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Theres already been been a similar thread...in any case, I have no problem with someone buying a salvage car and trying to fix it up if they're able. More power to you. And I have no problem with the mental masturbation that occurs afterwards in trying to do so...its what the forums are for....my problem is with the fact that you bad mouth Tesla and acting entitled like someone owes you something....if it's salvage fix it and don't bring Tesla into it....
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You're not picking it up? Fix your radar.
"So about a month ago I purchased a lightly damaged 2013 Model S 60kw with 2600 miles on it and have been trying to make it work again. Tesla will not sell me any parts due to the salvage status of the car, they don't even want me bring it into their service center. Their certified body shop told me that they are not allowed to work on salvage car. Which is a load of BS."
"Tesla is running on a very dangerous line here they gave certified shops a monopoly so they can charge what ever they want and insurance either has to pay or total a car. This should be illegal. Additionally they are going to hurt themselves in the long run. There will be more and more cars that will get into accidents and if insurance will need to total almost every car due to a fender bender, it will jack up the insurance rates or some insurance companies will not even want to insure Teslas."
This is the kind of s**t that usually gets picked up by the ignorant media and causes stocks to fall....
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spaceballs
Member
So looks like your unable to understand his view on this, I suggest you start another thread topic on what you feel is a problem so this thread doesn't get cluttered.
Why would you derail a perfectly good topic with this non-sense Dchint?
The OP is asking for advice and help from other members that might have run into similar issues or have experience repairing cars and you're coming here acting like a child.
There is already a topic about the San Diego owner, go share your negativism over there. I for once and I'm sure many others want to see OP succeed in his project and get the car running.
The OP is asking for advice and help from other members that might have run into similar issues or have experience repairing cars and you're coming here acting like a child.
There is already a topic about the San Diego owner, go share your negativism over there. I for once and I'm sure many others want to see OP succeed in his project and get the car running.
Fear of the media should not generally prevent people from posting their true experiences, whether good or bad. Besides, if Tesla is in the wrong on this issue, which appears to be case, then they will likely be more motivated to rectify the situation if it is apparent that enough people are concerned about it. Ultimately, that will be best for the EV movement.
TM simply cannot devote their best minds and craftspersons to fixing every salvageable car. Suggest that salvageurs assemble info and share their discoveries as they work on Teslas. Look to auctions for their future supply of parts. Operate as completely as possible separate from TM. As drivers seem to crash cars at an increasing rate the future looks good for parts supply.
All this will be possible since apparently TM has not permanently disabled anyone's salvage car so far, or even said they would [correct me if this is not true].
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All this will be possible since apparently TM has not permanently disabled anyone's salvage car so far, or even said they would [correct me if this is not true].
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lolachampcar
Well-Known Member
I think the rub here is that "normal" car companies document their product (service manuals) and diagnostic tools (there is an industry group that dispenses manufacturer test tool interface specifications so companies like AutoLogic can create diagnostic tools for independent service providers). Tesla has yet to do so. Tesla may be side stepping some of the right to repair laws with the over the air updates which remove the issue of "can your local shop re-flash/update that module?" argument.
Sooner or later, Tesla is going to have to come to grips with people working on their own cars. Gas explodes and can kill you just like high voltage. Both activities can be dangerous so that alone does not seem reason enough not to document your product. I'm not sure how long this software/silicon valley mentality is going to fly.
I would like a manual but have accepted that there is not one nor am I likely going to see one anytime soon. I would not buy a salvage for that reason. Now buying one for the reason WK057 bought the battery, now that is a different matter.
Sooner or later, Tesla is going to have to come to grips with people working on their own cars. Gas explodes and can kill you just like high voltage. Both activities can be dangerous so that alone does not seem reason enough not to document your product. I'm not sure how long this software/silicon valley mentality is going to fly.
I would like a manual but have accepted that there is not one nor am I likely going to see one anytime soon. I would not buy a salvage for that reason. Now buying one for the reason WK057 bought the battery, now that is a different matter.
You can look at this many ways but the fact is we all will see it different. I feel that Tesla should sell parts to hopefully insure that people aren't bypassing important safety features. If the car was built by Tesla and deemed repairable by the insurance company then as long as it is repaired correctly, why should Tesla or any one else care. I just feel that Tesla will have to take some of the responsibility for not supporting vehicles that they built if someone gets seriously hurt. If a car is unrepairable, it should be sold as a parts only car. Well anyways, thats just one point of view. I can see many arguments, I just wonder why most other car companies don't use this model.
I haven't dug into the question very deeply, but I suspect the right to repair law in MA (and the agreement that the industry adopted that mirrors it) doesn't apply to Tesla because it doesn't have franchised dealers.
stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
That's definitely a big part of it, but the reason may simply be differing priorities in engineering resources (focused on releasing Model X and Model 3) and the fact Tesla has so many ongoing internal revisions in the factory (so such a manual would need to be constantly updated). And until recently, local Tesla service centers don't even service the battery or drive unit (they just swap the whole thing).
And to address some others' points about Tesla inspecting salvage cars, I think it's totally reasonable for Tesla to do that. The new owner may claim that the damage is cosmetic or minor, but without inspecting the car thoroughly, Tesla doesn't know that (likely even the new owner doesn't). And if anything happens after Tesla agrees to work on the car, it's on Tesla.
lolachampcar
Well-Known Member
And to add to the need to inspect, something in the car's systems shut down functionality. This leads credence to the idea that there is something more than just cosmetic going on.
I wonder if the fact the OP charged it without any coolant in the battery damaged something.
Gizmotoy
Active Member
Right. I'm 100% for zhur's endevour to get the car back on the road, and think Tesla is overly-heavy-handed with salvage vehicles, but that strikes me as a horrible idea. Even if the rate is slow and the batteries stay cool, who knows what could have happened to the cooling system itself. Dry pumps can burn out and it seems pretty likely the system is designed to verify that it has coolant.
I think it's entirely possible that it WAS working, and suffered from unintentional, owner-inflicted damage that caused it to disable itself.
I'm not trying to bad mouth Tesla, I love Tesla and their product. I already sold 3 clean title damage free Tesla's was the first group of people to drive a tesla from Minneapolis to Fremont using the Supercharger network and own their stock. And I think they are the automotive future. Human nature is to love deal's a Tesla may be perfect in everyway but a $30k cheaper Tesla will be better. I'm experimenting and learning with this car so my company could fix and sell salvage tesla's to people. Allowing more people to have a chance of owning this wonderful automobile. Yes, I can go personally buy a new one but that's not the point. My entire company goal is to get more people into affordable EV's, biggest draw back on EV is the purchase cost. People love the idea that they don't have to buy gas they are sold on that idea.
There is no need to have Tesla engineers involved in this they did their job and designed a wonderful car. Any Ranger or service technician should easily be able to inspect the car and see if there are any issues with it. The car itself is very simple!! I just want to purchase parts for my project so it could be fixed without any corners cut. I'm an engineer myself and have a lot more experience with wrecked cars than an engineer designing some components for Tesla. I would love to take my Tesla to SC and have them inspect it after it's fixed. It would give a customer a piece of mind that the car was inspected by Tesla. The problem is Tesla does not want to sell me parts so I could fix it and does not want to inspect it. No I'm not their certified body shop I asked if could become one and they said I could not because they already have enough certified body shops in my area (one that is a large chain) tesla's aluminum is no different than Audi A8 aluminum and we have no problems working on the Audi's.
Anyways, back to my issues connected my ground good. Solenoids closed at the port was able to plug in the charge cord. Car still would not charge port was blinking red still the same error codes. Would turn white for a moment when charge cord was plugged in and turn blue for a moment when unplugged. Screen would read "charging will start momentarily" for about 30 seconds than would say charging stopped. After closing and opening my port shutting the car on and off a few times. Solenoids would not close anywhere and the car was at the same state as it was when ground was not tight. I had no cabin heat at anytime even when my port solenoids were functioning.
I'm thinking that Hella sensor part # 173 949 00 the negative terminal of the battery is bad. I will see if my Mercedes has a similar sensor. When I pushed down on it at first it was closing the solenoids and it does have some plastic melted on it. I think that is the switch which was mentioned earlier in the thread in the frunk and was replaced under warranty for someone. And had the same errors as me.
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I have antifreeze in car now and can hear fluid move around so the pumps are fine I don't think they can get hurt by running dry. Battery will not overheat charging at 12amps at that rate it would it would take 2.5 days to fully charge the battery!
There is no need to have Tesla engineers involved in this they did their job and designed a wonderful car. Any Ranger or service technician should easily be able to inspect the car and see if there are any issues with it. The car itself is very simple!! I just want to purchase parts for my project so it could be fixed without any corners cut. I'm an engineer myself and have a lot more experience with wrecked cars than an engineer designing some components for Tesla. I would love to take my Tesla to SC and have them inspect it after it's fixed. It would give a customer a piece of mind that the car was inspected by Tesla. The problem is Tesla does not want to sell me parts so I could fix it and does not want to inspect it. No I'm not their certified body shop I asked if could become one and they said I could not because they already have enough certified body shops in my area (one that is a large chain) tesla's aluminum is no different than Audi A8 aluminum and we have no problems working on the Audi's.
Anyways, back to my issues connected my ground good. Solenoids closed at the port was able to plug in the charge cord. Car still would not charge port was blinking red still the same error codes. Would turn white for a moment when charge cord was plugged in and turn blue for a moment when unplugged. Screen would read "charging will start momentarily" for about 30 seconds than would say charging stopped. After closing and opening my port shutting the car on and off a few times. Solenoids would not close anywhere and the car was at the same state as it was when ground was not tight. I had no cabin heat at anytime even when my port solenoids were functioning.
I'm thinking that Hella sensor part # 173 949 00 the negative terminal of the battery is bad. I will see if my Mercedes has a similar sensor. When I pushed down on it at first it was closing the solenoids and it does have some plastic melted on it. I think that is the switch which was mentioned earlier in the thread in the frunk and was replaced under warranty for someone. And had the same errors as me.
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I have antifreeze in car now and can hear fluid move around so the pumps are fine I don't think they can get hurt by running dry. Battery will not overheat charging at 12amps at that rate it would it would take 2.5 days to fully charge the battery!
Found a kit just need the switch: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Hella-IBSco...659799417?pt=DE_Autoteile&hash=item3cec23af79
Is it possible you spoke with the wrong person at Tesla?
There was a news story recently about Tesla wanting to do an inspection on a salvage vehicle. That article even posted the Tesla release form.
Article: Buying A Crashed Tesla Model S: Damage, Risk, Safety, Salvage, And Reporting
Liability Release Form: http://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/1305093/tesla-salvage-release.pdf
Good luck and I hope you get it working. I think Tesla is doing themselves a disservice by making this process so difficult on a car that seems repairable. This issue is only going to get more common as they crank out more of these cars in volume. Sounds like it will effect insurance rates if tons of vehicles just start getting written off as total losses with even modest damage.
Whoa, hold on a second. Before you change more parts on the car, I had this exact same thing happen to me. My car is not salvaged, nor did I have the other error messages, but I did have the "charging will start momentarily" for 30 sec, "charging stopped" messages AND the white then blue lights. Long-story-made-short, the switches inside the HPWC were set to the wrong amperages (for the breaker at the panel). I set the switches to their correct positions, then reset the HPWC and the problem was solved.
This may be a long shot; but have you tried charging with a different charge cord? 110v maybe? You could have a charging problem - or perhaps damage to electrical in the car is causing the system to detect a problem with the wall connector. Anyway, like I said this might be a long shot, but I've personally experienced this situation and figured it's worth passing along the information.
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BTW, YES, do have the car inspected by Tesla before you sell it to someone else! Please! You don't want to be sued if the new owner's house burns down because of an undetected problem, and they don't want their house to burn down or their families lives put in danger by an otherwise avoidable situation.
spaceballs
Member
Agreed battery would be fine. btw water pump on the Roadster will say Over-current if there is no fluid present... so if they have current detection in the roadster, I think they would have the same thing in the MS. Also regarding my water pump, today was the first time I've ever seen the water heater system kick on when charging the roadster! (been cold here in Washington of late.)
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At the moment I don't think Tesla service center will sign off on a salvage car regardless of how good condition it's in.
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I would be worried about the charger itself - the one(s) under the rear seat. They are liquid cooled - you don't want to charge unless they are getting fluid as they will easily overheat. Not sure if they're the same coolant loop or if there are multiple, though.