of my braking with regen for a nice balance of range vs fast/fun. Track Mode is awesome and "stealth" M3P has it too!
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So why did I buy the PUP? Because it wasn't optional anymore in 2021. If it was still optional for $5k, maybe I would've bought it for the brakes, maybe not, really not sure. Zero plans to track this car but I might try auto-x with it. I do like the better brake pedal feel, and I like know that if I really throw the hammer down on a fun road they have extra to give...but in reality I just crank up Track Mode regen and mostly use that anyways. For sure the $ value is not there for the brakes for my street driving even though I do like them.
I hope this helps! Maybe you didn't get quite the deal you hoped for, but you still got a real M3P.
Spoiler should be cheap and trivial to put on if you want it (I haven't checked / confirmed that though). Tesla says it matters at very high speeds. Are they truthful? Don't know. Probably. If you drive 100+ mph might as well get the spoiler. Otherwise, doubt you'll feel any difference in normal highway driving, more for looks.
Metal pedals...whatever. I've had cars with and without. They look cooler when I'm car shopping. Then I buy the car and never notice them again.
The wheels...no functional benefit to the 20s besides that they came with performance summer tires. I took my 20s off with under 1000 miles on them, to downsize to 18s for less fragility and better ride on rough roads. So I basically paid for two whole sets of wheels+tires, wasting my original 20s.
To some people the 20s have value for the looks, nothing wrong with that. To others like me, tire sidewall with the 20s is too short and the wheels are too fragile, they would break on the roads in my area (I know from experience).The PUP suspension difference is extremely minimal. If you like your cars low, PUP springs won't be low enough for you anyways. And there is no appreciable performance benefit to the PUP springs. 99.99% of the reason M3P PUP gets better handling numbers in magazine test than LR / Stealth is the tires, that's all.
That leaves the brakes. The brakes are legit better. But do they matter on an EV? Well they feel better. Autocrossers and track day enthusiasts report better heat handling, and I believe that holds true even if you switch both to high temp rated pads + fluid (standard practice for track duty in almost any car). HOWEVER....M3P is an EV! You should be doing 99% of your street braking with regen or you're getting s*** for efficiency/range. Even when I'm really tearing up a twisty mountain road, I'm in Track Mode with regen cranked up extra high, still doing most of my braking with regen for a nice balance of range vs fast/fun. Track Mode is awesome and "stealth" M3P has it too!
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So why did I buy the PUP? Because it wasn't optional anymore in 2021.
If it was still optional for $5k, maybe I would've bought it for the brakes, maybe not, really not sure. Zero plans to track this car but I might try auto-x with it. I do like the better brake pedal feel, and I like know that if I really throw the hammer down on a fun road they have extra to give...but in reality I just crank up Track Mode regen and mostly use that anyways. For sure the $ value is not there for the brakes for my street driving even though I do like them.I hope this helps! Maybe you didn't get quite the deal you hoped for, but you still got a real M3P.
Stealth model 3 for sure. Dual Motor with red line under is the Performance software. 19" wheels are base model wheels. That's what the stealths are, Performance software motors with base model wheels. In 2018 cars that was the 18" wheel, yours had the 19" wheels. Bigger brakes on the PUP package, which helps if tracking car. Standard brakes work fine if not tracking car.
I have a 2018 Stealth.
I have a 2018 Stealth.
