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NEMA 6-15 on existing 14 gauge wire

Discussion in 'Charging Standards and Infrastructure' started by cmyke, Sep 13, 2018.

  1. cmyke

    cmyke Member

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    I’ve gotten estimates to install a 14-50, and they’re high. Mostly because it’s a 50ft run from the electrical box to the garage.

    I have an existing outlet in the garage already on its own dedicated circuit. 14 gauge wire.

    Could I simply remove the existing 120v receptacle and install a 240v 6-15 to get double the charging speed?
     
  2. iluvmacs

    iluvmacs Member

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    That plus changing the breaker & panel wiring, yes.
     
  3. Cosmacelf

    Cosmacelf Well-Known Member

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    Yes. Why was the receptacle dedicated?
     
  4. linkster

    linkster Active Member

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    Cos

    My FL 'hood has over 50,000 homes, all with a dedicated outlet in the garage.
     
  5. hmerrill3

    hmerrill3 Member

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    In other words, to answer the OP's question directly, NO.

    If you have to change the breaker and wiring, you are not saving anything. I'm not an electrician, but I'm unsure that 14 gauge wire is rated for the continuous load your car is going to draw.
     
  6. SSedan

    SSedan Member

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    In MD you are going to face WINTER and that circuit is not going to warm the battery well.

    I am going to say no this is not an option.

    If the garage is heated and your commute modest you might limp along but in a place that sees winter this is not a reasonable plan.

    Now granted I am in a colder place, Wisconsin, but I decided a 30amp 240 outlet was insufficient. I got by but battery warming was slow and cabin warmup+ battery warming could actually pull more power than the wall delivered and would consume some miles even plugged in. Scheduled charging did not work well for me because with the limited power supply and cold temps sometimes battery warming was slow and I would find the car still charging, or if the night was warmer I would find the charging ended so early and the battery cold again.
     
  7. cmyke

    cmyke Member

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    I didn’t consider battery warming. Thanks for that.

    Back to the NEMA 14-50 plan. I’ll just pay the $1500.
     
  8. Cosmacelf

    Cosmacelf Well-Known Member

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    You don’t need an electrician to change a breaker. You won’t need to run extra wire. And 14 gauge is indeed rated for 12A continuous.
     
    • Like x 2
  9. SSedan

    SSedan Member

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    Winter seems to be a foreign concept to a majority here, and folks neglect to consider the dramatic energy use increase that can come with it.

    If the wire is a hassle to run why not consider springing for the extra material cost now to be able to support a wall connector later. The material cost is NOT that great especially when a HCWC uses one less conductor if you do that from the start OR could run larger wire and use a 6-50 adapter and only need three wires for a 50amp outlet if you think there is real chance you might do a wall connector later.

    Bigger wire gives you the option of potentially installing a second wall connector later for load sharing.

    I think most of us here believe EVs will gain popularity and an extra $30 on bigger wire now may make a second garage charging station in the garage $50-100 in hookup later vs. another $1500 all over again.

    IMO $1500 is high but I don't know your exact circumstance. I suspect that is what they figure a job needs to pay incase they can't schedule a second one that day.

    I got 2 quotes for natural gas lines in my house, both were about $1600 for 40ft, above drop ceiling, only appliance hookup would be a gas range but putting fittings in place to allow other appliances too. It is not that big a job, but it what they want to make for the crew for the day. Call it a minimum charge for all but the smallest jobs.
     
  10. ewoodrick

    ewoodrick Member

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    I'd say that is a dangerous statement to make. If you have to ask the question, then yes, you should use an electrician. Opening the panel isn't something that anyone without the correct training and tools should do. Please don't make it sound as if a normal person can do this.

    There is 240V in the panel completely uninsulated. Fire and death are pretty easy to occur.
     
    • Disagree x 1
  11. Cosmacelf

    Cosmacelf Well-Known Member

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    I disagree. Have you heard of things called books? Youtube videos? People can learn relatively simple tasks like opening up an electrical panel without hurting themselves. It isn't hard. "Amateurs" operate power saws every day, something far more dangerous that an electrical panel.

    At any rate, that's why people come to forums, to learn. If you're worried about people opening up electrical panels, then provide some info about what they should be careful about and what they need to learn to do so.
     
    • Like x 1
  12. Rocky_H

    Rocky_H Active Member

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    Because the outlet is $7.50, and the breaker is $18. It costs barely anything to try this simple method and see how tolerable or convenient/inconvenient it is before deciding if it's necessary to do something more involved and expensive.
     
    • Like x 1
  13. SSedan

    SSedan Member

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    Till you have to try and come up with a fix and it is 12f and windy out
     
  14. linkster

    linkster Active Member

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    I find it entertaining to “watch” the uniformed go up against Cos and Rock.

    ewood, at least you correctly stated 240V instead of 220, however, I much prefered to get blasted off (still not fun!) 277V (commercial) over getting locked on 120V, but that’s just me....

    cmyke, you should be able to save a few bucks and copper by installing a 6-50 since there isn’t an EV on the planet that requires a neutral for 240V charging.
     
    • Like x 1
  15. Rocky_H

    Rocky_H Active Member

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    Damn! You really have a problem with projection of your situation onto everyone else. This person lives in Silver Spring, MD. It's a Washington D.C. suburb that has 4 Tesla Superchargers within a 20 mile radius. This instantaneous emergency that would prevent someone from trying a 6-15 outlet for a while is a myth. If it's not working very well through the winter, then they can deal with using other charging stations for a few weeks until they get something better installed.
     

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