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New Oregon Superchargers (2018)

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Salt lake is closer and bigger. Tricities is the same distance and bigger. I think he’s probably right on that.

can you get data on how much a particular road receives in traffic? It seems like it would be a relatively simple matter if it was offered to get a start on it. If it meets a threshold, go and investigate further.

I do very much like the argument that it opens options for tesla owners that are ideologically aligned with the companies mission. I think that putting them in national parks is a non starter because of government and competition issues, but ones like in west yellowstone should be quite doable.
 
I have sent multiple emails to Tesla with use case info for this route. Thanks to Bowers Wealth Management there are now 2 16 kW
chargers at Say When. I had asked him what help he needed to install the 2nd one this year and all he said was get a plaque for each. I placed those in April. If we can get Rome Station it will be thanks to the willing owner. Perhaps if can get more owners to email Tesla we can influence SC decision

I don't know if you even realized the extra irony in replying this to @Vic_F. He is our hero for chatting on Facebook with the owners of Rome Station on U.S. highway 95 between Boise and Winnemucca and getting them to contact Tesla directly to offer to host a Supercharger there. And I have also contacted Tesla to request that they respond to Rome Station's offer. So yes, not just opining or whining.
Rome Station, Oregon (Hwy 95)


Well...this is like a Shroedinger's cat situation, and I see people say this kind of thing often: "Tesla has all the data and knows all about it." No--they don't. How can you analyze data that doesn't exist? They can't know about the reason why a particular Tesla car is sitting in someone's garage for 3 or 4 days because they are having to drive their gasoline car on a trip that the electric car doesn't really work for. There is no method for Tesla to get the information that that's what is happening or where the person is going.
 
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I do very much like the argument that it opens options for tesla owners that are ideologically aligned with the companies mission. I think that putting them in national parks is a non starter because of government and competition issues, but ones like in west yellowstone should be quite doable.

A national park wouldn't actually be the ideal location for a supercharger. You would want one like 50 to 60 miles FROM a national park. You could supercharge to 80%, head to the national park and spend the day there, and then on your trip home cruise into the supercharger and charge up for the trip back home. Putting them in more remote areas (so not where a big town is) and on secondary highways (not larger interstates) helps to expand that ability. I think when people see them on secondary routes and in smaller towns they go right away to "You seriously think a town of 20,000 people out in a somewhat remote area of the state needs a supercharger?! No one in that town owns a Tesla, that's stupid." Instead, you need to look at where the bubble gets you. It might open up the travel to summer national parks, winter skiing, etc. This is the area Tesla needs to nail next to again be multiple steps ahead of all the other guys. Suddenly you can be a Tesla only family and travel where you need/want to go. If you have two somewhat old cars you don't have to think about wanting the new safer one to be the one able to make the summer road trips to the national park and err on the side of caution with getting a gas car. With the lower prices it opens the options to more families that may have one old 7+ year old car and then one car that's being replaced. Obviously the new car will be the road trip car because it's safer and more reliable. Right now in some use cases that might preclude it from being a Tesla.

I actually do think national parks would be a good location for Tesla destination chargers though. I would think working with the government wouldn't be toooo hard in that sense as long as Tesla covered the costs and installed universal chargers too. I wouldn't expect a lot, but maybe three or four destination chargers and two universal L2 chargers at the main parking lot of the largest national parks. If they have lodging in them then Tesla probably can just work with the company managing the lodge in the park.
 
If you do, it is unsafe.

I would quibble with this statement. I’ve charged in Burns many times and find it to be a cute, little town. Granted, being forced to charge for 2 hours is not fun but we mange to make the best of it by having a leisurely breakfast or lunch at the nearby coffee shop and shopping at the well-stocked kitchen store. I’ve never charged overnight so I have no idea what its like at night, but it is across the street from the Oregon State Patrol office.
 
Salt lake is closer and bigger. Tricities is the same distance and bigger. I think he’s probably right on that.

can you get data on how much a particular road receives in traffic? It seems like it would be a relatively simple matter if it was offered to get a start on it. If it meets a threshold, go and investigate further.

I do very much like the argument that it opens options for tesla owners that are ideologically aligned with the companies mission. I think that putting them in national parks is a non starter because of government and competition issues, but ones like in west yellowstone should be quite doable.

SLC isn't closer. 339 miles driving vs 318 to Bend. So yes, Bend is the only city of consequence within a 318mile radius of Boise. Also... you are missing the point entirely. Bend is a destination city. If you live in Boise and can't even get to the destination near you... the value of buying a tesla is diminished severely. A great car doesn't do you much good if you can't drive it.
 
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I would quibble with this statement. I’ve charged in Burns many times and find it to be a cute, little town. Granted, being forced to charge for 2 hours is not fun but we mange to make the best of it by having a leisurely breakfast or lunch at the nearby coffee shop and shopping at the well-stocked kitchen store. I’ve never charged overnight so I have no idea what its like at night, but it is across the street from the Oregon State Patrol office.

I've also charged in burns four or five times and yeah during the day it is fine, but I do charge there at night and it is really sketchy at night. Also that police station across the street is abandoned.
 
Putting them in more remote areas (so not where a big town is) and on secondary highways (not larger interstates) helps to expand that ability. I think when people see them on secondary routes and in smaller towns they go right away to "You seriously think a town of 20,000 people out in a somewhat remote area of the state needs a supercharger?! No one in that town owns a Tesla, that's stupid." Instead, you need to look at where the bubble gets you.
I have heard that several times. Very specifically, I heard someone making fun of Tesla when they happened to see that they built a Supercharger in Lima, MT for this very reason: "There aren't any Teslas in Lima, MT. That's stupid!" Lima literally has a population of less than 250 people! So yeah, of course it is not for the zero Teslas there in that town. But it is to split up the 200+ mile route on Interstate 15 between Butte and Idaho Falls.
 
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I have heard that several times. Very specifically, I heard someone making fun of Tesla when they happened to see that they built a Supercharger in Lima, MT for this very reason: "There aren't any Teslas in Lima, MT. That's stupid!" Lima literally has a population of less than 250 people! So yeah, of course it is not for the zero Teslas there in that town. But it is to split up the 200+ mile route on Interstate 15 between Butte and Idaho Falls.
The other one I get is "I drive by the Aberdeen supercharger all the time and it's always empty!" to which I respond "I just drove by 4 empty gas stations!"
 
A national park wouldn't actually be the ideal location for a supercharger. You would want one like 50 to 60 miles FROM a national park. You could supercharge to 80%, head to the national park and spend the day there, and then on your trip home cruise into the supercharger and charge up for the trip back home. Putting them in more remote areas (so not where a big town is) and on secondary highways (not larger interstates) helps to expand that ability. I think when people see them on secondary routes and in smaller towns they go right away to "You seriously think a town of 20,000 people out in a somewhat remote area of the state needs a supercharger?! No one in that town owns a Tesla, that's stupid." Instead, you need to look at where the bubble gets you. It might open up the travel to summer national parks, winter skiing, etc. This is the area Tesla needs to nail next to again be multiple steps ahead of all the other guys. Suddenly you can be a Tesla only family and travel where you need/want to go. If you have two somewhat old cars you don't have to think about wanting the new safer one to be the one able to make the summer road trips to the national park and err on the side of caution with getting a gas car. With the lower prices it opens the options to more families that may have one old 7+ year old car and then one car that's being replaced. Obviously the new car will be the road trip car because it's safer and more reliable. Right now in some use cases that might preclude it from being a Tesla.

I actually do think national parks would be a good location for Tesla destination chargers though. I would think working with the government wouldn't be toooo hard in that sense as long as Tesla covered the costs and installed universal chargers too. I wouldn't expect a lot, but maybe three or four destination chargers and two universal L2 chargers at the main parking lot of the largest national parks. If they have lodging in them then Tesla probably can just work with the company managing the lodge in the park.

I might only argue on the distance from the part for super chargers. I think Kalispell, for example, is about the perfect distance from glacier for a supercharger. Yakima is a little far from rainier but also close enough I think.

for parts themselves, I think nema 14-50 outlets are a good choice. Multifunction. Just put them in parking lots, cheap, etc.

I think we agree on the main point, though - putting chargers in that are near places that are ideologically aligned isn’t the worst idea. Then again, I’m for chargers everywhere ;)
 
for parts themselves, I think nema 14-50 outlets are a good choice. Multifunction. Just put them in parking lots, cheap, etc.
Well, that's what we are trying to get past. Every wide spot in the road that calls itself a town has an RV park or campground with 14-50 outlets. We don't need more of those installed. They are all over the place. You really can go anywhere you want to already if you are willing to take multi-hour recharging stops on 14-50 outlets. This is about places that need DC fast charging to make it tolerable.
 
Well, that's what we are trying to get past. Every wide spot in the road that calls itself a town has an RV park or campground with 14-50 outlets. We don't need more of those installed. They are all over the place. You really can go anywhere you want to already if you are willing to take multi-hour recharging stops on 14-50 outlets. This is about places that need DC fast charging to make it tolerable.

I was addressing acarney’s comment about destination chargers. I don’t intend for those to be a solution for cross country travel. They are relatively comparable to destination chargers, however, and parks are a destination, not generally a place you are just passing through.

And sadly, on the east side of Rainier there are remarkably few of even slow nema 14-50 chargers.

as for Burns, I still would like to see data on the amount of traffic on that road. Is it a strategic route? Does it get enough traffic, tesla or not, to warrant it? Perhaps the oregon DOT has some data on it?
 
I was addressing acarney’s comment about destination chargers. I don’t intend for those to be a solution for cross country travel. They are relatively comparable to destination chargers, however, and parks are a destination, not generally a place you are just passing through.

And sadly, on the east side of Rainier there are remarkably few of even slow nema 14-50 chargers.

as for Burns, I still would like to see data on the amount of traffic on that road. Is it a strategic route? Does it get enough traffic, tesla or not, to warrant it? Perhaps the oregon DOT has some data on it?

https://www.oregon.gov/ODOT/Data/Documents/TVT_2018.pdf

Oregon refers to its highways in an unusual fashion. Oregon names its highways and assigns sequential numbers to them. Therefore, the name and the number do not correspond to its signed number. Signed highways like US20 from the coast through Bend, Burns, and onto Vale and Ontario will be split into three or four discrete segments. It is sorta hard to ferret out the highways by looking at the attached table.

As near as I can tell, the traffic through Hines and Burns on US20 is about 3,000 to 6,000 vehicles per day. Of course, looking at the outlying counts, most of this traffic is local. The traffic on US395 between John Day and Burns is well under 1,000 vehicles per day.

I assume that these are annual averages, so winter travel brings these averages down from summer numbers.
 
https://www.oregon.gov/ODOT/Data/Documents/TVT_2018.pdf

Oregon refers to its highways in an unusual fashion. Oregon names its highways and assigns sequential numbers to them. Therefore, the name and the number do not correspond to its signed number. Signed highways like US20 from the coast through Bend, Burns, and onto Vale and Ontario will be split into three or four discrete segments. It is sorta hard to ferret out the highways by looking at the attached table.

As near as I can tell, the traffic through Hines and Burns on US20 is about 3,000 to 6,000 vehicles per day. Of course, looking at the outlying counts, most of this traffic is local. The traffic on US395 between John Day and Burns is well under 1,000 vehicles per day.

I assume that these are annual averages, so winter travel brings these averages down from summer numbers.

that is a fair nightmare to figure out. However, the road we are talking about is the central Oregon highway. There is a line for the boarder crossing. 4100 vehicles. By the time you are looking at the burns automatic traffic recover at ~500. There is a point by Riley and that’s looking at ~200.

I’m just thinking there is not enough traffic to move it up a priority list before a good many other places.
 
that is a fair nightmare to figure out. However, the road we are talking about is the central Oregon highway. There is a line for the boarder crossing. 4100 vehicles. By the time you are looking at the burns automatic traffic recover at ~500. There is a point by Riley and that’s looking at ~200.

I’m just thinking there is not enough traffic to move it up a priority list before a good many other places.
Like I said, it's one of the most desolate places in North America. Even though it does link the Boise megalopolis with its nearest metropolitan area (Bend).

That being said, before people take offense to my sarcasm, I should point out that I've been an advocate of a Burns supercharger for years. But the reason they would build it is to make it so you can take your Tesla anywhere in the country and not have to worry about using anything but superchargers. It would not be to enable the throngs of Teslas traveling from Boise to Bend on a daily basis.
 
Having a supercharger in places like Burns bolsters what will be the greatest factor in why someone would choose a Tesla over other EVs. The capability of going places where there is no other dc charging. Charging for CCS is close to covering major interstates but there are plenty of highways you can't go and large swaths of territory that is impossible to reach. It's like having US Cellular network coverage vs. Verizon or AT&T. Electrify America doesn't even have the 101 planned for charging.
 
I noticed a comment in a Tesla FB group:

"While charging in Burns yesterday, the Chamber of Commerce advised that Tesla had pulled a permit for 8 Superchargers. A much needed location for Central Oregon." Thanks Sue!
I finally have something concrete on this, but still not quite specific enough to say exactly what it is. Since this rumor, I have been checking the Oregon building permits page, and I finally found something for a high power car charging station, but it doesn't say whether it's Electrify America or Tesla or some other company. I have emailed the company, asking if they can tell me that detail of whose kind of station they will be installing. I'll create a new thread for it once I can get an answer to title the thread with what brand of station it is, whether Supercharger or something else.

Anyway, here is the permit. The description of the project says "Car Charging Station, located behind the Chamber building - 3 phase 480V"

Accela Citizen Access
 
I finally have something concrete on this, but still not quite specific enough to say exactly what it is. Since this rumor, I have been checking the Oregon building permits page, and I finally found something for a high power car charging station, but it doesn't say whether it's Electrify America or Tesla or some other company. I have emailed the company, asking if they can tell me that detail of whose kind of station they will be installing. I'll create a new thread for it once I can get an answer to title the thread with what brand of station it is, whether Supercharger or something else.

Anyway, here is the permit. The description of the project says "Car Charging Station, located behind the Chamber building - 3 phase 480V"

Accela Citizen Access

That looks like a pretty tight spot. If it's a supercharger it won't be larger than 8 spaces and even that basically takes up all the parking in the lot behind that building. I assume that location doesn't see much traffic, but if there are a handful of employee's they might get the ok to park in a few spots blocking superchargers. (Mostly wouldn't be an issue except for on busy holiday travel days or something)

That's also not that ideal of a location. There's a coffee shop a block away that closes at 3pm and a Deli across the street that closes at 4pm. I would actually rather have it down the road a bit near the high school where there's a McDonald's and Subway (both open at least till 9pm) and grocery store open till 10pm. This would match up with the Ontario supercharger and allow travel between Bend and Ontario... but at 130 miles for each segment it would be a decent charging stop (30+ minutes) with not much within walking distance... especially if you were there on a Sunday afternoon or any evening...